Posts by Marbles

20

Governing body member has nervous breakdown due to bethel workload

by Witness 007 in

karl klien life story from the watchtower.. "president rutherford had repeated occasions to reprove me for breaking some rule.

(under president knorr 1950) brother knorr invited me to join the writing department...when i told him it did not matter where i served he reproved me..saying when an added privilege is offered we should be eager to accept it...my attitude was due to my health which has always been a problem.

knorr was older we were like brothers with the older brother knorr prone to expressing inpatients to my short comings.

Marbles

@SlimBoyFat, oh that's very interesting, thanks.

"Escape from Freedom is the US title and The Fear of Freedom is the UK title."

33

Blood Transfusions & Flood, Questions from Bible student only

by Marbles in

i was never a jdubb, only a bible student.

there are two main questions i have.

let me preface that by saying that i do not believe the bible is true, or the word of god.

Marbles

@Fisherman, I am wondering if you think the OT as Christians are in possession of it, is a complete, comprehensive guide? In other words, are there many missing elements to it, such as oral tradition and commentary on it that prevent Christians from fully grasping its meaning? Also, if you could answer another question, how do you think Christians came to be in possession of the OT in the first place, since this is sacred to Jewish people only and I assume was preserved in their Temples? Do you think this material was gained when the Temple(s) were raided and made desolate?

Yes, I'm familiar that some people, even some Jewish people, believe the holocaust was "God's punishment." I don't worship a God like that, so I guess that makes me an "atheist," as defined by the Bible. I don't think either the holocaust OR the atomic bomb were "God's will." There's more emphasis on the holocaust than the atomic bomb, and I don't think there should be.

Anyway, I am just trying to get some clarity on why blood transfusions are considered "eating blood" when eating blood, in my opinion, refers to non-Kosher meat. Surely JWs eat non-kosher meat? Not all JW's are vegans? They don't have a problem with non kosher meat but they have a problem with blood transfusions? Makes no sense. The digestive system, and the cardiovascular system or two almost entirely different systems. The digestive system basically nourishes the organs. The cardiovascular system basically brings oxygen to the organs (and creates antibodies to fight infection, and other functions not limited to providing the organs with oxygen). Blood cells can become mal formed to the point of not being sufficient to bring sufficient oxygen, and a blood transfusion helps remedy that process, thus being an aid in treating cancer. As I see it, a blood transfusion does not have anything to do with "eating blood."

16

Do we really need this many prayers in a day?

by RULES & REGULATIONS in

there’s no proof that prayers have any effect whatsoever, other than perhaps giving the person who prays a false sense of having done something.

all claims that prayers have been answered are either anecdotal, fraudulent, delusional or are the result of either pure coincidence or confirmation bias.. how many prayers do you need in a day?.

you get up and eat breakfast...you pray for another day of life.

Marbles

I learned in my World Religions Class in College that religion relies heavily on "ritual," or routine. Someone might "make the connection" that something positive happened to them while they were wearing a Number Three Jersey, so now, anytime something important needs to get done, like filing papers for a loan, etc., they wear their "lucky jersey." Routine brings a sense of existential security, so a person might say things like, "I feed the dogs at 5:30 a.m., have my coffee, and watch the news, every day religiously."

33

Blood Transfusions & Flood, Questions from Bible student only

by Marbles in

i was never a jdubb, only a bible student.

there are two main questions i have.

let me preface that by saying that i do not believe the bible is true, or the word of god.

Marbles

@Fisherman, okay, I had to Google all of that, and will research it. Thank God for Google! Like a new Renaissance.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

Marbles

Only a Judge can Order someone to pay money. Lloyd is not the Judge in his own case. The only thing that is happening so far is a dispute, and a third party, the Judge, will mediate the dispute, if it ever gets that far. Any mention of "criminal behavior" by either party, including claims of "extortion," is not correct unless a Prosecutor has reviewed the case (District Attorney in the U.S.) and is willing to file and press criminal charges. Extortion in the criminal sense usually involves threats of violence. Not defending LE, but there is a lot of misinformation going around about how the legal system works (in the U.S.).
1. First step for complaining party is to send a "Cease and Desist" letter (LE's letter did not have this heading).
2. If parties continue to make videos in dispute, the next step is to file a Personal Injury Lawsuit for Defamation, Libel, Slander, and serve a copy of this Complaint to all parties. Email is usually not a sufficient means to send notice to parties at this point. Use certified mail. Parties will then be aware of the specific complaints against them and will be given a certain time period (like 60 days) to file what is called an Answer.
3. Parties filing an Answer will list all affirmative defenses, such as the facts, proof that they are telling the TRUTH, substantiated by LE's own video.
4. Parties filing an Answer may also submit signed affidavits (sworn statements on a form called a Declaration, which may easily downloaded in pdf format) by their own You Tube subscribers as witnesses to this fiasco.
5. Judge reviews both the Complaint and Answer and supporting evidence like affidavits and makes a Judgment. If Judge thinks defamation, etc. has in fact occurred, he may Order a monetary amount to be paid. Plaintiff (person filing the Complaint) has to specify costs of Attorneys, and usually actual damages, which are the real monetary damages lost, and other damages, like punitive damages, or intentional infliction of emotional distress, only if all the paper work is filled out correctly and all procedures and rules of court are followed. Rules of Court can be extreme, to the point of how many inches there can be between a two hole punch, and inches of margins.
6. Then Lloyd has to collect the money- which is a whole 'nother issue. The burden is on him to collect.

So, first of all, good luck getting a Prosecutor to file criminal charges here. Likely not going to happen. Paperwork is just not fun. Second, good luck collecting on any money awards even if they are granted by the Judge.

