@Scott77: Well, the thread I linked to is from 2003 and the Hall had already been sold by then, but I know we met there at least as late as 1999. So that kind of narrows down the year. Soledad wrote that the sale was for $2M. I can't remember the rationale behind the sale. But as you'll recall if you've been there, you had to travel over the mountains to get there (from some directions, at least), which was beautifully scenic, but dangerous in the winter. The Newburgh Assembly Hall was built to replace it. Not sure what the Hasidim did with the Monroe Hall... considering the state of their nearby neighborhood, I'd rather see them knock the Hall down than make a similar mess of it.
Apognophos
JoinedPosts by Apognophos
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27
Watchtower Real Estate Fire Sale = Comfort for the Jews?
by Calebs Airplane inhas anyone noticed that all the watchtower buildings in brooklyn are (so far) being sold to real estate investment companies owned and operated by orthodox jews?
seriously, i couldnt identify one single watchtower building in brooklyn that went to a non-jewish real estate firm.. is the rothschild family finally cashing in on the initial investment they made in the watchtower at the end of the 19th century?
i have to wonder if they foresee a collapse or mass exodus in the near future and want to cash in their chips before these lose any more value..
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107
How do you keep your hopes up while in this doomed existence?
by sabastious incoming from aguest's thread where she showed us the article that describes a "brain drain" that has been occuring for centuries do to "mutations" i can't help but be a little fed up with how much negativity comes from the land of science.
sure, facts are facts and they do not set out to sound good or bad, but instead of identifying the problems of doom, like our brains are devolving, why not focus on the solutions to those problems?
where are the hopes and dreams that our culture so desperately holds onto which actually provides the drive to progress towards them.
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Apognophos
On the subject of politics, yes, democracy is messy and often comically ineffective. But just several hundred years ago, we were all ruled by kings and most people had no say at all. First-world countries today are incredibly pampered by comparison.
Also, in many ancient cultures it was considered appropriate to cut off pieces of your slain enemy as trophies, and often to take no prisoners. Genocide was common (the Bible's got some examples of that!). By the 1700s, it was unofficially considered immoral to kill an enemy that wanted to surrender. By the 1900s, it was international law that prisoners of war should be treated well, and after WWII Nazi leaders were executed for breaking those laws.
Speaking of execution, just a few hundred years ago many of our ancestors' countries killed people in excruciating ways that made the crucifix look attractive (see William Wallace or Balthasar Gerard if you have a strong stomach). In the 1700s, the French executed the nobility with the guillotine, a device intended to kill as humanely as possible, and it was still considered barbaric by some people. Now the death penalty has been phased out completely in many nation-states.
Do you not see improvement in these socio-political areas? It's easy to point to continued problems in some global hotspots, but surely the world isn't getting worse, like Witnesses believe?
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How do you keep your hopes up while in this doomed existence?
by sabastious incoming from aguest's thread where she showed us the article that describes a "brain drain" that has been occuring for centuries do to "mutations" i can't help but be a little fed up with how much negativity comes from the land of science.
sure, facts are facts and they do not set out to sound good or bad, but instead of identifying the problems of doom, like our brains are devolving, why not focus on the solutions to those problems?
where are the hopes and dreams that our culture so desperately holds onto which actually provides the drive to progress towards them.
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Apognophos
I'm not sure I agree with your basic premise that science or science reporting focuses on the negative; certainly they focus on the sensational, as you just said (that lowering-IQ story was extremely dubious, by the way). Glancing over this science blog, most of the stories seem positive to me. Do you feel otherwise?
Why worry about what tomorrow will bring?
Because you have a say in things.
Do we, really? I can't do anything about the long-term problems we face: the Sun burning off all liquid water from Earth in a billion years; the Sun cooling and engulfing the Earth in maybe 5 billion years; the universe undergoing heat-death in possibly a googol years. Nor can I do anything about the probable extinction of half the world's species by 2100. Perhaps I could become a scientist and try to contribute one iota to one piece of the puzzle. Even then, I won't be alive to see whether we're able to do anything about these problems in the far future. It's equally likely that I could go into entertainment and make a science-fiction show that inspires a scientist to work on a certain problem and have just as positive an effect as if I went into science. Or I could become a business executive; some executives work for Big Pharma, which means they are supporting the development of new medicines while also making big money!
In other words, it's impossible to say what effect I can have on the world and whether anything I try to do will succeed or anything I try to fail at will be successful instead. Therefore, why worry? My only concerns are contributing more to society than I take, and enjoying each day as it comes.
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How do you keep your hopes up while in this doomed existence?
by sabastious incoming from aguest's thread where she showed us the article that describes a "brain drain" that has been occuring for centuries do to "mutations" i can't help but be a little fed up with how much negativity comes from the land of science.
sure, facts are facts and they do not set out to sound good or bad, but instead of identifying the problems of doom, like our brains are devolving, why not focus on the solutions to those problems?
where are the hopes and dreams that our culture so desperately holds onto which actually provides the drive to progress towards them.
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Apognophos
It's not humor! That's how kids are raised on my mother's side of the family. I found it comforting, personally. Why worry about what tomorrow will bring?
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107
How do you keep your hopes up while in this doomed existence?
by sabastious incoming from aguest's thread where she showed us the article that describes a "brain drain" that has been occuring for centuries do to "mutations" i can't help but be a little fed up with how much negativity comes from the land of science.
sure, facts are facts and they do not set out to sound good or bad, but instead of identifying the problems of doom, like our brains are devolving, why not focus on the solutions to those problems?
where are the hopes and dreams that our culture so desperately holds onto which actually provides the drive to progress towards them.
