Posts by seven006

77

Conditional love

by noidea in

jw
friends

being raised a jw sometimes you feel you only know conditional love.

you are only loved if you tow the line.

i only have one thing to say,.

seven006

JJs,

Im in an uncharacteristically foul mood today and my spell checker and I are in the mood to kick a little butt.
I'm sure I will go back to my nice guy mode tomorrow.

Dave

107

FATAL ASSUMPTIONS

by You Know in

jw
friends

jesus further related in the 15th chapter of john: "nevertheless, i have spoken these things to you that, when the hour for them arrives, you may remember i told them to you.

these things, however, i did not tell you at first, because i was with you.

so, the point is that jesus has not told his anointed ones certain things yet because the hour for them has not arrived.

Just because you are a lonely pathetic man and have no one in your little religion who want's to listen to your rambling on like a mad man doesn't mean any one here wants to see you crawl up on your soap box and fulfill your dream of becoming an evangelist. Why don't you write your redundant speeches and then go outside and gather all the neighborhood pets together and preach to them. Tell them how they are all bad little doggies and kitties and that sniffing each others butts will not allow them to inherit the kingdom of god. You can read scripture after scripture to them on the subject of fornication and
how they must get married in the eyes of god to be able to do it doggy style on your front lawn. Your continued need for psychological strokes is getting very tiring. Yes we know you can read your bible and yes we know you are a lonely little man and yes we know you think we are all bad little boys and girls but you have gone way past the broken record state and are now stepping into the realm of being psychopathically dangerous. Go crawl back into your hole. It was nice to have a little vacation from you.

Doggies and kitties of the internet, run like hell, You Knows back!

Does anyone else find it strange that my buddy Duns walks out the door and Mr. Know it All immediately steps in? Duns, is this you?
I sure hope not.

Dave

77

Conditional love

by noidea in

jw
friends

being raised a jw sometimes you feel you only know conditional love.

you are only loved if you tow the line.

i only have one thing to say,.

seven006

Real Elder,

The fact that you come here to try and understand what happens to a JW after they are given the ax is commendable if that is your real purpose. If your recently gained insights are exclusively for the use of helping those that are still in the organization then again your efforts in that specific regard are commendable. Helping is helping no matter what your specific agenda is and it should be applauded. BUT, at what cost are you willing to continue this walk on the dark side? Besides setting yourself up to look like the most understanding and compassionate elder in all of JWdom what exactly do you think is
in it for all us poor unfortunate exJW's? Do you think by your comments given to us by a voice on the other side of the fence is going to bring us any comfort or ease the pain we have endured through the years wondering if our mommys and daddys still love us? Do you think your one single scrap of perceived compassion is going to change one tiny little thing in the world of absolute watchtower control? Do you think any of us are going to have one single speck of joy contemplating a thought that there is at least one little elder that just might understand our feelings and may possibly go a bit lighter on one of his little sheep the next time they take a tiny step over the line?

You said you would tell someone's mother to go see her disfellowshipped daughter while she is in the hospital. That is quite kind of you handing out a hall pass like that. What about the other 364 days of the year? Do you immediately revert back to the watchtower societies tool of discipline at that point? Have you read one single thread on this board that you would have to say the poster deserves a life sentience of being exiled from the love of their mother and father? Have we committed such unconscionable crimes that we deserve to lay lifeless in a grave of psychological death cut off from our flesh and blood
loved ones because some grumpy old men decided we just might cause one of their robots to falter? If you really want to help your sheep take a deeper look at Bill and the Silent Lambs situation. There is a man who is helping.

My mom is dyeing and I have seen her three times in seventeen years thanks to the love and kindness of your beloved organization. When she does pass I am not even going to think about going to the funeral and have a group of pseudo compassionate men in JC Penny suits tell me where I can and can not sit. Your beloved organization has kidnapped my mothers love and held it for a ransom payable by me just by saying "I was wrong and you were right". Screw that and screw them! My only crime that condemned me to this state of being is saying I don't agree. If that is a crime to god then in my opinion there is no god. Do you honestly believe that all this misery and all this pain is just because a few million people want to continue to believe that a talking snake told a naked lady to eat a piece of fruit? Help your little sheep and sleep tonight knowing you try and be the best shepherd that you can be. Just don't fuck with our lives in the process and don't pretend for a second that you give a rats ass about any of us. I for one aint buying it.

