Posts by Skedaddle

56

Why Faith is Self-Defeating

by cofty in

the god of christian theism values faith.. "without faith it is impossible to please god, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists" - heb.11.

faith and evidence are inversely proportional - the more evidence there is that god exists the less faith you need in that proposition and vice-versa.. so how can a christian criticise any other faith-based belief?

for example they can protest that all the evidence is against the claims of scientology, but that just means that scientologists require more faith than christians.

Skedaddle

How can anybody be expected to follow your terms when you confuse the unrelated words "absolute" and "absolution"? Ah I see you updated your comment... but it's not strong enough for a responce.

Peace

56

Why Faith is Self-Defeating

by cofty in

the god of christian theism values faith.. "without faith it is impossible to please god, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists" - heb.11.

faith and evidence are inversely proportional - the more evidence there is that god exists the less faith you need in that proposition and vice-versa.. so how can a christian criticise any other faith-based belief?

for example they can protest that all the evidence is against the claims of scientology, but that just means that scientologists require more faith than christians.

Skedaddle

No it isn't unknown, it's just a daft question. Maths is a language. Dividing by zero is a sentence that makes as much sense as asking what is the colour of gravity?

Wrong! Go and research it.

I know the terms I just don't have the patience for the pointless Q&A

Your posts are a word salad of unconnected random ideas.

If you ever get the urge to succinctly join the dots I will be interested to consider your point.

No, they are connected because they exist in absolute. That's why listening and asking the right questions is important to understand.

I'm done.

Peace

(The peachy hue is for the ones who are searching for God and it's a clue which I can explain.)

56

Why Faith is Self-Defeating

by cofty in

the god of christian theism values faith.. "without faith it is impossible to please god, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists" - heb.11.

faith and evidence are inversely proportional - the more evidence there is that god exists the less faith you need in that proposition and vice-versa.. so how can a christian criticise any other faith-based belief?

for example they can protest that all the evidence is against the claims of scientology, but that just means that scientologists require more faith than christians.

Skedaddle

Skedaddle - Did you even read the OP?

I'm not interested in the story Cofty, if you get me. I'm interested in YOUR CONCLUSION. What did you find?

Nope I don't get you.

What has dividing numbers by zero and rabbit holes got to do with the price of fish?

The OP is a knockdown argument against faith as a basis for belief in god.

The god of Jesus demands faith. Therefore there is no basis for belief in the god of christian theism.

Hi Cofty,

Yes I read the OP. I added to the conversation already and you commented with;

vague notion you call "absolution

and...

It is intellectually dishonest and patronising to pretend you can bypass the process of evidence. When I was a christian I often came across people who would assert they KNEW god was real or that they had MET god.

It is posturing. I didn't fall for it then or now.

and...

I suspect you meant to say "divide a number by zero" but what does maths have to do with the subject of faith Skedaddle?

So, you implied I was ''posturing'' because I had not provided evidence. As I've said already, we need to use maths and Physics for evidence of God. It's what scientists use.

The answer to dividing any number BY zero:))) is ''unknown''! Mathematicians and Physicists and readers of, know this.

The ''rabbit hole'' is in reference to the same metaphor as ''red pill, blue pill''. If you've been down it you should know that there is no end. Or is there?

Absolute is a word I'm using in the correct entire meaning of it as described in any definition, in any dictionary. Mathematicians and Physicists use it.

I was beginning the process of trying to give you evidence on terms you should know, if you ask for evidence. If you don't know the terms Cofty, then... sorry! I mistook you for a person who doesn't believe in God from a background of knowledge... specifically in Maths, Physics and Religious studies.

I answered on the topic of faith already.

Peace

56

Why Faith is Self-Defeating

by cofty in

the god of christian theism values faith.. "without faith it is impossible to please god, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists" - heb.11.

faith and evidence are inversely proportional - the more evidence there is that god exists the less faith you need in that proposition and vice-versa.. so how can a christian criticise any other faith-based belief?

for example they can protest that all the evidence is against the claims of scientology, but that just means that scientologists require more faith than christians.

Skedaddle

By the way Cofty, if we carry on the conversation, we're gonna go off topic.

So, Is faith self-defeating? YES! That's my answer.

We can move thread if you want.

56

Why Faith is Self-Defeating

by cofty in

the god of christian theism values faith.. "without faith it is impossible to please god, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists" - heb.11.

faith and evidence are inversely proportional - the more evidence there is that god exists the less faith you need in that proposition and vice-versa.. so how can a christian criticise any other faith-based belief?

for example they can protest that all the evidence is against the claims of scientology, but that just means that scientologists require more faith than christians.

Skedaddle

Hiya Cofty,

I suspect you meant to say "divide a number by zero" but what does maths have to do with the subject of faith Skedaddle?

Because if you are looking for evidence Cofty, we both have to be discussing it in the place where evidence is produced. Right?

You've been down the rabbit hole Cofty, right?

I'm not interested in the story Cofty, if you get me. I'm interested in YOUR CONCLUSION. What did you find?

83

if you had the slightest of doubt about leaving leaving the watchtower org. go to to jwsurvey.org NOW!

by nowwhat? in

and we are suposed to trust these guys with our lives?

!

Skedaddle

That old "keep your eyes on the prize" hall tune is now in my head!

56

Why Faith is Self-Defeating

by cofty in

the god of christian theism values faith.. "without faith it is impossible to please god, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists" - heb.11.

faith and evidence are inversely proportional - the more evidence there is that god exists the less faith you need in that proposition and vice-versa.. so how can a christian criticise any other faith-based belief?

for example they can protest that all the evidence is against the claims of scientology, but that just means that scientologists require more faith than christians.

