Posts by Elephant

72

There's gotta be another faction in the Writing Department, either that or they can't see the irony.

by Theocratic Sedition in

jw
friends

the past two week's worth of wt studies have made a couple points that appear contradictory in nature.

yesterday was too much, i felt at least.

either there's another faction within the writing department fighting for the equivalent of airtime in the literature, or they're all so indoctrinated that they fail to see the irony in what they publish.. for instance, take paragraph 5 from last week's lesson.. 5. unlike the law codes of many countries, "the perfect law" is neither complex nor burdensome but consists of simple commandements and principles.

Elephant

jwfacts-

No agenda, just browsing the various interesting subjects. I admit I do enjoy being drawn into a good debate though.

Captain-

When its all I said I do appreciate you engaging with me on this subject. Now, I also understand that there is much opinion on this site (as you yourself admitted), as much as ‘facts’ are touted. I would imagine that is the case when we are discussing the subject of religions and orgs. So many aspects of these are subject to ‘opinion’ and that little word called faith.

There are a few facts to say the least, but your frustrations originate from the lack of palpable proof (or whatever you may be looking for) in regards to many elements of this particular religion. For ex, I cannot prove to you that the f&d slave is such, anymore than you cannot prove to me that it isn’t. It’s a matter of opinion and that little aforementioned word again.

On the subject of mind control…I could go as far as to give in a little on that argument only because you yourself have admitted that one can submit to mind control willingly. This happens in religions and outside of them. Take for example your marriage…it too has ‘rules’ and ‘consequences’ for not following them, right? if the lady cheats on you or vice versa I gather it won’t feel very good. But if you care enough you’ll follow the ‘rule’ and avoid the consequence. See? Now who invented such a rule and more importantly, why would you follow it willingly? Was it mind control? Could it be because your ideals and sense of self worth compels you to it? Possibly…

But the fact is you bought into the idea of marriage and you willingly follow its ‘rules’…until you decide its no longer worth it for you…same with any religion, you have a choice…

72

There's gotta be another faction in the Writing Department, either that or they can't see the irony.

by Theocratic Sedition in

jw
friends

the past two week's worth of wt studies have made a couple points that appear contradictory in nature.

yesterday was too much, i felt at least.

either there's another faction within the writing department fighting for the equivalent of airtime in the literature, or they're all so indoctrinated that they fail to see the irony in what they publish.. for instance, take paragraph 5 from last week's lesson.. 5. unlike the law codes of many countries, "the perfect law" is neither complex nor burdensome but consists of simple commandements and principles.

Elephant

yan...

you refer to the elders as though you were mortally afraid of them!

who are these elders, that carry so much power that you cannot possibly change your ideals?

its a 'religion', or a concentration camp??

72

There's gotta be another faction in the Writing Department, either that or they can't see the irony.

by Theocratic Sedition in

jw
friends

the past two week's worth of wt studies have made a couple points that appear contradictory in nature.

yesterday was too much, i felt at least.

either there's another faction within the writing department fighting for the equivalent of airtime in the literature, or they're all so indoctrinated that they fail to see the irony in what they publish.. for instance, take paragraph 5 from last week's lesson.. 5. unlike the law codes of many countries, "the perfect law" is neither complex nor burdensome but consists of simple commandements and principles.

Elephant

captain,

i asked the question assuming that that was the problem being argued against.

but there are some inconsistencies in your answer...

first you state that some want to be controlled while others dont even realize it...so, if some want to be controlled as you yourself have confirmed, then...what's the argument?

then you state that in fact everybody in the org IS controlled, while you then concede by your inclusion of the comment, that your wife disagrees with you...if she is in disagreement then...who to believe?

is it possible that ideals line up to the extent that we can relate to an org or any other entity and be just that, instead of...mind control?

72

There's gotta be another faction in the Writing Department, either that or they can't see the irony.

by Theocratic Sedition in

jw
friends

the past two week's worth of wt studies have made a couple points that appear contradictory in nature.

yesterday was too much, i felt at least.

either there's another faction within the writing department fighting for the equivalent of airtime in the literature, or they're all so indoctrinated that they fail to see the irony in what they publish.. for instance, take paragraph 5 from last week's lesson.. 5. unlike the law codes of many countries, "the perfect law" is neither complex nor burdensome but consists of simple commandements and principles.

Elephant

woods -

wasnt arguing about Alexander and pyramids being great or not...in fact i agree with that common 'opinion'...

now in regards to your question of micromanagement, yes, it sounds like it, but my question was does Captain feel HE is being micromanaged or others to their ill-effect?

captain -

your comparison (married couple) is not very appropiate being that you're implying that in such marriage there is no way out, while there is most certainly a 'way out' of this org.

72

There's gotta be another faction in the Writing Department, either that or they can't see the irony.

by Theocratic Sedition in

jw
friends

the past two week's worth of wt studies have made a couple points that appear contradictory in nature.

yesterday was too much, i felt at least.

either there's another faction within the writing department fighting for the equivalent of airtime in the literature, or they're all so indoctrinated that they fail to see the irony in what they publish.. for instance, take paragraph 5 from last week's lesson.. 5. unlike the law codes of many countries, "the perfect law" is neither complex nor burdensome but consists of simple commandements and principles.

Elephant

captain

wasnt trying to sound arrogant...my apologies...

...are you explaining that you yourself are being micromanaged or that others are being micromanaged to their ill effect?

