I think the more interesting concern is that the serpent is believed to be Satan, the Devil by most Christians. The father of the lie did tell the truth when he told Eve she would not die, that instead she would become like god. God himself confirms that this latter claim was accurate. We can even claim that the serpent did not lie when it told Eve she wouldn't die- she did not die on the same day, as god had warned. Indeed, one can interpret the Genesis story to mean that god was upset with the serpent because it showed these first humans that god was keeping a valuable gift from them. And that he did so using threats.
TonusOH
JoinedPosts by TonusOH
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God cannot lie
by psyco inthe bible does not say that god does not want to lie, but that he cannot lie or it is impossible for god to lie.
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so, if god cannot lie, for what purpose and why did he create creatures (satan, demons, humans) who can lie?.
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Did Jesus have a pre-existence or was he fully human, begotten at his human birth.
by gavindlt inso when was jesus begotten.
was he truly and wholly fully human.
did he exist in two states, part human part god.
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TonusOH
I don't see how anyone can determine that. You're talking about what is, in effect, a magical being, capable of doing anything it sets its mind to. Jesus could have been a human puppet able to behave normally until god transplanted some part of his own consciousness into the body. Or he could have been a human puppet that god occasionally controlled remotely. Or he could have been the most advanced NI (natural intelligence- nothing artificial here!) to ever exist.
I would even say that it isn't possible to determine how he was "begotten." Presumably, there was no physical act of sex, as god would not need so crude a method to inseminate a human woman. One can imagine that the same being who can wish an entire universe into existence would do the same in order to cause an embryo to magically appear in the uterine wall of Mary.
And how would one explain these "states"? Has god ever been only half-god? How would that work?
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Lloyd Evans Patreoff Pool February 2024
by DerekMoors inhappy new year!
time to give us your vote for lloyd's fall from grace this month.. december 6th he was at 406. as of today, january 3rd, he's at 388. that is exactly, on the dot, where he was january 3rd of last year!
he's lost all gains from his begging videos and reminders and tin cup waving and etc.. so, fire up the shrooms and let us know where you think flab boy will be on february 2nd.
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TonusOH
Yep, like T5 said- you need to click "About" and scroll past the message and you will see how many paying members there are. 385 as of this moment. The landing page will only show the total number of followers, which includes people who sign up for free.
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Did God know adam and eve would sin?
by gavindlt into all those on this forum, i would love to know what your take on this vital question is..
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TonusOH
I think he knew it was probable. After all, he created all living beings, and that meant designing their minds and how those minds work. Why do I think it was probable? Because in the Bible, there are a few times when perfect beings break his rules. Obviously the serpent did, which means that the angel who used it to deceive Eve also turned his back on god. Adam and Eve, two perfect humans, disobeyed the single rule they were given. Later on, other angels left their posts in heaven to have sex with human women. Revelation implies that as many as a third of the angels fell along with Satan.
When that many perfect beings cannot follow god's rules, it's pretty clear that there is an issue with the design, or that the design was intended to have this effect. So the odds were in favor of Adam and Eve breaking god's rules.
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God cannot lie
by psyco inthe bible does not say that god does not want to lie, but that he cannot lie or it is impossible for god to lie.
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so, if god cannot lie, for what purpose and why did he create creatures (satan, demons, humans) who can lie?.
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TonusOH
I always saw it as god not needing to lie. It makes no sense to imply that god is somehow incapable of deceiving someone or saying something that isn't true. That would actually mean he was limited in some way.
But when you are the incalculably powerful magic overlord of a universe that you created with your own hands, why would you need to lie? Who would he need to fear, that he would try to misdirect them? Who could block him from any thought, word or action? It's not that he is somehow unable to lie, it's just that it wouldn't make sense.
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JWs And Superstitions
by NotFormer inprompted by a mention in a different thread.. cracks in the sidewalk, a pinch of salt over the shoulder, black cats🐈⬛; do jws have such superstitious beliefs.
are they allowed to?
would they be counselled if the elders became aware?.
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TonusOH
I remember hearing stories like that. About sisters who managed to go door-to-door in a dangerous neighborhood, and when asked why they were left alone, a person in the neighborhood explained that no one wanted to tangle with the large dog that accompanied them. And of course, the sisters would explain that there was no dog with them... *insert Exorcist theme*
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It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars (continued)
by Simon inuh oh, looks like the mega thread gave up the ghost, so while i investigate / fix it just continue the discussion here .... it's been a long 9 years lloyd evans / john cedars.
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TonusOH
It's fascinating to watch as people try to butter him up when they are making even the slightest criticism or giving him advice. They must still think that he will see the praise and try to find some common ground. But, time and again, he tears into anyone who doesn't grovel. If your comment isn't fawning and adoring, he will rip you apart.
Yet again, it must be pointed out to his supporters: this is the man you are defending and giving your money to.
PS- If you think he's going to change, you're in for a lot of disappointment.
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Where’s the 2023 Service Report?
by slimboyfat inwhat’s keeping them?
this has got to be the latest it’s ever been.
maybe it’s the last one they’ll ever publish too, after dropping reporting hours for publishers ….
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TonusOH
If they do release one next year, it probably won't be late.
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My decision.
by MissDaSilva ini’ve decided to disassociate from the jw organisation.
i cannot be part of a community that blatantly rejects the sacrifice of jesus in that demonic memorial ritual.
amazing what information you find when you start researching.. i’m writing my letter and posting it to the kingdom hall this morning.
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TonusOH
I think each person has to decide for themselves how to exit. I couldn't do PIMO, it would be too stressful to pretend. I'm not DF, but the last time I set foot in a KH (or any JW gathering) was around 2006. I wouldn't feel comfortable playing a part around people with whom I shared friendship and religious fellowship for so long.
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Does becoming (or remaining) one of Jehovah's Witnesses result in Poverty? Pew Research results differ from Watchtower claims.
by Balaamsass2 in"raised in the truth" during the 50s, 60s,and 70s i repeatedly read and heard from the platform how reading the magazines weekly "was the equivalent of a college education" and how many had turned their family economic situation around by being "trustworthy" and giving up expensive bad habits most "worldly people" had.
sounded good.. what is the reality?
how does avoiding higher education, and then spending up to 20 hours a week getting ready for, commuting, and then participating in meetings and field service affect family finances?.
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TonusOH
Teddnzo: Never bought a house because that would have been a lack of faith.
That would not have been a problem in the congregation I grew up in. About the only people who had houses or nice apartments were the elders and ministerial servants. The rest of us lived in the projects. Not because of faith, mind you. Some (most?) simply couldn't afford it. Others felt that with the end so near, why bother?
Maybe we should have paid more attention to who it was that could afford homes and nice cars. Happily, I bought my first home eight years ago. JWs have only visited once.