this is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?
god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.
in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.
A lot of the religious excusing of god seems to be down to word play.
If you say "don't touch that Elf-on-the-shelf, if you do YOU'LL DIE!" then it is absolutely correct for someone else to say "no you won't", because ... no, you wouldn't.
If you rely on "ha, but I killed them anyway!" to stop it being a lie ... I think you have bigger ethical problems than lying.
God is a murderous piece of shit. And he also lied. Focusing on the lying is missing the more important elephant in the room.
i think someone else noticed this here recently.
i wondered when i signed on today july 9, 2024, that even the avatars were missing.
does simon know?
Avatars, Avatars, wherefore art thou Avatars?
this is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?
god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.
in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.
We are all under a death sentence
Why.
If you believe a story, the ransom has been paid, so why still the punishment?
At least make an effort into trying to make sense of it, or admit it's baloney, just don't trot out the tired platitudes and soundbites that are meaningless drivel.
this is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?
god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.
in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.
They were guilty as sin. So, they died, in accordance with the Law.
How could they sin when they didn't know what evil was and until they knew what it was?
Who decided and administered the law? Was it what you claim to be the "loving" god?
Sin and death entered the world because a decision was made NOT to believe God.
You claim sin entered the world through them eating the fruit ... yet there was one of gods perfect creatures totally able to use super-powers to deceive them apparently telling porkie pies and deceiving them. Seems like sin was already there and they were just collateral damage.
There's no way to spin it where gods hands don't come our dripping with blood, utterly incompetent, or a bit of both.
this is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?
god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.
in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.
Here you are pointing to what the snake said after the lie. He's good at this as you can see.
No, he said this is what would happen and it's exactly the same as what god says did happen.
Whatever the case, here immediately the snake responds with "you will not die".
And again, nothing in "eating the fruit" would / should have killer her. God decided to murder her for his own failure to prepare and protect them. He was a grade-A fuckup from the start, and continued to be a grade-A fuckup all through the book.
this is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?
god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.
in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.
The snake spoke the truth - that they would become like god and able to recognize good and evil and god confirmed this later saying "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil."
Which goes back the the previous point - if they were not able to recognize evil, it seems ... well, "evil" to hold them to account for something they weren't capable of doing, by his own design.
A bad builder blames his tools.
An evil builder blames his creation.
A psychopath blames and punishes them.
this is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?
god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.
in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.
"i wish i could take away all the pain you have ever felt"
Yeah, you can stick that religious twaddle where the sun don't shine (removed).
It's nothing todo with pain or being hurt, it's simple logic and reason. Sorry your holy book is badly written. It's what happens when goat herders write tall tales.
Next there will be talking bears and people riding fish like it's Narnia, before it switches to a super-hero-action-movie, then a rom-com-with-a-bit-of-murder before getting back to the classic redemption heroes tale.
this is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?
god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.
in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.
They are naive, uneducated and inexperienced. A five year-old child would be better prepared for life's challenges than Adam and Eve were. So, when faced with an obedience test is it any wonder that they failed at the first attempt?
Exactly. Even if you believe the story, it's a story of someone leaving his creation woefully unprepared for the concept of "deception". It's bad parenting for that alone (before you get to the "killing them" part).
this is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?
god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.
in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.
Ah, the old "how long is a day?". You can prove anything if you completely change the meaning of words.
It's like a killer defending themselves by saying "no, they died after I stabbed them, so it wasn't anything todo with me".
Did they die, according to the story? And did god 'cause their death, according to the story?
Yes, and yes, so he's a liar and a murderer. What kind of monster creates something and adds a blind loyalty test without providing any skills to defend themselves simply to torture them if they fail? And if he can see the future, then he did it knowing what would happen.
But hey, it enabled him to ... checks story ... also torture his own son to death later the in book. So that's nice. What a swell guy god is!
this is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?
god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.
in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.
Some would argue that is a WTS translation issue. Not all bibles say "on the same day".
"but God did say, ‘You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.’"
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%203&version=NIV
But the fundamental "you will die due to eating from that tree" was of course a lie. They died because god killed them for doing it which isn't the same thing. If a parent said "if you touch the elf-on-the-shelf you will die" no one would blame the touching of the elf-on-the-shelf for a child's death at the hands of an evil murderous psychopathic parent, that would be entirely on the killer. Imagine calling then a loving parent after that? Insane.