That's just a brief summary of how the case might legitimately proceed. This is why most reasonable people hate law suits.

33

Blood Transfusions & Flood, Questions from Bible student only

by Marbles in

i was never a jdubb, only a bible student.

there are two main questions i have.

let me preface that by saying that i do not believe the bible is true, or the word of god.

Marbles

Hello. I was never a JDubb, only a Bible student. There are two main questions I have. Let me preface that by saying that I do not believe the Bible is true, or the Word of God. I don't identify as an atheist, but sway more toward agnosticism (I know that I don't know a lot). I really like reading and listening to ex JDubbs because there is a lot of insight into post-JW-doctrine that can only be had by people who have been forced to study the Bible so much and who had the courage to come out of this authoritarian group.

First question is about "eating blood." This is what I think the "real" meaning is. The real meaning is not that a blood transfusion is the equivalent of "eating blood." The real meaning of "eating blood" is the Orthodox Jewish people are required to only eat Kosher meat. One method of making meat Kosher is letting it sit in Kosher salt and draining the blood. See link below. Any other interpretation than this obvious interpretation is just crazy to me! Can anyone argue this understanding that eating blood simply refers to Kosher meat? From article below: "Jewish law prohibits the consumption of the lifeblood of the animal." (See soaking, salting and labeling section in article below).
Making Kosher Meat - Grow & Behold (growandbehold.com)

The second question I have is, since everyone except Noah and his family was supposedly wiped out by the flood, didn't that wipe out all the people contaminated with Adam & Eve's sin? If so, how did all the wickedness start happening again? Why did Jesus have to come as a ransom for Adam & Eve's sin if everyone was killed in the flood? None of this makes any sense to me at all, so this is just one of many reasons I never became a JDubb. Incidentally, not all animals are considered "kosher." Does the Bible say anything about Noah saving kosher animals only? If so, why not? If anyone has any insight into these issues I would like to hear them. My understanding is that the Jewish Rabbis who wrote the OT envisioned a world where only Jewish people who followed the OT prescriptions would be "saved." And no, I don't believe the holocaust was "God's punishment" for "disobedience. Thanks.

20

Governing body member has nervous breakdown due to bethel workload

by Witness 007 in

karl klien life story from the watchtower.. "president rutherford had repeated occasions to reprove me for breaking some rule.

(under president knorr 1950) brother knorr invited me to join the writing department...when i told him it did not matter where i served he reproved me..saying when an added privilege is offered we should be eager to accept it...my attitude was due to my health which has always been a problem.

knorr was older we were like brothers with the older brother knorr prone to expressing inpatients to my short comings.

Marbles

@SlimBoyFat, I am reading the link you posted with the mention of Erich Fromm, thanks. I am one third through it. I believe the link you posted is not his book, though, which is titled Escape From Freedom. The reference to Fromm in your article is from a monograph he published titled, "The Fear of Freedom." The monograph has a slightly different thesis than the one I mentioned. In the monograph he says that people find "freedom" in totalitarianism because it "frees" them from the fear of ambiguity in secular democracies. People find "liberation" in obeying a dictator because they find security in absolutes, and insecurity in the ambiguities of democracy. From the Fromm discussion in your article, one would almost think the entire Watchtower Dogma was set up exactly to create security in totalitarianism versus insecurity in democracy.

15

Watchtower publication says in Paradise we will fly around like Superman!!

by Witness 007 in

golden age aug 25th 1926 p.751 "negative gravitation...you may have wondered how accidents will be avoided in christ's kingdom, since we are told nothing will hurt or destroy.

scientist tell us there is enough atomic energy in one finger nail to propell a battleship.

the people of the future may carry some of this power with them.

Marbles

"isaiah 40:31 promises that humans will rise with wings like eagles, soaring on slopes and thermals."

Oh JOY!

But what does Isaiah say about plane crashes? *crickets*

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

Marbles

There are a few different reddit threads. I am not sure which one lececiafox is a mod for and I just don't feel like going back to reddit to look. This is NOT the first time I have seen reddit support "the bad guy" and censor any criticism. I used to participate on family annihilator Chris Watts reddit discussion groups. There was a reddit group of CW defenders and no one was allowed to criticize them AT ALL. We were told it would cause a "sub war." So the CW discussion group was limited to relatively vanilla comments about the case instead of being allowed to confront his "supporters." I have to assume reddit "ranks" the posters- and if you have published a book like LE has, and are trying to promote your channel and business on reddit like he is, then he has higher rank and can shut down the discussion.

27

How many of you remember the "Pioneer Shuffle " and the special "time reporting" of pioneers?

by Foolednomore in

jw
friends

i started pioneering in my late teens an remember how slow pioneers would walk to the doors while out in circus.

also, they would not really talk to anybody at all.

they would start their time as soon as they got dressed an out the door, while us regular shucks started our time at the first door we knocked at.

Marbles

Fooled No More- he's the "neighborhood millionaire." His yard is just over grown with weeds and brambles. All the heavy equipment is stored in a massive warehouse that only a millionaire could afford- same with the heavy equipment in there, I am sure. So the heavy equipment isn't the eye sore, although the warehouse is inappropriate for a forest landscape. What is really an eyesore is that this dude who believes men were given dominion over the earth, and that the dominion will one day reach the level of giving them the freedom to create a paradise on earth, has an over grown mess of sweet peas and black berries and fallen branches and un-raked leaves piling up everywhere. I guess he can't start cleaning up his yard until God kills off all his neighbors. It all just reinforces my idea that the JWs are nothing more than a corporate land developing and construction company.