Skedaddle

Hiya cofty,

Cofty, if you divide a number into zero, what is the result?

56

Why Faith is Self-Defeating

by cofty in

the god of christian theism values faith.. "without faith it is impossible to please god, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists" - heb.11.

faith and evidence are inversely proportional - the more evidence there is that god exists the less faith you need in that proposition and vice-versa.. so how can a christian criticise any other faith-based belief?

for example they can protest that all the evidence is against the claims of scientology, but that just means that scientologists require more faith than christians.

Skedaddle

Thank you Simon for pointing that out. I believe all religions to be false, yes.

18

Why all the secrecy in Gods organisation?

by Truthexplorer in

looking back and seeing all the secrecy and cover ups throughout wt history such as the secret elders books, the branch correspondence guidelines, the shameful lying and deceipt exposed during the arc questioning, the in-house way of dealing with things, the lack of openness to the media on issues such as blood or child abuse or anything controversial for that matter.

could this relate in some way to russell's alleged past as a freemason?

it seems quite strange that the founder of the bible students quite possibly may have been a freemason, (an organisation well known for its secrecy).

Skedaddle

Are the GB freemasons? Possibly

Are the GB just men who are sincerely dumb? Possibly

Are the GB sincere men who are dumb and just handed an organization to run from a mason past? Possibly

Are the GB sincere men but work alongside without knowing, freemasons who are pulling strings? Possibly

Is the whole concept of Watchtower a false religion based on very controversial teachings and beliefs that resonates with certain secret societies some of whom have a bigger plan or agenda, still to this day? YES!

Whatever the story is, as my sister pointed out to me, some policies can't be changed due to the amount of people who would sue their asses. Blood policy is one, two witness rule is another. But indeed, it may not be the only motivation.

56

Why Faith is Self-Defeating

by cofty in

the god of christian theism values faith.. "without faith it is impossible to please god, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists" - heb.11.

faith and evidence are inversely proportional - the more evidence there is that god exists the less faith you need in that proposition and vice-versa.. so how can a christian criticise any other faith-based belief?

for example they can protest that all the evidence is against the claims of scientology, but that just means that scientologists require more faith than christians.

Skedaddle

Faith is the tool of all false religions that JUST wants FOLLOWERS.

False religions use this tool by trying to block the path to God. One way is by putting themselves physically between followers and God (think GB, Pope, etc.) Another way is to ingrain a simplistic understanding of what God is, who God is (think the various versions of God or Gods as a seperate entity to us, jesus, satan, the holy spirit, animals, plants, planets, the universe... and a God who has the traits of man (Anthropomorphism).

Faith has no place in the true belief in God. Why? Because true belief in god has moved from the place of faith, which is unstable, to KNOWING. This KNOWING is not a place that has a return to the place of faith. KNOWING is a place that starts from an undetermined point of connection (because the point is unique to the individual), to total absolution of absorption becoming at one.

To be forced into proving that God exists to another person is not something that any one of us can do unless we ourselves are near to absolution or to put it another way, close to becoming at one with God. I say close to because if we were to be at one with God absolutely, we would no longer be visible to the naked eye of the human. Widely recognized true ''prophets'' (Jesus (Not the Christian version), Mohammed (Not the Muslim version), Moses (Not the Christian version) etc.) across the world and throughout history were on the path to absolution. It is the path of endless possibilities and rendered messages to us that were of the same sort. There was a need to write these messages down to provide just one chance of a gate to the way as it is already known that many would distort the words but this gate is only the shortcut, it is NOT the only way for the way that always exists and will always exist was born into us and that is the ability to ''read'' - this ''reading'' is not of written words, it's the other kind, interpret.

Unless we are at total absolution or at one with God we cannot comprehend 100% what God is, for if we could we would be God but this is not a deterrent to try and do so but rather our mission to do so if one chooses to do so. We know that no two people are born exactly the same and our experience of life is different for every one of us. We live different varying experiences of love and evil and no two experiences are felt the same way by any one of us due to varying levels of understanding so how is it possible for one person to tell another person what God is? It is not our plight or it should not be our plight for it is not needed and if we were to do so, would be asking that person to have ''faith'' in us, the one telling. Our only plight should be to show you the way to ''read'' what God is or who God is for yourself (It's this place where GB, Pope etc insert themselves). It is up to the individual to connect. However, some have come to the ''level'' of understanding or interpretation that is close to absolute oneness, These ones were (incorrectly) called prophets but this word is incorrect for they were not sent (this is a false religion concept) they aspired and became. They were interpreters or relayers or another similar word. There is no need for another, unless the word from the last one is removed to just ONE person who does not tell another (This is a point for further discussion for anyone who believes that there is a force behind trying to make this happen) and there was no need for the first one until the capacity of understanding was enough (evolution). It can be understood therefore that Adam and Eve or the various notions that exist of them were the first with capacity (the capacity to name something else) and NOT the first as in created whole as a finished intelligent human capable of understanding or interpreting God.

Therefore, we don't need faith to believe that God exists - there's simply no use for it. It is a man-made invention to corrupt. For if you have faith you have not come to KNOW God, you have only put faith into another's word of what he/they understand as God or what he/they want you to understand.

Just FYI; I am not talking from the standpoint of any Religion (and certainly not my own). I don't assign myself a follower of any religion. They are only the ones who have the gate but can't find the gate... or who know of the gate but cover it. The path is beyond the gate. ''Read'' ''meditate'' ''pray'' ''be'' (the gates) but not through (something else or someone else), TO (directly)!

(I have no spell/grammar checker on this foreign computer, please excuse any errors.)