Posts by Phoebe

15

Shocking Example of JW Elder Corruption

by Roger Kirkpatrick in

let's play a game of believe it or not, shall we?

i'll relate a story, and you decide whether you believe it or not.

what would you think of an elder who told his daughter's fiance that he would kill him if he ever did anything to hurt his daughter?

Phoebe

...and it doesn't surprise me in the least to see elders conveniently keeping things quiet. I can think of at least 3 incidents in my former congregation of where elders or their children committed serious sins that were merely swept under the table and never mentioned, including an elder getting another elders wife pregnant, an elder's son thieving from work and having an affair with an older woman......just swept under the carpet - go figure.

19

Conventions

by Holden Caufield in

what did you make of the conventions i used to dread them.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6bhlhtbaos.

Phoebe

The long 8 days conventions were awful. The Wembly Stadium convention stanlivedeath was at was horrible.

My poor mum was trying to cope with us kids, because were camping on land the WT had organised for us. No hot water to wash. Cooking on a camping stove. We were in a big field with other tents and the rows had names, I think ours was Salvation Row or something. The chemical toilets they provided couldn't cope and some brothers came along and emptied them into the river!

It really wasn't so bad when I was a teenager because conventions/assemblies were our ONLY social life. It's where you met other teenagers and swapped addresses and wrote to each other. We'd spend weeks beforehand planning and sewing our conventions outfits. Basically, looking back, it was where everyone went husband/wife shopping.

Then we discovered volunteering, that was brilliant because you got to escape listening to the talks. We spent hours in the kitchens making sandwiches. One convention I sliced tomatoes for 3 days solid.We never heard a word of the talks!

When I took my own kids, especially as babies, I realised how awful it had been for my mum. Trying to get small children to sit still, it was impossible and plain stupid. I usually ended up leaving early. Last time we went as a family, before my husband left it, we took the kids home at lunch time. It was an amazing feeling driving away.

I think conventions/assemblies are absolutely dreadful, As an adult, I didn't know one person who actually looked forward to them. After my husband left the WT, I found it impossible to go to the conventions because I had no one to go with and not one person in my cong would help me. One year, an elder's wife, shouted at me in the hall 'you'll have to answer to Jehovah for not going' she yelled at me in front of everyone.

I am so glad I'm out of it all. It took over 60 years but wow, I'm finally free of it.

21

Certain JWs

by Holden Caufield in

do you ever miss jw's as an ex jw..

Phoebe

No,

The friends I thought I had....none of them were true friends. I don't miss any one of them.

70

The Reasons for Cart Witnessing

by Simon in

whatever we think of it, you have to admit that it's quite "genius".. the door to door ministry as done in western developed countries where the jw quirky religion has probably reached their saturation level was a complete and utter waste of time in terms of the effort expended to recruit people.. at the same time, it was rarely something that anyone enjoyed which led to people being labelled as inactive, being pressured to doing more and maybe ultimately deciding jwism wasn't for them and leaving.. there was also the issue that many jws are actually pretty bad at knowing and articulating their beliefs so were pretty incapable of getting any meaningful message across.. they solved all this with the cart witnessing.

the real point isn't to recruit, it's to make life easier for jws.

now they can stand and chat with their friend, have a coffee, not talk to anyone or make eye contact and still act as a walking billboard for jw.org.

Phoebe

Before I left, the carts were just for the pioneers/elders and the chosen few like elder's wives or the elder's wives mates.

A lot of the ordinary brothers and sisters are still just going door to door.

17

'Serving where the need is greater' - who does it benefit?

by eyeslice2 in

jw
friends

we have recently been in asia on vacation, travelling to a number of countries in this part of the world.

whilst in thailand, my wife, totally pimo, wanted to go to the english speaking convention in bangkok.

although i haven't been active for a very long time, i went along with her.. the first thing that slightly surprised me was the attendance, well over 900. i hadn't expected that many but they were from all over the country, which is a pretty big place.

Phoebe

Over the years we've had loads of people move to where I live because it's a lovely place where holidaymakers come. We don't need them as the population is very small but still they come and we call it 'serve where the place is nice'

13

My brother is shunning me (but he's not a Witness)

by john.prestor in

i didn't know where to post this but it's been on my mind and i'm looking for support and advice from people who know what it's like being shunned.

i was raised in a fundamentalist baptist church, so what i'm experiencing is a little different than most posters on this site.

i've been out of that church for years, and my brother's been out for a while too.

