Posts by konceptual99

146

Just woke up turn TV on to hear yet another nut case with a gun.

by Still Totally ADD in

jw
friends

first they said 20 dead with 100 injured.

now i just heard 50 dead and 200 injured.

whatever it is it just another nut case who was able to get a high power gun to kill people.

konceptual99

Here we go. Statistics... we can argue over these for months....

Agreed that statistics can prove anything but however you slice and dice it the US has significantly more guns per head of population and more gun related homicides than any European country

For some example figures see here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

Here in the UK the only times I am likely to encounter a firearm in a public place is if there is an armed police officer. Yes I will find shotguns at a clay shooting club, I could join a gun club and shoot various weapons etc. but even then I would never encounter a semi or fully automatic weapon.

The US is unique amongst most nations in North America and Europe in terms of the likelihood of being close to someone carrying a gun in public. Even in countries with higher levels of gun ownership like Seribia or Sweden the type of weapons will generally be orientated to hunting, highly controlled in public and assault weapons very hard to come across for the average citizen.

For example, if you take a legally owned air rifle out in public not in a suitable case then you are not only breaking the law, you risk being shot by armed police. In the US you see private militia armed with semi-automatic weapons involved in situations that would typically be the domain of the police. I get these guys are acting legally but it's a very different culture to other places and fosters an attitude that anyone within reason is perfectly sound to bear such weapons.

So far I have not seen a report detailing the type of weapon used here. Everyone seems to think it was automatic, and not legal. What does that imply? In other words, there are limits. Yet, this ass hole got around them. The limits didn't matter.

Agreed, but if someone wanted to go on a shooting rampage here they would struggle to get hold of a suitable weapon and ammo unless they were well connected in the criminal underworld. If this scumbag had only had relatively easy access to handguns then there is no way he could have done what he did.

Granted he might have hijacked a semi and trailer with his handgun and ploughed into the crowds but as I was saying, just because evil will always try and find a way it doesn't mean that society should not try and do what it can.

Responsibility for the Vegas shooting lies directly on the shoulders of shooter. It does not fall on the second amendment or "nutters". I do agree there should be a discussion.

Agreed. The NRA or anyone else in the gun lobby is not directly responsible and of course no sane person condones what this guy did. Knee jerk legislation will not work but if the will of the American people is to prevent these events from happening, minimise the risk and scale of attacks then there has to be dialogue. Perhaps there is legislation that could help. I would say there has to be a cultural change and that can only come from within the community of people that most cherish the right to bear arms, IMHO it is only when those who wish to have the right to own any quantity of whatever they like start to put the rights of the nation as a whole to be safer that a real cultural shift will happen.

In any case, I still appreciate your post, so I +1ed it.

+1 to you as well

92

Does Morality Exist?

by Fisherman in

some people believe that stealing, lying and killing, is not moral.

some people don't.. does morality exist?

if so, prove it..

konceptual99

Please explain things to me in simple concrete terms versus abstract concepts and illustrations, doing so will help me understand faster.

I seem to remember Sam, aka Kate Wild, approaching debate in exactly the same way.

28

October 2, 2017 BOE US Re: Contributions Received at the 2017 Annual Meeting

by wifibandit in

october 2, 2017 to all bodies of elders in the united states branch territory re: contributions received at the 2017 annual meeting.

konceptual99

So a congregation has the "privilege" of hosting an event that has to be displayed on video screens yet has to stump up the readies if they need to hire some kit in.

Thanks for nothing Warwick.

146

Just woke up turn TV on to hear yet another nut case with a gun.

by Still Totally ADD in

jw
friends

first they said 20 dead with 100 injured.

now i just heard 50 dead and 200 injured.

whatever it is it just another nut case who was able to get a high power gun to kill people.

konceptual99

Whilst there are lots of grey areas around gun ownership there is a simple reality. Every year thousands of people die as a result of gun related incidents in the US, far more than per capita than most other countries, especially if you look at moderate democratic countries in Europe.

If nothing changes in the way America approaches gun ownership either legislatively or culturally then America will have to accept that incidents like Columbine, Sandy Hook, Orlando, Virgina Tech and Las Vegas etc are going to continue to happen. By accepting that the incidents will happen then by implication you are accepting that this is the price to be paid for maintaining the gun culture that exists.

I am not advocating changing laws for the sake of it, especially when the root problems for a specific crime may lie outside of what can be legislated (e.g. mental health or criminal activity for example). I understand that for those determined to do something then the law is no deterrent. I also understand that removing guns does not remove the threat of death through some other criminal and violent act.

What I don't understand is the apparent lack of will to formulate some kind of change. Those like the NRA simply throw the same arguments out that absolve anyone with a gun of any responsibility. Politicians can do nothing due to the gun lobby. Those representing the so called responsible gun owning citizens want to maintain a position where there is no restriction to the type, quantity and capability of weapon available.

