Smitty

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Posts by Smitty

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  18

  Being dis-fellowshipped or dis-associated

  by Smitty in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  for those that are dis-fellowshipped or dis-associated: do you speak to jw's even though they know you're disfellowshipped or dis-associated?

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  Smitty

  NameWithheld,
  I have noticed the group response also.
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  18

  Being dis-fellowshipped or dis-associated

  by Smitty in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  for those that are dis-fellowshipped or dis-associated: do you speak to jw's even though they know you're disfellowshipped or dis-associated?

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  Smitty

  I'm very friendly by nature. When I see them, I smile and say a big, "Hey, how are you?" Most of them speak back. They will even answer questions. Last night I had an extensive conversation with and elder and his wife. It was very friendly and open. It seems if it doesn't bother me, it doesn't bother them. If I let them just walk by without saying anything, they won't say anything to me. I consider it there problem not mine. I'm not carrying that weighty rule on my back. 95% respond this way.
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  18

  Being dis-fellowshipped or dis-associated

  by Smitty in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  for those that are dis-fellowshipped or dis-associated: do you speak to jw's even though they know you're disfellowshipped or dis-associated?

  1. 
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• 

  Smitty

  For those that are dis-fellowshipped or dis-associated: do you speak to JW's even though they know you're disfellowshipped or dis-associated?
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  29

  Dateline story

  by Smitty in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  we can probably forget the dateline story for a while.

  if it came out now, jw's would look like saints in comparison to the catholics.

  at least jw's delete the servants and not move them from congregation to congregation.

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  Smitty

  Hi all,
  we can probably forget the dateline story for a while. If it came out now, JW's would look like saints in comparison to the Catholics. At least JW's delete the servants and not move them from congregation to congregation. Yep, JW's look pretty good in comparison. It wouldn't be much of a story right now.
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  6

  The courtyard and the holy city in Rev 11

  by Smitty in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  is the courtyard the same as the holy city in rev 11?.

  quote:(niv)rev 11:2 - "but exclude the outer court; do not measure it, because it has been given to the gentiles.

  they will trample on the holy city for 42 months.

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  Smitty

  Hi all,
  Is the courtyard the same as the holy city in Rev 11?

  Quote:(NIV)Rev 11:2 - "But exclude the outer court; do not measure it, because it has been given to the Gentiles. They will trample on the holy city for 42 months."
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  1

  The temple in Revelation 11

  by Smitty in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  the temple in revelation 11:1-4. paul discussed in hebrew 8,9 the true tent or true temple.

  now as to the things being discussed this is the main point: we have such a high priest as this, and he has sat down at the right hand of the throne of the majesty in the heavens, a public servant of the holy place and of the true tent, which jehovah put up, and not man.

  for every high priest is appointed to offer both gifts and sacrifices; wherefore it was necessary for this one also to have something to offer.

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• 

  Smitty

  Rev 11:1
  " I was given a reed like a measuring rod and was told, "Go and measure the temple of God and the altar, and count the worshipers there.".....

  Rev 11:19
  " Then God's temple in heaven was opened, and within his temple was seen the ark of his covenant. And there came flashes of lightning, rumblings, peals of thunder, an earthquake and a great hailstorm."
• 
  1

  The temple in Revelation 11

  by Smitty in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  the temple in revelation 11:1-4. paul discussed in hebrew 8,9 the true tent or true temple.

  now as to the things being discussed this is the main point: we have such a high priest as this, and he has sat down at the right hand of the throne of the majesty in the heavens, a public servant of the holy place and of the true tent, which jehovah put up, and not man.

  for every high priest is appointed to offer both gifts and sacrifices; wherefore it was necessary for this one also to have something to offer.

  1. 
• 

  Smitty

  The temple in Revelation 11:1-4

  Paul discussed in Hebrew 8,9 the true tent or true temple. “Now as to the things being discussed this is the main point: We have such a high priest as this, and he has sat down at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens, a public servant of the holy place and of the true tent, which Jehovah put up, and not man. For every high priest is appointed to offer both gifts and sacrifices; wherefore it was necessary for this one also to have something to offer. If, now, he were upon earth, he would not be a priest, there being men who offer the gifts according to the Law, but which men are rendering sacred service in a typical representation and a shadow of the heavenly things; just as Moses, when about to make the tent in completion, was given the divine command: for says he: “See that you make all things after their pattern that was shown to you in the mountain…. For if that first covenant had been faultless, no place would have been sought for a second….” (Hebrews 8:1-7)

  So can we also say of the second, which is the heavenly temple, “For if that second covenant had been faultless, no place would have been sought for a third” ? Never may that be said. For the heavenly temple is the true temple of God’s making. Is there a necessity for a third? Never will that be the case. Also notice, it says the earthly temple was a representation and shadow of the heavenly one.

