Posts by Orthodox1

51

Is America Evil?

by Orthodox1 in

jw
friends

slavery... racisim... corporate greed... atom bombs used against civilians... 53 million aborted... a debt to be paid by generations yet to be born... an oubreak of child-offenders in public schools.... does anyone think america is evil?

or, does she have evil elements that ruin her brand as a great nation?.

**because i have been accused of all kinds of things, let me tell you my full agenda here: i am roman catholic.

Orthodox1

rather be in hades:

the idea that morality is universal is stupid.

some cultures found it acceptable for young girls to be married off

some cultures found it acceptable for young boys to be in relationships with older men

homosexuality was acceptable for some cultures

human sacrifices

cannibalism?

So we shouldn't judge any of the above that you listed, because morality is relative? So, some people in the Catholic Church, who do grave evil (pedophile priests, murderers, etc.), should not be judged under your relativistic standard, making you a hypocrite in your judgments against them.... My head is spinning.

Here again we come to the conclusion that you, and people like you, will give a free pass to those you wish, and throw stones at those you wish. I, though, recognize evil, or immorality, anywhere it can be found, even in my beautiful Church and in myself, and I hate it (but not the people who partake in the evil or immorality, because these things we are all capable of). I can make the distinction between the person and the wickedness. Relativism is a perverted way of rationalizing bad behavior for the sake of the person instead of condemning bad behavior for love of the person, as you see in Christianity.

306

I Believe Catholicism And Its Trappings Are Silly, Strange & Weird!!!

by minimus in

jw
friends

my italian friend loves going to the "feasts" that occur in italy, boston or nyc.

these feasts feature a "saint" with dollar bills pinned around her and they parade the saint in a long procession and chant "viva (whomever)".

they are quite serious about this and are proud to talk about the past generations of observers who appreciated the events.

Orthodox1

Isidore,

You speak truth to deaf ears. I use to hate the Catholic Church when I was an atheist. Then, as a Baptist, I hated the Catholic Church because I learned a few things from other Protestants to support my own bigotry.

Faith is a grace, a gift by God. Unfortunately, there isn't much we can do to convince people on here to look past what they think they know, or what they prefer to know, to seek truth always and everywhere, no matter where it leads.

If all were open to truth, in its wholeness, instead of preferring their half-truths that they learned or were given, all would be Catholic.

Keep up the great, factual, truthful, work, Isidore.

...wait for it... wait for it... (rather be in hades is going to say something about me wanting to be persecuted, just wait) ;) God love him.

51

Is America Evil?

by Orthodox1 in

jw
friends

slavery... racisim... corporate greed... atom bombs used against civilians... 53 million aborted... a debt to be paid by generations yet to be born... an oubreak of child-offenders in public schools.... does anyone think america is evil?

or, does she have evil elements that ruin her brand as a great nation?.

**because i have been accused of all kinds of things, let me tell you my full agenda here: i am roman catholic.

Orthodox1

Sent you my site Apostatethunder. I hope you like and I encourage you to chime in whenever you like to teach me a thing or two. God bless, friend!

51

Is America Evil?

by Orthodox1 in

jw
friends

slavery... racisim... corporate greed... atom bombs used against civilians... 53 million aborted... a debt to be paid by generations yet to be born... an oubreak of child-offenders in public schools.... does anyone think america is evil?

or, does she have evil elements that ruin her brand as a great nation?.

**because i have been accused of all kinds of things, let me tell you my full agenda here: i am roman catholic.

Orthodox1

I find it so fascinating how hard I work to show quotes from scripture, the early Church Fathers, historical statistics, etc., and my opponents use Wikipedia...

King Solomen, who says this:

You clearly have never studied cultural anthropology, and hence are unaware of the morality of hunter-gatherer tribal cultures, such as the classic Yanomomo tribe in the Amazon, where murder and tribal warfare is common:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yanomami

..I reply: since you are a higher authority on Cultural Anthropology, why not cite some cultural anthropology literature instead of Wikipedia? I've written many papers during my college years and since, and if I used Wikipedia as a primary source, I would have been laughed out of the classroom, and would be fired from my current profession. My goodness.

