Posts by john.prestor

11

When did the policy to report to the legal “desk” / “department” was introduced?

by Paul Bonanno in

jw
friends

as you are all aware the elders are instructed that when they come across a case of “child sexual abuse” they have to call the “legal desk” / “legal department”.

prior to 1993 this was the policy that as an elder we had.

do you know when this policy was introduced or started and what was the history behind it?.

john.prestor

I did a little digging: looks like it was in 1989, there's a scan of the letter at https://jwfacts.com/watchtower/paedophilia.php

11

When 2 want to visit.

by stillin in

some of the local witnesses have been by, periodically, to check on us and say that they miss us.

i consider that a decent thing to do since they figure that we're going to die any day now from the loving god.

some have been elders, who have to always stay distant so that they don't somehow get contaminated by being too nice to us.

john.prestor

With you on that Morph, feels like they're setting the stage.

26

Jesus Christ: Invented by the Romans to subvert the Messianic impulse in Judaism into Pacifism?

by TerryWalstrom in

of course, there are many crackpot theories about all sorts of things.

we hear about them,look into them and laugh.however, once in a great while, somebody presents a cogent and feasible thesis backed up by scholarship and history.watch this video presentation and present your rebuttal (or agreement) for discussion.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4uqg8w7ezuq&t=268s.

john.prestor

Because they aren't the writings of those who traveled with Jesus: they never claim to be, and Matthew copying so much of Mark's account in writing his own gospel doesn't make sense for an eyewitness. Why not tell what you remember, as opposed to repeating and reworking the material Peter's disciple Mark wrote down second-hand (supposedly, if you believe Papias)?

26

Jesus Christ: Invented by the Romans to subvert the Messianic impulse in Judaism into Pacifism?

by TerryWalstrom in

of course, there are many crackpot theories about all sorts of things.

we hear about them,look into them and laugh.however, once in a great while, somebody presents a cogent and feasible thesis backed up by scholarship and history.watch this video presentation and present your rebuttal (or agreement) for discussion.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4uqg8w7ezuq&t=268s.

john.prestor

knowsnothing1: How do you deal with Pliny? Was there Christian persecution? More importantly, why were they persecuted?

In his letter to Trajan Pliny implies, as we know from other sources if I recall, that Christians were accused of being "atheists" because they refused to acknowledge the Roman emperor as a god. This amounted to treason in that day and age, which is why Pliny made people accused of being Christians offer "prayers with incense and wine to [the emperor's] image."

http://faculty.georgetown.edu/jod/texts/pliny.html

Early Christians were also accused of "cannibalism" because people didn't understand their talk of eating the body and drinking the blood of Jesus.

They also preached against secular society, which always pisses everybody off.

In other words: these reasons are more compelling explanations for why the Roman government persecuted early Christians than the reason you initially provided, that the apostles saw Jesus rise from the dead.

26

Jesus Christ: Invented by the Romans to subvert the Messianic impulse in Judaism into Pacifism?

by TerryWalstrom in

of course, there are many crackpot theories about all sorts of things.

we hear about them,look into them and laugh.however, once in a great while, somebody presents a cogent and feasible thesis backed up by scholarship and history.watch this video presentation and present your rebuttal (or agreement) for discussion.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4uqg8w7ezuq&t=268s.

john.prestor

truth_b_known: "the Gospels are believed to have been written no earlier than 3 decades after the events they are alleged to have chronicled took place"

That's not what critical (i.e., non-religiously motivated) scholars conclude. Go check out earlychristianwritings.com, they have pages for all four canonical gospels with the typically accepted dating range and even links to articles which, I think, discuss dating in greater detail. In general, scholars tend to argue 65-70 for Mark (but on little evidence), 70-80 for Matthew, 80-90 for Luke (although I'm inclined to agree with Joseph Tyson that the Luke we knew was published against the early heretic Marcion, who came to Rome in the mid-2nd century, which would put canonical Luke closer to 130-140 CE and proto-Luke, known to Marcion himself, closer to 90-100 CE), and John around 90-100 CE. Those are conservative estimates, by the way: we don't have any firm evidence for them, nobody explicitly cites gospels by name or explicitly quotes from them until the mid-2nd century (e.g., Justin Martyr),

13

My brother is shunning me (but he's not a Witness)

by john.prestor in

i didn't know where to post this but it's been on my mind and i'm looking for support and advice from people who know what it's like being shunned.

i was raised in a fundamentalist baptist church, so what i'm experiencing is a little different than most posters on this site.

i've been out of that church for years, and my brother's been out for a while too.

john.prestor

Hahaha, I think it was a frag grenade, it bounced and hit him. We were both blazed out of our minds, I didn't have a clue where my brother was in all the grunts and brutes.

sparky1, I'm just going to ignore that, it's not constructive, just inflammatory.