Dave

Personal philosophies of life

by seven006 in

jw
friends

in another thread i made a few comments about what i thought on the subject matter and i then realized that only a few on this board know where i am coming from on my over all thoughts.

not that anyone cares but since i never really introduced myself a few mounts back when i started to post here i thought i would do a little bit of that now.. the following post was written about five years ago on an old email group (philia) some of you may have heard of.

it was the first exjw group i had come in contact with an it is also where i met my good friend alan f and his wife.

seven006

In another thread I made a few comments about what I thought on the subject matter and I then realized that only a few on this board know where I am coming from on my over all thoughts. Not that anyone cares but since I never really introduced myself a few mounts back when I started to post here I thought I would do a little bit of that now.
The following post was written about five years ago on an old email group (Philia) some of you may have heard of. It was the first exJW group I had come in contact with an it is also where I met my good friend Alan F and his wife. This little post was fairly well received and Randy Waters posted it on his site thinking it might help a few people.

Since I am slowly getting to know some of you by your posts here I was just curious to see if anyone else had their thoughts about their personal philosophy of life written down in a manner for all to read. With all the various personalities on this board I thought it might
be interesting to hear some of your personal views on this subject. I would love to read them and maybe get a better insight on what makes some of you tick. Mine is a little long but if you choose to read it and respond with your own I think this could be an interesting thread. Not being able to come to this site as much as I would like I'm sure something like this has already been done but I haven't seen it. If it has, if you could copy and paste your comments here again I would
appreciate it and I think it would make for some good reading.

Here is the five year old post on my personal philosophy of life and religion.

My thoughts

Whether it is out of a sense of need, payment for ones life, or mental well being, people seem to want answers on what, when, where and most important why. Why am I here, Why is everyone else here? Why am I the way I am? Why is there so many religions. Why doesn't everyone think just like me. Why, this why that?

These are questions that all religions claim to answer in there own profound way. As we learned as JWs, people find a religion that seems to fit their own personal comfort level. Such as they do. This comfort level is influenced by several different factors. By ones family heritage, one's cultural geography, or ones feeling a need for a belief in something bigger and more in control of everything or there has to be more to life than just living. Being able to ease ones conscious by laying one's troubles on another source that you truly believe in can help make for a great psychological cleansing. It can clear the mind of the perceived bad and help one move forward on to the justifiable good. It is the interpretation of the definition of good and bad and also who has the right to determine their absolute definition that is the basis for all religions.

If you can look at all religions in a bit of an abstract manner in that they are a product you can begin to see the similarities and the differences. Every religion wants you to buy their god and reap the reward of their interpretation of salvation. If your family and friends buy the same god you do then it makes you feel that maybe you have made the right purchase and your position within your own group is excepted as normal. You become comfortable in your purchase and you use the product in the manner the directions call for. Thus resulting in acceptance and love from those you are the closest to in thought and lifestyle. In some religions such as the protestant group of fine faith's you have variations of the same product, spicy, low fat, low salt, baked, fried and so on. All still the same basic product
but with slight variations to fit individual tastes. While all the old world biggies seem to have the same old rules and traditions that give the sense of structure that many people need in their lives.

We as Americans are cultural mutts. We are a mixture of many cultures and traditions that have been shook around and tossed on the table like dice. Our forefathers had been kicked out of every decent country in the world and thrown into the human stew we call America. With this we were given the freedom to think more for ourselves with out the tradition and cultural ritual that would have been handed down if our distant relatives would have played nice and stayed home. This gives us the potpourri of both traditional and designer religious products to choose from. We have the freedom to choose what groups definition of good and bad best fits our psychological comfort level that then spawns our own spirituality.

For myself I have gone through several levels of what I consider my own
search for spirituality. Not that I felt that I needed a replacement for the religion I had left but more in the fact that I wanted a few guide lines to find my own personal balance in life. Something that I felt might help me be a better person and find the real me, not the me that I was taught I should be. I looked more for a reasonable balance of what I thought was right and wrong more than what was good or bad.

For the first couple of years away from the Dubs spirituality was the
farthest thing from my mind. I had the resources to go out and enjoy life to the fullest. Running to the far end of my own balancing scale I
quickly learned what would define my own level of "what was wrong". What I was taught that the evil worldly people did, I thought I needed to do, so I did. I came to realize that the total pursuit of happiness was not trying to prove that I was a man in the macho sense of manhood but more of being just basically a good human being. I found that striving for fame and fortune did not make me happy and that it really made me feel quite uncomfortable. So were the Dubs right about worldly people? No, their view of what they called a worldly person and the vastness of grouping all non Dubs into this category was wrong.