Phoebe

john.prestor

was it a plasma grenade? The ones that stick to you?

I'm may be old but I'm still down with the kids (do people even still say that??)

I'd just leave him be. You've done all you can.

My sister (uber JW..who thinks she sits on left hand side of God) hasn't spoken to me for 27 years and has never met my youngest. Apparently I was never good enough to be a witness, so she said anyway.

I reached out many times to her but to no avail. In the end I realised she was just toxic and my life was better without her in it. They say blood is thicker than water but so is custard (do you have custard n your country??)

Anyway, just get on with your life. It's his loss if he doesn't make it up with you.

58

Two witness rule: who cares?

by _Morpheus in

i find people railing against the so called “two witness rule” puzzling.

i think its a complete and total non issue.

for those that protest, argue or advocate for change in that rule, why?

Phoebe

This thread is making me upset because I've been there. I know what it's like to be dragged from a bed and sexually abused at 5 years old. I know the feelings that made a 10 year old me want to commit suicide.

Rattigan350

I don't think many women or men for that matter would relate embarrassing details of abuse for the sole purpose of running a man/woman's life and reputation. To even consider making up such a thing would take a very sick and vindictive individual indeed. Have you any idea how awful it is to have to tell someone what happened...in detail? Who would want to make that up? But sadly,very rarely it does happen.

But who are we going to protect? Say, we won't believe you because you might be telling lies? and we wouldn't want to ruin that elder's reputation, would we? You know, just in case you are lying...

Did you see that documentary about Romy Maple. When she went to an elder along with another girl to report their abuse and thought as there was two of them they would be believed. The elder slammed his fist on the table and called them liars.

When that happens, you feel, well, who IS going to believe me? Even if you could you probably wouldn't call the police because you've already been called a liar so you think the police won't believe you, either.

So you suffer in silence.

The two witness rule protects the abuser. End of.

Morpheus

It's not irrelevant. It should be. But it's not.

Going off this now, it's just too upsetting. :(

58

Two witness rule: who cares?

by _Morpheus in

i find people railing against the so called “two witness rule” puzzling.

i think its a complete and total non issue.

for those that protest, argue or advocate for change in that rule, why?

Phoebe

Morpheus.

You say, just report to the police. Yes, everyone should, but often it's not that easy.

You are often bullied into NOT reporting it to the police. Sometimes people are threatened. Read all the child abuse accounts or listen or them on YouTube. How many didn't report it because they were put under extreme pressure not to? How many were threatened by the elders?

In my case, the crime happened in a different country to where I now live and it happened many years ago so I couldn't go to the police. I've battled with the damage it did to me for decades and when finally I spoke out I was treated so badly by the elders in my congregation...it was shocking how badly I was treated.

Clearly they contacted the branch and being as my abuser is an elder and former temp C.O. with lots of friends in the right places I was told by the elders 'Your word against his. Nothing we can do.' Two witness rule.

They didn't want to know. I was ignored. After summoning up the courage to finally speak out I was brushed aside as if I was a waste of their time. It was like being abused all over again.

Yes, you are right. Report to the people. Definitely. But spare some compassion for people who just are not able to do that.

That's why they need to change it. That's why people protest.

58

Two witness rule: who cares?

by _Morpheus in

i find people railing against the so called “two witness rule” puzzling.

i think its a complete and total non issue.

for those that protest, argue or advocate for change in that rule, why?

Phoebe

Why?

Because people like me cannot get justice within the organization as a result of that stupid rule.

Because it's devastating when an elder says to you 'it's your word against his, nothing we can do.'

Because no one will listen to you.

That's one of the reasons I left but many can't. That's why we want change.

27

My story

by Leeny in

i came across this website when i was looking for some emotional/mental support lately as i was summoned by elders to explain someone’s report on me saying “i’m promoting homosexuality”.

i’m inactive, not attending meetings or associating with jw outside of my biological family for almost 2 years now.. yes i am gay (you can judge away) and yes it is in a direct contrast to the scriptures, no arguement about it.. i was brought up in a jw family.

my dad is a typical zealot, he literally talks or thinks about the bible 24/7.

Phoebe

Hi Leeny,

hello and welcome. I've found this forum a safe haven so never feel you are alone. There is a wealth of experience here and you will get so much support from everyone.

You have woken up early that is wonderful. Go live your life and be happy!

XXX