OneEyedJoe, Phoebe, what you're saying is hard to hear, but I think you're right. Yeah, I guess it is time for me to shrug it off and just move on: family doesn't get a free pass with me anymore. He isn't the person he used to be, that much is clear. It's just hard to come to terms with that.

13

My brother is shunning me (but he's not a Witness)

by john.prestor in

i didn't know where to post this but it's been on my mind and i'm looking for support and advice from people who know what it's like being shunned.

i was raised in a fundamentalist baptist church, so what i'm experiencing is a little different than most posters on this site.

i've been out of that church for years, and my brother's been out for a while too.

john.prestor

Thanks for the feedback guys, I've been thinking about the possibility of just cutting ties until he's willing to talk things out and make amends, and honestly, I don't think he ever will be. I deleted his phone number today so I won't be tempted to text him anymore. He's just not right but I wish he was.

Aww come on now Finkelstein, you got a problem with Halo? That game was high school for me, haha. A little match now for old time's sake keeps me young.

13

My brother is shunning me (but he's not a Witness)

by john.prestor in

i didn't know where to post this but it's been on my mind and i'm looking for support and advice from people who know what it's like being shunned.

i was raised in a fundamentalist baptist church, so what i'm experiencing is a little different than most posters on this site.

i've been out of that church for years, and my brother's been out for a while too.

john.prestor

I didn't know where to post this but it's been on my mind and I'm looking for support and advice from people who know what it's like being shunned. I was raised in a fundamentalist Baptist church, so what I'm experiencing is a little different than most posters on this site. I've been out of that church for years, and my brother's been out for a while too. So what he's doing isn't religious or mandated by anybody in other words: it's a choice he made, and I'll explain why.

My brother started a fight with me last winter because I accidentally hit him with a grenade during a co-op game of Halo (yes, you read that correctly). We're both in our late 20s by the way. He got in my face, gave me a menacing stare down with his body tensed up like he was going to hit me, and threatened to break my wrists, to the point that his wife (the daughter of a Jehovah's Witness) started dragging him away from me begging him to stop. I tried to deescalate but after he insulted me for a solid 10 minutes straight (he called me the c word a couple times) I got fed up and told him to his face in front of his wife and our cousin, "You're an exhibitionist narcissist" (I figured this out a few years ago and told my mother, who told me a counselor he saw at 16 said the same thing then). So at that point he threw me out of his apartment, and I left, after telling him that I loved him and that I would meet at any time to work things out while I was still in town for the holidays. Later, over text, I offered to pay for online counseling. He refused, of course.

I sent him a text every so few weeks after that but he stopped responding so I asked him outright whether he wanted me to text him or not. He told me that he wanted me to apologize for calling him a narcissist and for "disrespecting" him and his wife like I'm 12 or something. I'd already apologized for calling him a narcissist in front of his wife and our cousin, the only thing I thought I should apologize for, although he never took back a word he said to me or apologized for threatening me. So he's drawn a line in the sand and refused to talk to me going forward unless I tell him he's not a narcissist.

I never understood how painful shunning could be until recently. I hear people describe their experiences on here, and it sounds brutal, and now I know... it is brutal. It's downright cruel in fact. How do people cope with that kind of thing?

25

Abuse Survivor's $4M Judgment Against Jehovah's Witness Umbrella Organization Upheld by Court 12/10/18

by Not_Culty in

https://www.law.com/newyorklawjournal/2018/12/10/court-upholds-abuse-survivors-4m-judgement-against-jehovahs-witness-umbrella-organization-389-52222/?slreturn=20181111101406.

john.prestor

These people will never learn. The government needs to do something beyond fining this organization, they have the money to pay it, and they refuse to learn from their mistakes.

21

Facebook evangelising

by jhine in

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=2226652490738312&set=a.106546726082243&type=3&theater this was posted on fb by a witness who l am " friends " with .

she has since posted another jw propaganda piece .

these look like they are from the wt and are official evangelising tools .

john.prestor

It's definitely a risky move on their part... but from everything I've read on this forum and seen in my research, Jehovah's Witnesses run, literally sometimes, when they hear anything that challenges their beliefs in the slightest, and I'm sure they'll do the same online. They've got a very fragile sense of self.