After settling down and learning to no longer lie to myself I began to ask the question why. My biggest question came to be about my own being and what made up this person that lived and breathed within my own body that I really didn't know. Why was I the way I am? Why did I think and do things different than my friends? Why was I a bit different than my friends in that I could think my way in and out of any given situation faster and more creatively than they could? Why did things come so easy for me in solving problems in my business life but fall completely apart in my personal life? Why did I have an art talent that even being self taught shot me up to a substantial high level among my peers? Why did I have all this. Why me. Why not everyone. Was I a reincarnation of some famous person? Was I put on earth for some grand reason? Was I special and better than other people? Or was I just lucky and starting to become an arrogant jerk with illusions of granger? A few good friends and a $200 per hour psychologist all pointed to the later
conclusion.

All I knew was I had something and I had used it for my own benefit and
profit and, I was not happy. A good friend of mine who is the same age as I but years ahead of me on the life balancing scale saw that I was having problems trying to figure out the question "why". He told me to rent the movie The Razors Edge with Bill Murry. It was a remake of a movie made in the 40's. The original book was written by Sumerset Maughm and is a book about one man's search for the answer to the question "Why." I rented the movie and watched it five times in two days. In the story the death of a friend changes the course of a man's life. Because of questions raised by the death he begins a search in volumes of books written on spirituality. He travels to the heights of the would searching for the answer. He found it in these books, not what was necessarily written in them but but using them to burn
as he warmed himself and saved himself from freezing. Thus keeping himself alive, because that was his answer. Instead of continuing to ask the question of "why" he was alive he excepted the fact that he was alive and that life was precious and not to be wasted.

After gleaning the positive aspects of the story's message I went a little further and began to read various kinds of books on subjects such as philosophy, psychology, eastern religious thought, physics, astrophysics, and a little bit of quantum mechanics. My brain started to hurt by the time I got to Stephen Hawking's A Brief History of Time. What a trip. Having a life long battle with dyslexia it took me several years to read all these possible explanations for the answer to the question of "why" and the best thing I could come up with is one simple conclusion, "just be good".

My mind came to be a lot more at ease and my guide lines for my life became more defined. It began with a movie about a man's search for spirituality and in the end he found it within himself. Not a church, religion, philosophical thought, scientific research, or any aw-inspiring message found in any book. Just a simple fact that you are alive and the meaning to life is, life itself. All you can do is just try and be the best person that you possibly can and pay back in your own way what you have been given. Who and how you pay is up to you and what you choose to believe.

In other words balance your own scale. Where ever you are stationed on the life scale try and keep an equal balance. Those with the the largest talents and gifts and sit at the further ends of the scale must pay back an equal amount to maintain the balance. They also may have to endure the toughest load to maintain that balance. Those that set closer to the center point of the scale still have to balance the other end. They may not have the level of highs that thrill those with more of what life has to offer but they in return have less of a job to stay balanced. Where ever you sit, you are not any better or worse then others that sit in different places on the scale. Being balanced is the goal, it is the reward that will bring you happiness. I personally have tried to position myself a lot closer in from the edge then where I use to be. The highs are not as thrilling but the ease in the task of keeping balance is a far better compensation to me. I try to pay
back for my talents by keeping my door open to any young artist that has the desire to learn what I have to teach. My sharp mind is paid back with my humor that makes people laugh along with my compassion and understanding for those struggling to jump the hurdles of everyday life.

My spirituality is in the balance of my life and how I react to, and treat my fellow living creatures on this planet while not being governed by any group or religion. My relationship with any higher power is based on a "let's see how I did when it's all over basis." If there is a heaven or hell, if there is any kind of here after I guess I will find out when I either get there or I don't. If there is a judgment of bad or good I hope my being the best human I can
be will be the basis for that judgment. If my refusal to choose a religious product is the deciding factor on my forever after doom than so be it.

I choose to be a good person because I feel it's the right thing to do, not because of any threat of destruction or eternal damnation. Nor is it for brownie points from some higher source. I don't need a group of people to think or believe the way I do to think I am going in the right direction for me. I just would like them to respect my thinking as I do theirs. I have come to these conclusions in my life because it helps me be me. It helps me be a good father, and a good friend to others. It helps me keep a high level of love and trust among my small circle of friends and family. It helps me meet new friends and share laughter and a kind of brotherhood with other human beings. It helps me continue to get up every morning and deal with the massive amount of different challenges I have to figure out every day. It helps me keep
an open mind to different thoughts and philosophies which enables me to fit a few more pieces of the puzzle together that is my life. Everyone has to find their own answers. If it's a religion that gives you peace and makes you a better person then practice it or go find it. If it is reaching a life long dream that makes you happy then go obtain it. If its just being the best person that you can and being happy with who you are then just do it.