Your idea of the hunter-gatherer culture is Darwinian, which again, is an idiology, but not based on factual evidence. Why would one tribe try to murder or commit war against another? Is it law, which they all come together to agree upon, or, is it distraction and an injury to the murdered? These tribes do not agree to warfare, they are IN warfare. And why? For survival, yes. To safeguard their wives, children, and land? Ah! The instinct to protect! Where has this instinct to protect one's life and property come from? Why be injured at all when seeing your wife axed down if she is only matter of relativism? Why love children?

A waring tribe can be murderous and agree that murder is good, but the same tribe might as well decide that no fingers is good. Does this then make them right, even relative to the rest of the world? How absurd! No! It would make them disabled! And yes, I can make that judgment by simply asking the fingerless to catch a ball, proving my point.

Relativism is the last defense for men who have lost the argument against God, and instead of submitting to God, he reclines in his own pride and ego and says, "it's all relative", and denies any judgment that might be brought down hard onto his head. He would say to our Blessed Lord, "What is truth?" as Pilate asked.

Relativism can never bring about peace, only war. If 7 billion people thought that burning one man alive was not immoral or evil, the whole world would be on fire.

That is all. ;)

51

Is America Evil?

by Orthodox1 in

jw
friends

slavery... racisim... corporate greed... atom bombs used against civilians... 53 million aborted... a debt to be paid by generations yet to be born... an oubreak of child-offenders in public schools.... does anyone think america is evil?

or, does she have evil elements that ruin her brand as a great nation?.

**because i have been accused of all kinds of things, let me tell you my full agenda here: i am roman catholic.

Orthodox1

51

Is America Evil?

by Orthodox1 in

jw
friends

slavery... racisim... corporate greed... atom bombs used against civilians... 53 million aborted... a debt to be paid by generations yet to be born... an oubreak of child-offenders in public schools.... does anyone think america is evil?

or, does she have evil elements that ruin her brand as a great nation?.

**because i have been accused of all kinds of things, let me tell you my full agenda here: i am roman catholic.

Orthodox1

rather be in hades says:

point one finger and 3 point right back at you...

"Do not judge others, and you will not be judged"

- some nameless dude, from way back in the day

wise words to live by though. if only if only...

Christians are nowhere told not to judge, but since you think you know my Lord's words so well, lets see them in context:

‘Do not judge, so that you may not be judged. 2 For with the judgement you make you will be judged, and the measure you give will be the measure you get. 3 Why do you see the speck in your neighbour’s * eye, but do not notice the log in your own eye? 4 Or how can you say to your neighbour, * “Let me take the speck out of your eye”, while the log is in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your neighbour’s * eye. (Matt 7:1)

Interesting, yes? That, we should first judge ourselves and correct ourselves before we judge and and correct our neighbor. RBIH, please only comment on what you know. I don't pretend to be righteous, and I don't go around calling everyone sinners, because yes, I would have to point the finger at myself as well, so please don't accuse me of things you know nothing about and keep to the topic if your dislike for me allows you.

Joe, you said:

But in relation to your stance (cf. other threads) - and again, this is a personal opinion, I believe that the Roman Catholic church, directed as it is by a single 'infallible' leader, is the closest thing I can conceive of as an 'evil influence' on the world over many centuries. More than any individual country or state, so far, and its influence continues.

What evidence do you have for this? Atheism in the 20th century, which I have chronicled with facts in previous forums (Hitler: 12 million, Stalin: 48+ million, America's abortions of 53 million, etc.) how atheism in one century has killed more people around the world than all religions throughout all the world.

The Catholic Church instituted the University system of college. A Franciscan Catholic created the scientific method. The Knights of Columbus cares for the sick and widowed. The Saint Vincent de Paul Society cares for the poor. The monestary system has preserved historical records and artifacts.

Read the Catechism of the Catholic Church and find out what she believes instead of judging her on the actions of some her members. This is the point I am trying to make about America. I believe it is ignorant to judge a body, whether a nation or a religion because of some of their believers instead of what they actually espouse and profess as faith. Go here and learn a few things, then we can discuss what you might disagree with the Church about: http://old.usccb.org/catechism/text/

...this is post #10, so I will catch you all later!

