oldskool

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Posts by oldskool

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  70

  Witness Carts - A Vehicle for Significant Decline

  by slimboyfat in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i was stalking to a jw today about her recent experience on the carts and with being a jw generally.

  until this conversation i considered the carts as just an ineffective preaching method and a harmless waste of time.

  but now i wonder if the effect of the carts might be to produce noticeable decline in jw numbers.

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  oldskool

  Also star witnessing is genius. Thanks for that doc
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  70

  Witness Carts - A Vehicle for Significant Decline

  by slimboyfat in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i was stalking to a jw today about her recent experience on the carts and with being a jw generally.

  until this conversation i considered the carts as just an ineffective preaching method and a harmless waste of time.

  but now i wonder if the effect of the carts might be to produce noticeable decline in jw numbers.

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  oldskool

  Even bigger point. With post 75 through the current era the "preaching work" (if you can call it work) has become more and more defined by a lack of contact with the public.

  Through early 00s lack of contact became the norm within the org. We're talking 3 decades of people that made it a comfortable, not too confrontational, weekly routine.

  Short of a major internal cultural shift, I see no avenue for the JWs to increase the quality of outreach they do.

  So again, i think its a response to their go nowhere state of affairs.
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  70

  Witness Carts - A Vehicle for Significant Decline

  by slimboyfat in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i was stalking to a jw today about her recent experience on the carts and with being a jw generally.

  until this conversation i considered the carts as just an ineffective preaching method and a harmless waste of time.

  but now i wonder if the effect of the carts might be to produce noticeable decline in jw numbers.

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  oldskool

  I would tend to believe the WTS thought cart witnesses would actually be effective, and that when it comes to their own bs they can be that naive.

  My experience in the US was similar to what most on this board say. That pre internet there was little contact with householders. The JWs response? Put carts in public places where there are people.

  Ok in cities possibly, lousy in suburbs and rural.

  JWs have conditioned the public to not want to talk to them. Easy to forget, but JWs have been around for the entire past century in the USA, much of it with door to door work. They defined the crazy person who wants to talk religion. Most avoid it, because they defined it well as something to be avoided.

  JWs will meet defeat wherever they go. The message is outdated and has no relevancy. I think the cart stuff is an inclination how little they actually understand people.
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  147

  Challenge to Creationists

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  in response to the 37 threads in my evolution is a fact series - see bottom of op for links - perry posted a link to an article "44 reasons why evolution isn't true".. i offered him a challenge on the thread and by pm.

  predictably he is totally ignoring it, so i am offering the challenge to any evolution-denier who thinks they have evidence to support their position.. please present one specific piece of evidence for creationism.. my task will be to refute it with evidence within 24 hours.. then i will present one piece of evidence for evolution and your challenge will be the same.. all posts must be as succinct as reasonably possible.

  entirely in your own words, without copy-paste, videos or links.. please post your interest to take part and we will set it up before the first actual post in the exchange.

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  oldskool

  
  
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  42

  Feeling Sad After Uncovering TTATT

  by pale.emperor in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  my initial pangs of unease and doubt led me to research some things.

  well, a lot of things really.

  i've never felt comfortable using the bible to try to calculate dates (1914).

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  oldskool

  Make a list of things you've always wanted to do for yourself, and do them.

  What I wrote on this thread might be some help. I was in your exact same situation when I left.

  https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/5125313847623680/keeping-your-sanity-while-stuck-active-jw
  

  Based on what you've written its seems clear you are in the early phases of understanding what happened to you. It takes a while to go through it all. If you haven't caught up on Steven Hassan's material, now might be the time to do so.

  Base your approach to your wife not around doctrine, but around empathy. It's easy to trigger JWs in to fear, and then they act more irrational than usual. Empathize with her, be a good husband. It will work out but take your time. You're not in a battle, your in a process. It's easy to get worked up about the moment. I had good success thinking beyond the day to day.
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  21

  Could we use the new shunning guidelines to our advantage?

  by Island Man in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  according to new, officially published guidelines, jws can now shun a person who has not been disfellowshipped from the congregation.

  i see this guideline being abused by many jws who have an axe to grind with a fellow jw.

  for example, let's say sister peinindiass rubs sister sensitive the wrong way.

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  oldskool

  Nothing new. I feel the latest info demonstrates the JW org appears interested in decreasing the chances for faders.

  With so much talk about fading on the net, its no big surprise.
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  8

  Has any of the GB members ever had a job?

  by Crazyguy in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  just wonder since that video about a child giving up his dreams of being a great musician do to competition .

  i had to give up all my dreams and now work in a very competitive industry just to get by.

  how many people not work in a competitive job?