This is my philosophy on life, this way of thinking has helped me realize that I am a very simple person living in a very complicated world. It is what gets me up in the morning and puts a smile on my face. My thoughts are certainly not right for most people, but again, they are not meant to be. They work for me and they have helped me find my balance and my happiness.

Be good.

Dave

44

Monomaniacal Ex-JWs?

by dunsscot in

jw
friends

its been a while since i read stephen r. covey's _the 7 habits of highly effective people_ and i do not feel like looking up the section i am getting ready to mention.

but i think i recall covey talking about the unhealthy habit of becoming overly engrossed in one activity or pursuit.. it seems that there are individuals using this medium of communication whose life's aim is to "help" jws out of the "borg" or 'bring down the tower.

if it tricks your trigger, i guess there is nothing anyone can do to prevent you from "helping" jws out of the "borg.

seven006

Tina,

Thank you for the kind words. I'm glad you liked it.

Big hug back at'ca woman

Dave

44

Monomaniacal Ex-JWs?

by dunsscot in

jw
friends

its been a while since i read stephen r. covey's _the 7 habits of highly effective people_ and i do not feel like looking up the section i am getting ready to mention.

but i think i recall covey talking about the unhealthy habit of becoming overly engrossed in one activity or pursuit.. it seems that there are individuals using this medium of communication whose life's aim is to "help" jws out of the "borg" or 'bring down the tower.

if it tricks your trigger, i guess there is nothing anyone can do to prevent you from "helping" jws out of the "borg.

seven006

Alan, did you call me a bad word? You bastard! See if I ever spend an entire week drinking expensive booze with you again!

BTW, I was right about the orgin of fractal mathematics and you were wrong. So take your Mit degree and shove it up you left nostril.

See you and the little woman this Christmas

Your exbuddy,

Dave

44

Monomaniacal Ex-JWs?

by dunsscot in

jw
friends

its been a while since i read stephen r. covey's _the 7 habits of highly effective people_ and i do not feel like looking up the section i am getting ready to mention.

but i think i recall covey talking about the unhealthy habit of becoming overly engrossed in one activity or pursuit.. it seems that there are individuals using this medium of communication whose life's aim is to "help" jws out of the "borg" or 'bring down the tower.

if it tricks your trigger, i guess there is nothing anyone can do to prevent you from "helping" jws out of the "borg.

seven006

Dan, you are correct in the assumption that I am not monomaniacal in my thinking. I try as much as I can to keep an open mind in just about any subject matter I choose to ponder. I also do not like to express my thoughts on subjects that might lead to repetitious banter on who's right or wrong. Since you dropped my name at the end of your post I guess I need to say a little bit about where I am coming from in regard to this subject.

First of all I am surprised that you made a blanket statement about the assumed drinking habits of every EXJW that participates on this board. Come on man, you are much smarter than that. Why do you make such an amateurish statement when trying to make your point? It devaluates any further arguments you try and present. You are also too smart to insult your intellect by making such a statement without looking from where you speak. The JW's are in my opinion are only equaled by the Mormons as monomaniacal thinkers. They do indeed reach the level of mental illness in their one sided
approach to life and what it's all about. You my friend are one of the few JW's that I have ever known that has taken a broader view of possible alternative thinking when trying to understand the possibilities of christian philosophy. You have to admit you are a rarity in such thinking in being a member of your religious group.

I must also point out that no one from this board as far as I know gets up on a Sunday morning or Thursday evening and walks onto the stage of a kingdom hall and tries to tell the entire congregation that they are wrong. I also haven't heard of anyone on this board going door to door trying to convince the general public that the teachings of the JW are wrong. I see no exJW's on street corners handing out literature proclaiming their dislike for the watchtower organization either. A few have picketed JW conventions but their numbers are but a microbe in comparison to the JW's and their duped JW wannabes that fill the seats inside the convention. I can go on and on with comparisons to monomaniacal thinking in regard to JW's and non JW's but I think you get the idea. The Silent Lambs group is not bringing out the religious philosophy of the religion but rather the attempt by its leaders to hide a life damaging problem with the idea that they will come off looking squeaky clean to not only the rank and file but to the general public. Their practice is wrong Dan and if you can't see that then you have wasted all those years in trying to better yourself with a higher education. Wrong is wrong!