Just because the problem is complex does not mean those with a vested interest cannot even try to work things out to have some positive effect on it. From what I can see, everytime something like Vegas happens the gun lobby put their hands over their ears and shout "lalalalalalala nothing to do with us". Change is formulated through discussion, compromise and a willingness to accept responsibility where responsibility is due. This seems totally lacking in how the gun lobby approach the problem.

As for the argument that citizens need assault rifles cos the bad guys have them.... that's what the police and army are for.

146

Just woke up turn TV on to hear yet another nut case with a gun.

by Still Totally ADD in

jw
friends

first they said 20 dead with 100 injured.

now i just heard 50 dead and 200 injured.

whatever it is it just another nut case who was able to get a high power gun to kill people.

konceptual99

Jeff,

I don't think knee jerk reactions would work and I am under no illusions that even if all guns were banned there would not be a significant time for the access to weapons to really decrease but I don't think that is an argument to do nothing and accept the status quo.

I do think that properly restricting access to assult rifles and automatic weapons would be a start. There really is no reason for your average citizen to own them.

What really needs to change however is the culture of gun ownership as a right over all other rights. Just because nutters can appropriate many everyday objects to kill and main does not mean that you do feck all about those devices designed to do that job.

Sometimes we have to accept that reducing the risk of harm to innocents by a very small minority of evil doers does mean that the large number of responsible people have to have their rights and opportunities constrained.

23

Crisis of conscience

by Ponyo in

does anyone know where i can buy coc for under $50?

.

konceptual99

That's the good will gone then I see

23

BREAKING NEWS out of Canada

by Newly Enlightened in

jwvictims.org has another breaking news article out of canada: https://jwvictims.org/2017/10/02/breaking-news-66-million-class-action-suit-request-filed-against-jws-in-canada/.

konceptual99

Sad to say but I think this will go on for years and even if a verdict does come in the favour of the victims (after numerous appeals) then the numbers will probably not be anywhere near the $66m. Would I also be right in assuming that the plaintiffs would have to pay legal bills as well or would Canadian law put that responsibility on the WTS?

22

"The shootings in Las Vegas show how much we need God's Kingdom"

by Sour Grapes in

my jw wife, like all of us, was saddened by the senseless killings in nevada.

she said, "the shootings just shows how much we need god's kingdom.

" i replied, "yes if it was armageddon, jehovah wouldn't have left any survivors.

konceptual99

TBH STADD, in my experience Witnesses will be falling over themselves to say they knew her, know someone who knows her and putting posts onto social media in their droves.

[EDIT] or saying they once went to Las Vegas

146

Just woke up turn TV on to hear yet another nut case with a gun.

by Still Totally ADD in

jw
friends

first they said 20 dead with 100 injured.

now i just heard 50 dead and 200 injured.

whatever it is it just another nut case who was able to get a high power gun to kill people.

konceptual99

Everyone at the festival could have been armed and it would have made no difference since the shooter was not easily visible.

Whilst evil people will always find a way of creating havoc I fail to see why this should be used as an argument to do nothing. Some of the same people who are basically saying that restricting access to weapons is pointless and an infringement of their rights to arm themselves like they are their own personal army are the same people prepared to take what Sadiq Khan said about being cognisant of terrorism in modern cities and twist it to make him seem like an apologist for jihad. They are the same people who would happily demonise a whole population and restrict the rights of innocents for the supposed sake of the greater good.

What is sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. If fighting Islamist terrorism requires restrictions and actions that tread on some supposed rights to ensure that the rest of us can be safer in our towns and cities then why is the right of people to attend school, work or some event in safety trumped by the rights of those who have some need to walk around carrying a small arsenal just to go and buy some milk.

Just to be clear - I don't have an objection to people owning guns even simply for the pleasure of owning it. I am not under some illusion that people in the US can just go and buy any gun anywhere. I know that many gun owners are responsible people who don't have a pathological need to carry arms to make themselves seem hard.

I do, however, find it simply amazing that the US is so unwilling to try and make their streets safer, with the answer seemingly to be a constant proliferation of arms. The bad guys have guns so give the police bigger guns. The police and bad guys have bigger guns so the average citizen feels they need a bigger gun to be safe. This not to mention the local militias that exist where the government and local authorities seem happy to have self appointed armies with their own leadership wandering around pretending they are the police and army. I suppose even these guys have some credibility and structure when compared to those conspiracy theorists building shelters, making their own enclaves for when the government goes to pot.

The underbelly of latent violent potential in the US is frightening. The seeming unwillingness/inability to acknowledge and tackle this is even more so.

23

Crisis of conscience

by Ponyo in

does anyone know where i can buy coc for under $50?

.

konceptual99

Does anyone have an update on an official reprint or PDF? The CP website has not had an update for over a year.

There was a lot of goodwill on here towards respecting the efforts of those who took on the copyright after the deaths of the Franzs. Does anyone keep in touch with them and know if anything is likely to happen on this front? If not then it's inevitable that the publication will continue to be distributed electronically without CP approval.