Posts by TonusOH

20

JWs don't consider older WT as revelant

by enoughisenough in

i am relating this happening.

i shared some thoughts from the 1989 question from readers concerning christ being mediator between god and man ( the wt spinning that he isn't ) and also the paragraph in that same article that plainly says: clearly, then the new covenant is not a loose arrangement open to all mankind.

it is a carefully arranged legal provision involving god and anointed christians.

TonusOH

Some people will spread (and believe) theories like that (apostates infiltrated the org and disseminated false info). I never heard that particular one. Where I was, we felt that the info was from the GB and that it was always good. If someone pointed out that older literature had different ideas, I would explain that the GB had received new light since then and updated our understanding, or something similar to that.

The concept of "new light" can paper over a vast amount of bad information and mistaken ideas. It can be used -counterintuitively- to promote the claim that they have God's blessing, by explaining that the older and mistaken belief was the "right one at the right time" and that the new understanding had arrived just when it was needed most.

22

New Convention Song “ It Will Not Be Late”

by BluesBrother in

this made me chuckle.

a new song that they are encouraged to practice for the convention.. “ we know your day will come, sure as the rising sun.

no matter how long it takes , it will not be late” …………... it is based on habakkuk 2 , we discussed this in depth around 1973/1974.

TonusOH

Bribie: Well from a human stand point that is true, but Gods workings and purpose is way above our reasoning and understanding.

If this is the case, then we cannot trust anything we read or hear from God. Even if something appears to be clear and to the point, how can we be sure it doesn't have a different meaning that we cannot grasp, because God's ways are beyond our reasoning and understanding? How do we tell what is being told to us plainly and what is shrouded in mystery?

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

TonusOH

I wonder if there's a way that the "defendants" can be notified that the action was dropped or settled or what the status is. Because I expect that Evans would wait a very long time to report the outcome if it wasn't what he wanted (and that is what I expect to happen, if it has not happened already). If (when) it fails and word gets out, I imagine he will be at his most creative in his attempts to explain why it actually succeeded. That, or he'll cry persecution again and use it as a way to beg for more money.

I find it hard to believe that he'll just accept the loss, since so much of his 'defense against the defamation and bullying' relies on smearing his critics as 'criminal defendants.'

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

TonusOH

He will need to work hard just to keep the numbers from dropping too fast. He already has to put in time keeping the comment sections in his videos 'clean.' But his Twitter feed has plenty of examples of Evans being himself, and just because he blocks/ignores people doesn't mean their words aren't there for people to read. People who seek out websites and forums will more likely find links to his livestream than words of support. People who contact other exJWs are less likely to hear a good word about him.

His past has caught up with him.

22

New Convention Song “ It Will Not Be Late”

by BluesBrother in

this made me chuckle.

a new song that they are encouraged to practice for the convention.. “ we know your day will come, sure as the rising sun.

no matter how long it takes , it will not be late” …………... it is based on habakkuk 2 , we discussed this in depth around 1973/1974.

TonusOH

One of the themes that they weave into the teaching is that of patience. When your recruiting and retaining efforts are based on the idea that time is short and the end is near, the one thing that works against you is time. This is also the problem with making date-specific claims. The farther you get from those dates, the harder it gets to exercise patience.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

TonusOH

Also, I was not surprised to see his patrons drop from 593 to 584 yesterday. After the diligent effort to build his following back up, I didn't expect a big drop-off at the end of the month.

And yet, that is what happened, as he is now down to 564. Almost 30 fewer, which is what was happening back when he was bleeding support a year ago. He will need to beg every couple of months to counteract the losses and keep growing. I wonder what the ratio will be, of begging videos versus actual content, if this trend continues.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

TonusOH

Welcome, Sarah.

As for Lloyd...

Evans: "another one who thinks I owe the universe my full time activism for free."

Non-sequitur. No one is saying he owes anyone his 'activism.' He's a money-grubbing opportunist who believes that he is owed a living for doing 'important work.' Work that isn't so important that he would do it for anything less than a comfortable living for him, his family, and his video editor. Work that he dangles over a cliff, threatening to drop it and move on, if he doesn't get paid well.

I don't think he owes anyone his activism, full-time or otherwise. I think he should stand on principle and stop any and all 'activism' right away. That will teach everyone to antagonize him!

11

A Little About Me & What Is a Resurrection?

by Sea Breeze in

a little about me first: i was a 4th generation jw who had major reservations about the wt growing up, but finally got on board at age 23 when i got baptized.

spent 8 very active years in, then 8 years out as an agnostic.

got saved in 2004 and been living the born-again christian bible-believing life ever since.

TonusOH

I think that the simplest description of resurrection is bringing back a person to life. A physical resurrection would be bringing a dead person back to life, whether in their existing body or a new one. A spiritual resurrection would be one where the dead is brought back as a spirit/ghost or into a different realm than the physical (heaven/hell/etc).

Further than that, it depends on how you view the person, whether as a self-contained physical being or as a soul inhabiting a physical body. In the latter case, it may be more akin to transplanting a soul into a body (physical resurrection) or not doing anything at all (assuming an immortal soul, which would not die and not need to be revived).

10

Do Your Own Research.

by LostintheFog1999 in

there were several times when i was inside the congregation that i met up with a problem in my life and on mentioning it at a group i would be told to do my own research about it.. of course, they didn't mean for me to research worldly material for the answer but to use the wt indexes and look into the wt society magazines.. it was only when i started to do my own research outside of the wt that i began to see the limited scope of the society's magazines as all problems usually fell into the category of 1. read the bible, attend meetings, go out on the work, and pray; or 2. this isn't going to be fixed now but in the new world god will sort it out and the former things (what you are suffering from now) will not be called to mind.. i wonder how many people still in are struggling and are not being encouraged to research away from the organisation where they would receive practical and valuable advice?.

TonusOH

I think this was their attitude from very early on: the world is in Satan's thrall, and you can only get reliable information from Jehovah through his organization. If you are going to seek answers, do so from the organization. Since they are the only ones who have Jehovah's guidance, they are the only ones who have all of the answers. So, there is no reason to seek answers outside of the org. And if you don't like the answers -if they don't make sense, for example- trust the org. They never get anything wrong (but when they do, they'll get it right the next time).

26

WEASEL WORDS--WHAT ARE THEY--HOW THE WTS USES

by blondie in

jw
friends

"a number of techniques employed to mislead others fall under the category of weasel words, and this article quotes examples that are regularly found in watchtower publications.. weasel words are defined as:.

“words or statements that are intentionally ambiguous or misleading,”[1].

intended “to avoid answering a question clearly or to make someone believe something that is not true."[2].

TonusOH

The experiences of the 1910s and 1920s taught them not to sound too certain when they made statements. Or at least, they learned that they could make some statements that sounded certain, while also making others that they could refer to later if they were wrong.

This is what happened with 1975. There was a WT or Awake magazine in 1969 that told young people that they would not grow old in the present system of things. Statements like that were forgotten when they had to explain why nothing happened in 1975. Instead, they referred to the statements they had also made, which were much less certain.