As far as not having something to offer in return, you again insult you own intelligence with this comment. Just because most do not feel the need to replace black with white doesn't mean that we do not have a guide in our life or a goal to aspire to. I for one have a strong belief system. I believe in myself. I admit fault that I have and accept the consequences resulting in that fault without the need to side step my own responsibility by making the excuse "the devil made me do it." I equally accept the good that I do and use the positive cards I have been dealt to better my life and share the rewards with my family and friends. I do not need a god to praise for the good and a devil to excuse the bad. I take responsibility for my own actions. I also do not need an aging book of religious myth and philosophy to tell me I am not worth anything and it is a complete waste of my time to try and come to a few conclusions about life based upon my own ability to think and reason. I do indeed have an alternative to JW thinking. It is to live a life being as good of a person as I can without prejudging my fellow man based on his inability to think exactly as I do. I use this alternative way of thinking to remain open minded on subjects that the bible has no answers for. My favorite bible stumper is still the argument based on the "lifestyle unchoice" of those born as hermaphrodites. I have yet received a logical answer on this question and it has stumped many a so called Christian. But lets not get into that, I have lost my interest in ever getting a clear answer on that one.

It would be interesting to see if you could get away with expressing your knowledge of religious philosophers to aid you in giving a talk at the kingdom hall. Have you quoted the many authors and philosophers in a talk to your local congregation that you so widely use on this board? Have you added the thoughts of any one of them when commenting during a watchtower study or book study? Do you go outside of the authorized material when giving your sermon at the door while in service on Saturday mornings? Do you have the freedom of expression based on your outside education when it comes to preaching the good news of the watchtower society? Can you say you have not compromised your real thinking or found yourself justifying one single thought to try and keep your mind on the prize? I don't need a truthful answer given to me Dan, but I think you might think about answering these questions honestly to yourself. I quit the JW religion 17 years ago because I could no longer lie to myself.

Last but not least is the question of this board and the JW's that feel they need to ignore the orders of their religious leaders and continue to post here.
I'll give you a little scenario to ponder. Lets say their is a group of physically battered and mentally abused women meeting in a support group situation. The place they have available to them is a social club with a sign outside that says "men only." A man just happens upon the club and enters the door immediately seeing that the room is full of battered woman. He stands at the door and listens to the women speak of the abuse laid out to them by men and the disgust they have for the male population. Within a few minutes the man realizes what he has happened upon and has to make a decision. Does he exit the room and let the women continue in their expression of mutual support or does he start telling them they are all a bunch of wieners and just don't understand the real love that men have for them? What would be the smart thing to do here Dan? What would be the compassionate thing to do? If the man lashed out at the women and told them that they owe their miserable lives to men don't you think he would get a fairly heavy dose of negative responses? Don't you think it would be futile on his part to try and convince them that they are not battered but only selfish stupid women who do not understand men at all? Use your brain and your heart and get back to me on this one.

Yes, Dan, I do like you. I admire your intelligence. I just don't agree with your conclusions. I have no rule that says I cannot like you or talk to you. Can you honestly say you are free from a rule saying the same thing about me?

Take care, and I still want that drink.

Your buddy,

Dave

12

Dave and Fark

by dunsscot in

jw
friends

duns will holler at you guys later.

fark, keep your eyes open and your mind scopin'.

dave, please guard the bourbon for me.

seven006

Ya Duns,
I heard they are great to use in character assassinations.

Dave

12

Dave and Fark

by dunsscot in

jw
friends

duns will holler at you guys later.

fark, keep your eyes open and your mind scopin'.

dave, please guard the bourbon for me.

seven006

Waiting,

Never judge a book by it's cover or a comic by his jokes.

Dave

12

Dave and Fark

by dunsscot in

jw
friends

duns will holler at you guys later.

fark, keep your eyes open and your mind scopin'.

dave, please guard the bourbon for me.

seven006

Duns,

Get a clue man, I am the only one on this entire board that likes you and I only admit to that on saturdays and mondays. You must have pissed off the wrong person. I am a moderator on another board and as much as I hate to say it I would have aced your butt after your second post. Maybe it was a mistake. Maybe it has just been misplaced. Maybe god did it, ya never know man. Besides, you know better than to try and justify religious thought with logic and reasoning. Didn't you listen to anything Soren K. tried to teach you? For such an intelligent guy you sure can be dumb sometimes.

There is a power on this board that is beyond the ability of understanding by common man.

Later dude,

Dave

PS: Sorry Dan, but I don't pray, I guess you will just have to give up on me. I'm a lost cause.