ozziepost
I’m thinking we should be seeing some familiar faces joining our thread pretty soon. 😉
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Are you referring to the mighty scholar?
scholar JW
scholar
JoinedPosts by scholar
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540
Simple Question Re 1914
by Slidin Fast inwt claims that satan was thrown out of heaven in october 1914 precipitating ww!
and the end times.
a small problem with that is ww1 started on july 28th 1914 whilst satan was still in heaven picking his nose.. how did we not see this and waste years of precious life?
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How To Talk About Interpretation With Jehovah's Witnesses.
by Vanderhoven7 inthis from my book: good news for jehovah's witnesses.
before we discuss any doctrinal issues, i would like to distinguish between what i believe is proper versus improper interpretive practice.... so you know what i can accept as biblical and what i can't accept.. basic guidelines for validating doctrinal claims`).
i. there must be at least one scriptural reference that can be cited for support of any doctrinal claim or position.. ii.
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Vanderhoven 7
Thanks for your encouragement Blondie. From there in, "Good News... " I go to the the invisible eschatological foundations for the Watchtower authority... and ask them how they know that the apostle Peter was raised in the spring of 1918, Christendom's churches were rejected in the fall of 1918 and Jesus chose Bible Student leaders in Brooklyn New York, who knew nothing about their appointment, to be his Faithful Slave in 1919?
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In my examination of this subject, I have developed the expression for such significant, prophetic events of the years 1914, 1918 and 1919 as an eschatological triennium. Such a crucial period of modern history and that of the only true Christian Church describes the relevance and impact of the end of the Gentile Times, the birth of God's Kingdom and the heavenly resurrection of the Saints or Holy Ones.
Enjoy!!
scholar JW
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17
How To Talk About Interpretation With Jehovah's Witnesses.
by Vanderhoven7 inthis from my book: good news for jehovah's witnesses.
before we discuss any doctrinal issues, i would like to distinguish between what i believe is proper versus improper interpretive practice.... so you know what i can accept as biblical and what i can't accept.. basic guidelines for validating doctrinal claims`).
i. there must be at least one scriptural reference that can be cited for support of any doctrinal claim or position.. ii.
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scholar
Vanderhoven 7
The subject of Interpretation especially the methodology employed by Jehovah's Witnesses - the eschatological church is rather challenging and of particular interest to me. Interpretation lies properly in the field of Hermeneutics and the two basic methods are as you have noted are exegesis and eisegesis. Exegesis of a particular text or passage is usually found in scholarly journals, theses or dissertations and not in WT publications and other Bible commentaries. Eisegesis is not common and usually not favoured by scholars but is practised to a great extent in WT publications and I have no issue with this fact for various books of the Bible can only be properly understood by means of eisegesis alone. Examples of such Bible books which demand eisegesis would be for the OT, the Prophetic literature such as Daniel, Ezekiel etc and for the NT, Revelation.
WT publications provide guidelines for its readers in how to read and understand the Bible and these principles are similar to that of other teachers in Christendom such as Charles Swingoll in his Searching the Scriptures,2009 wherein the basic steps are:
1. Observing the Text
2. Interpreting the Text
3. Correlating the Text
4. Applying the Text
The Bible is a book of literature that consists of several different genres thus different methods or styles of interpretation are required and in the case of the Prophetic genre, eisegesis is the only 'tool in the shed' so to speak and as the eschatological church foretold in Revelation, especially in the case of the 'trumpet blasts' this tool in addition to the revelation by Holy Spirit' succeeds in unlocking the sacred mysteries then proclaimed to peoples worldwide.
scholar JW
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134
How far do we get away from 1914
by PimoElder inhow far do we get away from 1914 before they have a new light and admit it was all wrong?.
they cling to the old theory of the 77 week prophecy from the wrong date that jerusalem was destroyed .
with the overlapping generations nonsense still we are getting too far away from 1914. what will they say if we get to the 2030s and they still cling to 1914?.
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scholar
After all this time, don’t you think we should meet and acknowledge we can be friends ?
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Absolutely but unfortunately I have moved to Brisbane some 9 years ago and I miss my sojourn into Moore Theological Library where I enjoyed doing research and of course as an alumni of the University of Sydney I miss the proximity to that venerable institute of higher learning. My late wife use to own a terrace house in Eveleigh Street, Redfern during the Ghetto period so it was only a short walk to those two institutions. Anyway if we cannot meet personally then we can either meet on zoom or by telephone.
scholar JW
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134
How far do we get away from 1914
by PimoElder inhow far do we get away from 1914 before they have a new light and admit it was all wrong?.
they cling to the old theory of the 77 week prophecy from the wrong date that jerusalem was destroyed .
with the overlapping generations nonsense still we are getting too far away from 1914. what will they say if we get to the 2030s and they still cling to 1914?.