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  oldskool

  • Samuel Herd began pioneering around the age of 23. By 1965, seven years later, he was in the CO/DO work. Room for odds jobs as a young guy, but no serious career.
  • Stephen Lett was 17 when he started to pioneer and 18 when he went to Bethel. Doubt there was much real world work.
  • David Spaine was 19 when he started to pioneer in 63'. Around 65/66' he attended gilead's 42nd class. Early 20's, not much career again.
  • Gerrit Losch Began pioneering at 20. His bio says he worked at a restaurant. In 63 started with CO/DO work.
  • Anthony Morris III had a more conventional life and probably had a career but his bio doesn't say what. He served in Vietnam. Got married in 1971 and raised children.
  • Mark Sanderson began to pioneer in 1983 and went to MTS in 1990. I cannot locate a date of birth for him, one reference says 1965. That means he was 18 as a pioneer. With the MTS, he probably was doing odd jobs. His bio doesn't say he is married or has kids
  • Geoffrey Jackson started pioneering at age 15 in Tasmania. He spent most of his time as a missionary.
    
    The common theme is that with the exception of Morris, most of these men got involved full time with the JWs full time from their teens to early 20s and never looked back. By their mid 20s most had scored an "assignment", probably organizationally supposed during the boom years of the 60s, 70s, and 80s.
    
    I find it interesting. I knew a guy whose situation was similar to Sanderson. Remained single, attended MTS in the late 90s early 2k. I think he continues to work lousy part time gigs with the hope he will get a better assignment, but he never has. He was assigned to a congregation about an hour from the one where he grew up and has remained there the past 10+ years.
    
    I know for a while he was trying to go to Gilead with his wife, who he married about 5 years post MTS. He really wanted to work at a branch, which he described to me as "resort like". Freudian slip!
    
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  12

  Article: Witnesses Portfolio ‘Better Maintained Than The White House.’

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  https://www.bisnow.com/new-york/news/commercial-real-estate/what-makes-the-jehovahs-witnesses-portfolio-special-and-what-the-latest-property-to-hit-the-market-could-become-60632 .

  “i’ve never seen any properties kept in better shape,” tim says.

  “anyone who buys them will be happy that they did and they won’t need to spend a dime on upgrades to infrastructure.” tim, who tells us he attended a breakfast at the white house about a decade ago, goes as far as to say the buildings are better maintained than the presidential residence..

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  oldskool

  Barbara, you might be able to confirm/refute a rumor I heard years ago. Basically, that the WTS expected all of their real estate to transition into the new system after Armageddon. I always assumed this might be JW leader's mental excuse for why they focused on real estate investment so much. It was as if the rebuilding work had already begun, in their minds anyway.

  The destruction of Kingdom Halls during the great tribulation and Armageddon has never been mentioned inside WT literature, has it?
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  14

  The more things change, the more they stay the same

  by OutsiderLookingIn in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  oldskool wrote on another post that "the 'truth' is an experience, and the 'beliefs' are designed to get you to behave as a member of the experience.

  " i've read a lot here about the many changes to the wtbts in recent years.

  but this got me thinking about the practices or, for the most part, non-practices that make someone a jw.

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  oldskool

  Misery loves company.

  agreed
  
  
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  14

  The more things change, the more they stay the same

  by OutsiderLookingIn in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  oldskool wrote on another post that "the 'truth' is an experience, and the 'beliefs' are designed to get you to behave as a member of the experience.

  " i've read a lot here about the many changes to the wtbts in recent years.

  but this got me thinking about the practices or, for the most part, non-practices that make someone a jw.

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  oldskool

  I had an interesting conversation with somebody who faded from the group that was faced with requests from active ones to "please come back, we miss you".

  First point, this person hasn't moved, and is still available to these Witnesses. Simply a phone call away. Access is not the problem.

  Since none of these people have reached out personally, and because JWs have no group sponsored social functions, we know they do not miss genuine friendship or social activity in any conventional sense.
  

  So what exactly did these people miss?

  They missed the person actively participating in group sponsored function. The group does not worship using ritual, lots of song, or other more worship/praise oriented activities. Instead, they sit through hours of group teaching sessions.

  Now bring it all together. What these folks really were saying is that "we miss you sitting through the teaching sessions with us". And also "We missed you publicly demonstrating your dedication to the group". Just think of the words JWs use so often:

  - Dedication

  - Imitate

  - Be Like

  The group experience is to emulate whatever is "current" with the organization. Part of the groups experience is to actually anticipate what new changes there will be that people need to emulate, or "imitate".