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Apognophos
We have a saying in our family passed on to each child when they're young: "Don't worry about it, you could be dead by tomorrow."
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Off-topic: hand shaking
by Libelle inthis is totally unrelated to anything jw, but it's the only group i'm in online with such a mix of men and women, so i'm asking.
what's your experience with hand shaking?.
me, when i meet someone for the first time, i offer to shake their hand.
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Apognophos
I've heard it said that men should not extend their hand first to a woman when meeting her; that it's poor etiquette to initiate the hand-shaking. Having gotten some very tepid responses from women a couple times when doing that, I now follow that advice. Now for guys who don't want to shake, I don't know what their problem is. I mentally keep track of when I've shaken hands, and always wash my hands before touching my face or eating afterward.
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Watchtower Real Estate Fire Sale = Comfort for the Jews?
by Calebs Airplane inhas anyone noticed that all the watchtower buildings in brooklyn are (so far) being sold to real estate investment companies owned and operated by orthodox jews?
seriously, i couldnt identify one single watchtower building in brooklyn that went to a non-jewish real estate firm.. is the rothschild family finally cashing in on the initial investment they made in the watchtower at the end of the 19th century?
i have to wonder if they foresee a collapse or mass exodus in the near future and want to cash in their chips before these lose any more value..
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Apognophos
Not sure where this is going, but I'll add that the Monroe, NY assembly hall was sold to the nearby Hasidic community several years back:
http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/47842/1/Hasidem-Territory
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Relationship Issues: Boundaries, Freedom of Choice and Codependency
by 00DAD inrelationship issues: boundaries, freedom of choice and codependency .
i just read a very interesting thought in the book, "boundaries" by cloud & townsend.
the basic problem in human relationship is that of freedom.
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Apognophos
To resume a line of thought from my earlier post on page 3, I remembered another item of counsel for this particular MS in the congregation (besides "don't wear those socks" and "walk more quietly"): they were concerned that his short hairstyle stuck up too much on top, that apparently being "a worldly style". After some negotiation, he came to an agreement with the elder(s?) that he would slick it down more when he was going to be on stage. At the time all this counsel was happening, he was being considered for a "promotion". I jokingly suggested to him that this must be like an initiation or hazing process that all prospective elders go through. At least I pretended to be joking.
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As a Jehovah's Witness, how did you feel about the prospect of god killing millions of babies & children?
by jambon1 ini've got to say that it repulsed me.. yet, i knew one brother/elder who always commented that he wanted 'to see the wicked being destroyed.'.
twisted beyond belief..
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Apognophos
I don't actually recall being taught that. Since the Witnesses talk about the resurrection of both the righteous and unrighteous, there was no reason to assume that today's "unrighteous" (those who don't know the truth) would be destroyed at Armageddon.
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Is 1914 still relevant in WT/JW Theology?
by 00DAD in) - p. 7 par.
10:12, 13) - p. 20 par.
- p. 25 par.
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Apognophos
Let me try to restate what I've been saying, by approaching it from another angle. As near as I can figure out, the current interpretation of the 3.5 times is from Dec. 1914 to June 1918. June 1918 is the imprisonment of Rutherford et al. Dec. 1914 is what you get when you count back three and a half years, and the Society warned that there might be persecution and announced the 1915 yeartext to be "Are ye able to drink of My cup?". Yes, that's the basis for the start date: counting backwards to the announcement of a yeartext. This reasoning is given in the WT of Aug. 1, 1994 in the Questions from Readers.
So really, 1919 has no direct connection to 1914. If anyone can find a Society writing that links those two years, I will stand corrected. The significance given for 1919 is the Cedar Point convention that started the modern preaching work (there was another Cedar Point convention in 1922 that reiterated the importance of the preaching work, which is the convention linked to the trumpet blasts). This 1919 convention is considered prophetic fulfillment of scriptures referring to a revival from spiritual inactivity and a swarm of locusts -- NOT the beginning of Jesus' reign in 1914. As near as I can tell, there is no chronology linking 1914 and 1919. Only the inactivity during WWI and the subsequent preaching beginning in 1919 are prophetically linked by the Society.
Thus, there is little obstacle to the Society simply phasing out the mention of 1914, or maybe even kicking it out the door in a "new light" article, and yet still proclaiming that the slave was appointed in 1919 after Jesus began inspecting his household at some other, possibly unknown, date (I will speculate more wildly here, that they are going to flip the date of the inspection and anointing around so that it more logically takes place after 1919 -- perhaps 1931 -- and keep the identification of the slave at 1919 because that is when the preaching began). 1919 is close enough to 1914 that it will not feel to the rank and file that anything deeply significant has changed. The beginning of the 20th century will still mark the start of some special era for God's servants and the beginning of Jesus' reign.
It's true that 1914 has a satisfying aspect to it for Witnesses, which is that WWI began in that year, but Witnesses have always known that the beginning of WWI does not align with the October 4/5 date based on the 2,520 years from Oct. 5/6, 607 BCE (Daniel book chap. 6). The assumption by some Witnesses, in order to reconcile the difference, is that Satan was stirring up things on Earth in 1914 even before he was cast down there in the autumn. Thus, even if 1914 is removed as a significant year from WT chronology, Witnesses will still have essentially the same belief -- that WWI marked the rough beginning of the signs of Jesus' presence, and Satan's confinement to Earth, a time of woe for mankind.