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waton
wt sch: there is a big difference between being on the watch, and repeatedly aggressively jumping the gun and trying to provoke the deity to fulfill the promise to "bind in heaven what has been bound on earth" (by wt writers) claiming divine guidance on hidden biblical messages. pointing to years, even hours of fulfillment, ( The october 1914 last supper in Brooklyn
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Your comment is ridiculous. You are either on the watch or not by being asleep. One cannot accuse JW's of being asleep, drowsy or lazy for as an organization they have obeyed the Master by continuously preaching the Gospel and Keeping on the Watch.
scholar JW
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134
How far do we get away from 1914
by PimoElder inhow far do we get away from 1914 before they have a new light and admit it was all wrong?.
they cling to the old theory of the 77 week prophecy from the wrong date that jerusalem was destroyed .
with the overlapping generations nonsense still we are getting too far away from 1914. what will they say if we get to the 2030s and they still cling to 1914?.
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Sea Breeze
FYI, All Christians (pre-millennial) teach the gospel of a literal Kingdom headed by Jesus. Churches call this the Millennium Reign. As a scholar, surely you are aware that the gospel of the kingdom is a strong minority compared to the various gospels taught in the NT.
Gospel of Jesus Christ (or Christ ) – 12 times
Gospel of God – 7 times
Gospel of the kingdom – 4 times
Gospel of peace – 2 times
Gospel of the grace of God – 1 time
Gospel of your salvation – 1 time
Gospel of the uncircumcision – 1 time
Gospel of the circumcision – 1 time
Gospel of his Son – 1 time
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With your analysis of the term 'Gospel',, What then is the Gospel?
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During the Church Age (Age of Grace) Christians were to preach the gospel of grace-Jesus-God-salvation. Paull described this as the ministry of reconciliation. He did not preach the gospel of the kingdom... that is for a future time, as it is for us as well.
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During the Church Age of the First Century, Christians then living were Christ's Ambassadors who carried out a ministry of reconciliation - 2 Cor.5:18 and preach the Gospel as a message of the reconciliation - 2 Cor. 5:19. The Gospel is a message of reconciliation preached not only in the First Century but also during the Last Days by the new, restored Eschatological Church which now preaches the Gospel' the good news of God's Kingdom by His Winesses.
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Surely, you would agree that JW's do not preach a ministry of grace or reconciliation like Paul. This is because the WT has convinced them that the dispensation of Grace is already over with....too late. Not so. It is still going on.
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False, JW's most certainly preach the only Gospel which of course is a message of reconciliation as an expression of God's Grace or undeserved kindness to all men of goodwill.
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.The Good News of the Kingdom will primarily be preached during the Great Tribulation as the Age of Grace comes to a close and the birth of God's Kingdom will replace the beastly Anti-Christ World rule.
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It is only Jehovah's Witnesses who are carrying the proclamation of the Gospel- good news to the Kingdom.
scholar JW
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134
How far do we get away from 1914
by PimoElder inhow far do we get away from 1914 before they have a new light and admit it was all wrong?.
they cling to the old theory of the 77 week prophecy from the wrong date that jerusalem was destroyed .
with the overlapping generations nonsense still we are getting too far away from 1914. what will they say if we get to the 2030s and they still cling to 1914?.
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scholar
waton
schjw, are you calling wt inc a truly end time church? a true church ? with errors piled up since 1914 when they proclaimed that they would go to heaven, the world ending? the ancients fiasco in 1925? the "superior authority" mess 1929 ~ 1960 ?
feel sorry for the families that will be laid further astray to add to that 100% failure record including their failed 1914 predictions-
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What can be said despite our record of failed predictions is that we have heeded the Lord's admonition to 'Keep on the Watch' unlike Christendom which has failed to recognize or herald God's Kingdom.
scholar JW
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134
How far do we get away from 1914
by PimoElder inhow far do we get away from 1914 before they have a new light and admit it was all wrong?.
they cling to the old theory of the 77 week prophecy from the wrong date that jerusalem was destroyed .
with the overlapping generations nonsense still we are getting too far away from 1914. what will they say if we get to the 2030s and they still cling to 1914?.
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ozziepost
the important ‘label’ is to be known as a christian. They happen to attend a particular church but unlike JWs they don’t see themselves in a separate religion (or even the “true christians” ) because of the particular church or denomination they attend.
let’s return to that then, they see themselves as christians who happen to attend an anglican church
-- Your comment is simply too fuzzy. Perhaps you can define what is a Christian or what does it mean to be Christian and how is such presented in the Anglican Church?
scholar JW
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134
How far do we get away from 1914
by PimoElder inhow far do we get away from 1914 before they have a new light and admit it was all wrong?.
they cling to the old theory of the 77 week prophecy from the wrong date that jerusalem was destroyed .
with the overlapping generations nonsense still we are getting too far away from 1914. what will they say if we get to the 2030s and they still cling to 1914?.
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ozziepost
The people I’ve met in churches describe themselves as christians who attend an anglican church.
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Are you saying that it is only in the Anglican church there are Christians?
scholar JW
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134
How far do we get away from 1914
by PimoElder inhow far do we get away from 1914 before they have a new light and admit it was all wrong?.
they cling to the old theory of the 77 week prophecy from the wrong date that jerusalem was destroyed .
with the overlapping generations nonsense still we are getting too far away from 1914. what will they say if we get to the 2030s and they still cling to 1914?.
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scholar
ozziepost
Wasn’t the church born at Pentecost ?
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Only the Holy Apostolic Church which was not the Anglican Church I am afraid with a smile on scholar's face.
scholar JW