Posts by stephenw20

15

Anyone from the San Francisco bay area?

by Introspection in

anyone from marin or sonoma county?

stephenw20

Mark , Ill be there in July

perhaps a drink would be in order.
S

20

SMILE

by Gopher in

i found this old favorite song of mine.

take it for what it's worth.

a day-brightener, yes, a cure-all, no.. this beautiful song was used as background music in one of charlie chaplin's silent pictures over 70 years ago, which i believe was called "modern times".

"No matter what
we do that part of our lives will always exist.
Maybe in time the pain will lessen but not cease
to be. I think that our lost years are not something
to take lightly. We need to realize what was done to us.
We have every right to be angry and must work to prevent
others from losing their lives to JW's."

Yes Emy , you are rigth we do have every reason , no one can take it away.............but here is the thing...........THE ANGER serves no one well, not you ....not those you are angry with not your spirtual growth . I too recommend you find the thread on forgiveness in the Mental health section.

Personally , I blamed the JWS for many things that were not ACTUALLY their fault. It was others who BELIEVED in the teachings. THese ones made concious decisons to believe as perhaps you or I did. SHould there be anger yes , should you say could of, would of , should of......yes..........for a period of time.

Our bodies as I mentioned before are designed to HEAL . if we had an open flesh wound for years we would die from disease. Yet so many are extremely comfortable with the idea it s OK to carry these internal wounds with us. THey serve no purpose , but to realize , We learned a valuble lesson, and after all what else is our purpose here on this earth, but to learn.

When we are close to a situation , it is hard to get perspective , but pulling back a great distance lets us see , these thing s happen for the learning of our SPIRIT , they are not designed to harm us. When we can get past an event issue, an idea we have been PERSONALLY HURT, we GROW ...we have no choice , but to grow......and our lives change.

IF we say we TRUST god and then dont understand how this can happen, do we really trust him or are we just saying we have faith.
Trusting in him ,means we WONT get the ANSWER to WHY , as long as we need it...and then when we dont need it anymore...... we get the perspective we need to see why it may have happened or why someone is in our life.....

Emy, I do agree, we should warn others, just keep in mind when we had our firm beliefs , we wanted to be right and had a lot of toruble seeing anything derrogatory about the JW.

I do battle daily witth his and I can say its not easy, but I do learn a lot.

Peace and love EM

Stephen

7

Sheep / Goat / Righteously Inclined / Meek Like??

by Big Jim in

jw
friends

this will probally sound like an elementary question but it is one that the wittnesses have never giving me a solid answer on.. are you born a sheep or a goat?.

are some born more righteously inclined?.

if the answer is yes, then why?

stephenw20

Yeru,

I can see many feel that way abotu predestiantion... they never do though look at whose Mother Solomon was.........

or the rest of the line between, Abraham and Jesus...were these men not predestined.......

how many people does it take to make ONE prophecy come TRUE........and if you have never seen it....RENT the movie the Game with Michael Douglas.....then answer the question again.

BTW, I never believed in fate
b4now
S

66

i am new

by knight in

i have read the various posts here an i have my own story to tell i amstill a witness not as active as i used to be but stillfaithful i think the main problem that jws have is that they put c.o's m.s's elders and the like on pedestals and when you do that you set yourself up for a letdown and when that person does something you dont think is right you are letdown but one should not let this block his/her relationship with jehovah.

stephenw20

Chris,

I read some of your posts and if I misunderstand your points please correct me.

“The prophets guided the nation til Christ. Before the death of the last apostle, it was made clear that Christianity would be facing tough times ahead.”

Chris this was made clear when Jesus was here ,not after the death of the last apostle.

“Apostasy set in for a long time. But champions of Bible truth are still there, those who are willing to stake their own lives for the Bible. Efforts were made to silence the Bible but failed because of God's backing. This brings us to our modern time when CT Russell initiated a serious step back to Christianity as taught by Jesus himself.”

Chris you cant just dismiss 1700 years as .......this brings us to ...it seems to be longer than the actual movement itself.
Apsotasy did not set in. What set in were people, that just like today, here and now..... willing to fight against any thing organized in GODS name that is unfair , or ungodly.

“Jesus was God's spokesman who organized his apostles & later on disciples. After his death, this organization carried on in the work he gave them. Jesus himself set the precedent.”

Spokesman...excuse me....I have heard him referred to as many things but SPOKESMAN, give me a break........he set a precedent in showin people that the organization the jews had in place was corrupt and unnecessary to approach his father. He never encoraged ORGANIZATION he encouraged telling people about his father. The “one faith” spoken of by Paul, is faith in him and in his sacrifice.

“The proof is there of Jehovah's blessings for the congregations flourished. “

Really flourished?........why then did Paul write the letters to the Corinthians about not falling back to ol“#7Åactices. His other letters are also filled with EXHORTATIONS to stop idoaltry and other forms of worship.

“Just a thought. Here's some real life situations: denial of Jesus by Peter on the night of his trial; constant argument of the apostles as to who is greatest among them despite corrections by Jesus; “

Yes Chris this was prior to THEM RECEIVING HOLY SPIRIT or are you not familiar with that in Acts.