51

Is America Evil?

by Orthodox1 in

jw
friends

slavery... racisim... corporate greed... atom bombs used against civilians... 53 million aborted... a debt to be paid by generations yet to be born... an oubreak of child-offenders in public schools.... does anyone think america is evil?

or, does she have evil elements that ruin her brand as a great nation?.

**because i have been accused of all kinds of things, let me tell you my full agenda here: i am roman catholic.

Orthodox1

Not even close. The US is a great place to live and raise a family.

http://hdr.undp.org/en/data/explorer/ The US is the medium-size red bubble, red indicating it ranks pretty high on the Human Development Index (HDI).

Check out "A Walk Across America" by Peter Jenkins, whose personal observations wiped out his disillusionment.

Now, I am biased of course. I think Canada is even better.

You had me agreeing with you until the end! But, I admit I don't know enough about Canada...

51

Is America Evil?

by Orthodox1 in

jw
friends

slavery... racisim... corporate greed... atom bombs used against civilians... 53 million aborted... a debt to be paid by generations yet to be born... an oubreak of child-offenders in public schools.... does anyone think america is evil?

or, does she have evil elements that ruin her brand as a great nation?.

**because i have been accused of all kinds of things, let me tell you my full agenda here: i am roman catholic.

Orthodox1

King Solomon,

It should be obvious that no action is intrinsically 'evil', as the term is a judgment based on RELATIVE (not absolute) definitions and values.

Isn't that just your opinion based on relativism?.. The idea that all moral concepts are relative to the individual is an ideology based on an absence of God and morality (which is not provable but requires a sort of faith), which goes contrary to the world-wide agreement on fundamental human laws we all tend toward, even the non-religious. All would say murder is wrong, for instance, even without God's revelations through religion. This belief is coded in our very DNA.

The idea that morality is relative to the individual, when deep jungle societies have similar commandments as the Judeo-Christian word, is not a likely or new or reasonable idea.

Regarding the differences in definition of a country and a religion, I do not make much distinctions here, but only compare one large body with agreed-upon principals with another large body of agreed-upon principals. We can easily destinguish between religion and country all day long, but that is not my point. My intention here is to point out that there is "evil", or if you prefer "societal contrarians" among us who do not speak for the entire body, but only speak for their evil, or misconduct within the parameters of agreed-upon principals.

If the Church says murder is wrong, and one murders, the individual is wrong, not the Church. If some Americans owned slaves, they would be wrong, contrary to the "life, liberty, and persuit of happiness" promised to all who were "created equal", but America herself would not wrong.

306

I Believe Catholicism And Its Trappings Are Silly, Strange & Weird!!!

by minimus in

jw
friends

my italian friend loves going to the "feasts" that occur in italy, boston or nyc.

these feasts feature a "saint" with dollar bills pinned around her and they parade the saint in a long procession and chant "viva (whomever)".

they are quite serious about this and are proud to talk about the past generations of observers who appreciated the events.

Orthodox1

Nope, searching for intelligent life, but starting to think Curiosity has better odds on Mars!

51

Is America Evil?

by Orthodox1 in

jw
friends

slavery... racisim... corporate greed... atom bombs used against civilians... 53 million aborted... a debt to be paid by generations yet to be born... an oubreak of child-offenders in public schools.... does anyone think america is evil?

or, does she have evil elements that ruin her brand as a great nation?.

**because i have been accused of all kinds of things, let me tell you my full agenda here: i am roman catholic.

Orthodox1

Slavery... Racisim... Corporate greed... Atom bombs used against civilians... 53 million aborted... A debt to be paid by generations yet to be born... An oubreak of child-offenders in public schools...

Does anyone think America is evil? Or, does she have evil elements that ruin her brand as a great nation?

**Because I have been accused of all kinds of things, let me tell you my full agenda here: I am Roman Catholic. The Church has been accused of everything but the common cold (but how can we truly know they didn't create it!!), and I am trying to get people to come around to the truth, that there is evil in all elements of society, religion, organizations, nations, etc., just as there are good in all of these. I am of the opinion that America is not evil, but has elements in her that undermine her, just as the Catholic Church (and most religions for that matter, including the JWs) stuggle with the same thing.**

I would like to avoid criticizing each other's religions and non-religions. I don't hope to convert anybody. I only want us to discuss America and our opinions about where she has been and where she is going, etc....Thoughts?