18

Are YOU a Thinker?

by alamb in

jw
friends

the recovering thinker.

hi, my name is bob, and i am a recovering thinker..... it started out innocently enough: i began thinking at meetings now and then to loosen up.

inevitably though, one thought led to another and soon i was more than just a theocratic thinker.

Elephant

Hi my name is (snappy first name) Thinker

help me, i cant stop thinking about jw's and the fds, wtower, etc., etc...

why is it that, though a great thinker i am, i cant help but to think of the aforementioned thoughts?

i think i need some real help...

72

There's gotta be another faction in the Writing Department, either that or they can't see the irony.

by Theocratic Sedition in

jw
friends

the past two week's worth of wt studies have made a couple points that appear contradictory in nature.

yesterday was too much, i felt at least.

either there's another faction within the writing department fighting for the equivalent of airtime in the literature, or they're all so indoctrinated that they fail to see the irony in what they publish.. for instance, take paragraph 5 from last week's lesson.. 5. unlike the law codes of many countries, "the perfect law" is neither complex nor burdensome but consists of simple commandements and principles.

Elephant

Captain

i recall the article covered that reasoning beforehand explaining that there are in fact 'laws' or rules that provide 'freedom'... law of gravity??

where is the contradiction for the org?

woods-

if the Alexander can be called Great and pyramids be called Great, then yes, God can be called Great anything too...I believe its called an opinion...

72

There's gotta be another faction in the Writing Department, either that or they can't see the irony.

by Theocratic Sedition in

jw
friends

the past two week's worth of wt studies have made a couple points that appear contradictory in nature.

yesterday was too much, i felt at least.

either there's another faction within the writing department fighting for the equivalent of airtime in the literature, or they're all so indoctrinated that they fail to see the irony in what they publish.. for instance, take paragraph 5 from last week's lesson.. 5. unlike the law codes of many countries, "the perfect law" is neither complex nor burdensome but consists of simple commandements and principles.

Elephant

this is an interesting argument, this labeled pseudo-freedom...

when i read that i have freedom, i actually agree, in fact i would never think twice about someone stealing my wallet at the k.h.

of course unless someone actually does it...but the point is the k.h. is not the same place as your local pub...

anyways, i invite you to explain in which way there is a 'contradiction' in the paragraphs you pointed out...

35

I'm a stepmom to a little JW.... need advice...

by LKM in

jw
friends

i am a new stepmom to an 8 year old boy whose mother is a jw pioneer.

my husband has been disfellowshipped for 2.5 years now.

i was part of the reason he left the organization for good, although he had stopped believing long before being kicked out.

Elephant

hello step-mom

i think the most common sense and least stressfull way to handle this would be to offer your stepson alternate options without trying to 'convert' him over to non-jw or pro-jw, its his mind and heart and he will decide eventually.

now if your foremost objective is to not allow him to become pro-jw, well...you'll have to dedicate as much energy and effort as his mom will. it IS her son and i'm sure she's doing it in his best interest regardless of your opinions. just dont turn the kid into an outlet for your frustrations regarding the religion...that will require double his mom's efforts...

62

Best EZ 1 Liners to Say to Witnesses?

by LV101 in

jw
friends

any suggestions?

attending an invite (strange we're invited but hoping to make it worth my while) but i don't want to suffer big consequences as i've already said enough wrong stuff.

i'm stuck reading hassan's ccmc book (about half way --- just don't have time and not into it).

Elephant

Justchrist wrote-

My top ten:

1. Has the Watchtower ever taught anything that was scripturally incorrect?

2. Is it possible that they are teaching things that are scripturally incorrect today?

3. Since the Watchtower has received new light about the generation that saw 1914, does this mean that those that those Jehovah's Witnesses that were disfellowshiped for the same view that the organization NOW has before they taught it will now automatically be reinstated?

4. Why are you called, "Jehovah's Witnesses" and not "Christians"? Since Jehovah's Witnesses appeal to Isa 43:12; 44:8 for scriptural support that they should be called, "Jehovah's Witnesses" then what was the "new name" prophesied in Isa 62:2? Can't be "Jehovah's Witnesses", for God already used it 20 chapters earlier. Could the new name be "Christian" after our savior "Christ"?

5. If the name "Jehovah" is so important, then why does Acts 4:12 say, "There is salvation in no one else; for there is no other name [v10 Jesus Christ] under heaven that has been given among men, by which we must be saved"? Would this not have been the logical place for God to have used the name "YHWH"?

6. Jn 1:3 says that Jesus created "all things", but in Isa 44:24, God says that he "by myself" created the heavens and the earth and asks the question "Who was with me?" when the heavens and the earth were created. How can this be since if Jesus was created by God, then he would have been with God when everything else was created?

7. If the spirit of a man has no existence apart from the body, why does Stephen just before his death in Acts 7:59, pray to Jesus to "receive my spirit"? How could Jesus receive Stephen's spirit if a man's spirit ceases to exist when the body dies?

8. If there are 144,000 spirit anointed people who have a heavenly hope, and a great crowd of people who have another hope of everlasting life on paradise earth, why does Paul say that there is only ONE hope (Eph 4:4), instead of two?

9. In Rev 19:1, where does it say that the "great crowd" will be?

10. To what was Jesus referring to by the term "this temple" in Jn 2:18- 19?

**

here are some quick answers-

1 & 2 - No

3- im sure you wont be df'ed for having a 'point of view'.

4-actually, we DO call ourselves christians...

5-correct, Jesus IS so important since all things are made possible through him.

6-you are absolutely right, Jesus was there the whole time...

7- it would depend on your definition of 'spirit', no?

8 & 9- i must read these scriptures first.

Elephant