“With being appointed by holy spirit, a privilege, comes a huge responsibility to use that wisely. Privilege given by Jah equals accountability to Jehovah. Be assured He will act in his time.”

Please tell me you are not saying that elders and ministerial servants are appointed by “holy Spirit” .......next I will hear God is the editor of the Watchtower , Jesus Is driecting the FDS and the GB are like the apostles spirit annoited..

Sorry chris... I am showing restraint , since I want you to feel welcome....

BUT under no circumstances do I agree with you!

caio~

21

The eventuality of man is the same as animals

by OlderTom in

jw
friends

was it ezicle who said the eventuality of man is the same as for the animal, as one dies so does the other.

or something like that.. man has to die because he sinned, that's the price one has to pay.

what sins have animals committed?

stephenw20

OM,

ADAM did die that day..in a spiritual sense.
it does seem like Adam and eve are children not understanding it all......

the test was one of will that ADAM had to pass......... the same as did Jesus , when tempted.....

Gen 2:16-17 And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:

But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

Adam at this point was alone..Adam having had a realtionship with GOD could have went to God and said hey, she made a mistake, rather than just joining in the apple coreing.......

Eve was spoken of in vs 18

S

20

SMILE

by Gopher in

i found this old favorite song of mine.

take it for what it's worth.

a day-brightener, yes, a cure-all, no.. this beautiful song was used as background music in one of charlie chaplin's silent pictures over 70 years ago, which i believe was called "modern times".

stephenw20

emy,

welcome!

leaving the jws can be likended to death, but we can also be ressurected or have a rebirth in a way as well.

getting over it , so to speak is a human inclination,our body heals wounds, pretty well.

the internal journey , to find what we will accept , believe in , and worship , can be challenging , painful and joyful. We do learn, if we choose that perspective.

THE watchers of the tower are just men like us. we made a mistake, gave way too much of ourselves over to them....... now we have to get healthy , get strong , and not let this happen again, and if so inclined after...help others to do the same.......

hope to see more of your posts

S

21

The eventuality of man is the same as animals

by OlderTom in

jw
friends

was it ezicle who said the eventuality of man is the same as for the animal, as one dies so does the other.

or something like that.. man has to die because he sinned, that's the price one has to pay.

what sins have animals committed?

stephenw20

Hi Gopher....

just a little response

“I would say that of all earthly creatures, man has the most advanced combination of capacity for love (though much of that capacity is sadly unused), wisdom and justice. “

Man has a component called creativity, which god has, he has the ability to forgive as god does(tho no one has ever been as sucessful) he has spirit, as god does.he ~rules~(has domininon) as god does

David Guzik, a bible commentator had the following observations:

2. (26) God plans to make man in His image

b. An understanding of who man is begins with knowing that we are made in His image; man is different from every other order of created being, because He has a created consistency with God

i. This means that there is an unbridgeable gap between human life and animal life; though we are biologically similar to certain animals, we are distinct in our moral, intellectual, and spiritual capabilities

ii. This means that there is also an unbridgeable gap between human life and angelic life; nowhere are we told that the angels are made in the image of God. Angels cannot have the same kind of relationship of love and fellowship with God that we can

iii. This means that the incarnation was truly possible; that God (in the Second Person of the Trinity) could really become man, because deity and humanity are not the same, but they are compatible

iv. This means that human life has intrinsic value, quite apart from the "quality of life" experienced by any individual, because human life is made in the image of God

c. What specific things in man show him to be made in the image of God?

i. Man alone has a natural countenance that looks upward

ii. Man alone has such a variety of facial expressions

iii. Man alone has a sense of shame that expresses itself in a blush

iv. Man alone speaks

v. Man alone possesses personality, morality, and spirituality

d. What does it mean to be made in the image of God?

i. It means one possesses personality: knowledge, feelings, and a will. This sets man apart from all animals and plants

ii. It means one possesses morality: we are able to make moral judgments and have a conscience

iii. It means one possesses spirituality: man is made for communion with God; it is on the level of spirit that we communicate with God

e. If we are made in the image of God, does God have a human body? No; God is a Spirit (John 4:24). Though God does not have a physical body, He designed man so that man's physical body could do many of the things God does - see, hear, smell, touch, speak, think, plan, and so forth

i. "It will hardly be safe to say that the body of man is patterned after God, because God, being an incorporeal spirit, cannot have what we term a material body. Yet the body of man must at lease be regarded as the fittest receptacle for the man's spirit and so must bear at least an analogy that is so close that God and His angels choose to appear in human form when they appear to men." (Leupold)

f. The terms for image and likeness are slightly different - image having to do more with appearance, and likeness having to do more with an abstract similarity, but they both essentially mean the same thing here.

g. Before God ever created man, He decreed that man would have dominion over the earth; man's pre-eminence of the created order and his ability to affect his environment is no accident - it is part of God's plan for man and the earth

i. In this sense, it is sin if man does not use this dominion responsibly, in these sense of a proper regard for stewardship on this earth
___________
This last part “G” is something I have discussed with a loyal servant of christ who comes here as well. We wonder if SATAN, being the serpent , which use to have legs, survived the fate of the dinosaurs. That he was ruler over the big fellas, in Gods infinite wisdom , giving the smallest one the power of the seeming more powerful..........