  “Thus the holy spirit makes it plain that the way into the holy place had not yet been made manifest while the first tent was standing. This very tent is an illustration for the appointed time that is now here….They were legal requirements pertaining to the flesh and were imposed until the appointed time to set things straight. However, when Christ came as a high priest of the good things that have come to pass, through the greater and more perfect tent not made with hands, that is, not of this creation, he entered, no, not with the blood of goats and young bulls, but with his own blood, once for all time into the holy place and obtained an everlasting deliverance for us. (Hebrews 9:8-12)

  So, my question is, is there a better and more perfect temple than the second heavenly temple; Or for that matter, a necessity for one?

  The temple in Revelation 11:1-4 can only be the heavenly temple with the earth being its courtyard. For any temple approved by Jehovah must reflect the pattern of the original tabernacle Hebrew 8:5
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  7

  Jesus second return

  by Smitty in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  how many people believe jesus returned in the first century?

  for those that don't, why not?

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  Smitty

  I think so. But, I'm too tired to explain why. I just got back from lunch. Latter. How bout you?
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  7

  Jesus second return

  by Smitty in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  how many people believe jesus returned in the first century?

  for those that don't, why not?

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  Smitty

  How many people believe Jesus returned in the first century? For those that don't, why not?
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  24

  Revelation 11:1-4

  by Smitty in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  a question for all the bible experts: .

  who or what does revelation 11:1-4 apply to?

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  Smitty

  tfs,
  You said, "3) Also, it appears both Temples had a PREVIOUS existence where gross sin was practiced, an abomination and "fornication", and forceably had a "curse" from God imposed upon it. This is not so easy to see at first. But here is where Rev. 11:1-4 becomes very important in describing this previous situation. The "Temple" that did not "measure" up to God's original standards. We see this also in Ezekiel's vision of a temple that did not originally meet God's standards. (Eze. 43:6-10; Rev. 11:1,2; 22:3) "

  How do you see that both had PREVIOUS existence of gross sin? The temple that is spoken of in Eze 43 is partially talking about the Jewish temple and their rulers, not God's Holy temple.

  Eze 43
  "Then the man brought me to the gate facing east, and I saw the glory of the God of Israel coming from the east. His voice was like the roar of rushing waters, and the land was radiant with his glory.
  The vision I saw was like the vision I had seen when he came to destroy the city and like the visions I had seen by the Kebar River, and I fell facedown. The glory of the LORD entered the temple through the gate facing east. Then the Spirit lifted me up and brought me into the inner court, and the glory of the LORD filled the temple. While the man was standing beside me, I heard someone speaking to me from inside the temple. He said: "Son of man, this is the place of my throne and the place for the soles of my feet. This is where I will live among the Israelites forever. The house of Israel will never again defile my holy name--neither they nor their kings--by their prostitution and the lifeless idols of their kings at their high places. When they placed their threshold next to my threshold and their doorposts beside my doorposts, with only a wall between me and them, they defiled my holy name by their detestable practices. So I destroyed them in my anger. Now let them put away from me their prostitution and the lifeless idols of their kings, and I will live among them forever. "Son of man, describe the temple to the people of Israel, that they may be ashamed of their sins. Let them consider the plan, and if they are ashamed of all they have done, make known to them the design of the temple--its arrangement, its exits and entrances--its whole design and all its regulations and laws. Write these down before them so that they may be faithful to its design and follow all its regulations. "This is the law of the temple: All the surrounding area on top of the mountain will be most holy. Such is the law of the temple. "These are the measurements of the altar in long cubits, that cubit being a cubit and a handbreadth : Its gutter is a cubit deep and a cubit wide, with a rim of one span around the edge. And this is the height of the altar: From the gutter on the ground up to the lower ledge it is two cubits high and a cubit wide, and from the smaller ledge up to the larger ledge it is four cubits high and a cubit wide. The altar hearth is four cubits high, and four horns project upward from the hearth. The altar hearth is square, twelve cubits long and twelve cubits wide. The upper ledge also is square, fourteen cubits long and fourteen cubits wide, with a rim of half a cubit and a gutter of a cubit all around. The steps of the altar face east." Then he said to me, "Son of man, this is what the Sovereign LORD says: These will be the regulations for sacrificing burnt offerings and sprinkling blood upon the altar when it is built: You are to give a young bull as a sin offering to the priests, who are Levites, of the family of Zadok, who come near to minister before me, declares the Sovereign LORD. You are to take some of its blood and put it on the four horns of the altar and on the four corners of the upper ledge and all around the rim, and so purify the altar and make atonement for it. You are to take the bull for the sin offering and burn it in the designated part of the temple area outside the sanctuary. "On the second day you are to offer a male goat without defect for a sin offering, and the altar is to be purified as it was purified with the bull. When you have finished purifying it, you are to offer a young bull and a ram from the flock, both without defect. You are to offer them before the LORD, and the priests are to sprinkle salt on them and sacrifice them as a burnt offering to the LORD. "For seven days you are to provide a male goat daily for a sin offering; you are also to provide a young bull and a ram from the flock, both without defect. For seven days they are to make atonement for the altar and cleanse it; thus they will dedicate it. At the end of these days, from the eighth day on, the priests are to present your burnt offerings and fellowship offerings on the altar. Then I will accept you, declares the Sovereign LORD."

  This is where the confusion is. The bold does not prove that this is all one temple simultaneously. The tenses are being intermingled