ENTER ~man~....... man takes his place to have DOMINION over the earth to RULE earth as God Rules the heavens.....Satan likes this not even for a thought....... and does his little little apple routine, to show his disgust.......

“Humankind alone can plan for the distant future. So not physically, but spiritually/mentally, man has the greatest capacity to reflect the Creator's qualities.”
But man can’t execute this plan without somehelp/ God can........man cant make the world turn, he still needs outside help.

“The idea of eternity can be deduced from 2 lines of reasoning, (1) God's love. The passage first quoted by Older Tom from Ecclesiastes also later says the "God put eternity into men's hearts." We all know what eternity is, and many reasonable people would agree that eternity is something the majority of mankind would want to have. That being the case, would a loving God "tease" mankind with a concept that they could never attain?”

Jesus was a spirit creature, did he have a heart then? we dont know.....
if he didn’t , we know, he did when he came to earth......does he have a heart now? ....thinking about a heart.........God so LOVED the world....where is love contained in a spirit?

Reasonable people may agree that eternity is something they would like on this earth, but they have no other frame of reference. God is by no means logical , reasonable, nor thinks like we do.
His point of reference is not ours.We attempt to make him LIKE us, as we are in HIS image......but we still have much to learn........

S

4

for all to see: Charitable brochure

by stephenw20 in

jw
friends

the lovely folks over at the observer.

have posted the wtbts charitable planning brochure on their site.. wonder where they got it.. *eg* .anyway.

please have a look..... and while looking just repeat ......."the system is going to end soon".

stephenw20

The lovely folks over at the OBSERVER

have posted the WTBTS Charitable Planning brochure on their site.
wonder where they got it.. *EG* .anyway
please have a look....

and while looking just repeat ......."the system is going to end soon"

http://watchtower.observer.org/apps/pbcs.dll/oversikt?Kategori=JWANDSOCIETY9

8

what where you looking for from the JWS

by stephenw20 in

i cant say i sought the jws out.

i had little choice , as my parents did the seeking, i hold them harmless, they did not investigate it beyond the wtbts pubs.. i did however at a point go it on my own, did the water dipping ore 1985 , so i feel, no allegiance to a group i vowed nothing to.. there was a point maybe 2 or 3 months when i felt i had a realtionship with god during my stint with the jws.

unfortuanately for me i lumped , god and them together and dismissed both together for a long time.. my question though to all here is this.

stephenw20

I cant say I sought the JWS out. I had little choice , as my parents did the seeking, i hold them harmless, they did not investigate it beyond the WTBTS Pubs.

I did however at a point go it on my own, did the water dipping ore 1985 , so I feel, no allegiance to a group I vowed nothing to.

There was a point maybe 2 or 3 months when I felt I had a realtionship with God during my stint with the JWS. Unfortuanately for me I lumped , God and them together and dismissed both together for a long time.

My question though to all here is this.

When you were contacted in the beginiing by the JWS, something attracted you to them. What?

You had to be looking for something , and was this quest fulfilled, and if it wasnt are you still looking to find what you set out for.

I see many here dont want to any form of religion ever again, and I think :
there is bittereness in them

I see those torked by the WTBTS and deny themselves the joy of living or spend their life attempting to get even some how.

SO I ask what do you believe IN

S

20

SMILE

by Gopher in

i found this old favorite song of mine.

take it for what it's worth.

a day-brightener, yes, a cure-all, no.. this beautiful song was used as background music in one of charlie chaplin's silent pictures over 70 years ago, which i believe was called "modern times".

stephenw20

7

if you listen to the version of What a Wonderfu lworld by Eva Cassidy ..it will blow you away....

She also does a live version of
Stings Field of Gold.....

Fields Of Gold

You'll remember me when the west wind moves
Upon the fields of barley
You'll forget the sun in his jealous sky
As we walk in fields of gold
So she took her love for to gaze awhile
Upon the fields of barley
In his arms she fell as her hair came down
Among the fields of gold

Will you stay with me, will you be my love
Among the fields of barley?
We'll forget the sun in his jealous sky
As we lie in fields of gold
See the west wind move like a lover so
Upon the fields of barley
Feel her body rise when you kiss her mouth
Among the fields of gold

I never made promises lightly
And there have been some that I've broken
But I swear in the days still left
We'll walk in fields of gold
We'll walk in fields of gold

Many years have passed since those summer days
Among the fields of barley
See the children run as the sun goes down
Among the fields of gold
You'll remember me when the west wind moves
Upon the fields of barley
You can tell the sun in his jealous sky
When we walked in fields of gold
When we walked in fields of gold
When we walked in fields of gold

great tunes
found on Live at Blues Alley