Posts by scratchme1010

22

I have a theory related to the cult spectrum

by ILoveTTATT2 in

jw
friends

translating jwfacts into spanish has made me critically analyze pretty much everything paul has written.

i would say paul is right 90%+ of the time.

some things are just things that are outdated, on other occasions, things are partially right and just need to be tweaked.anyhow... one of the articles is "where else would i go"?since i am an atheist, ideally, for me, the answer would be "become at least agnostic, if not atheist, and lead an evidence-based life".

scratchme1010

Cults become cults in the BITE model sense because they are different and "persecuted". Once they become mainstream, they let go of the cult characteristics and become a healthy church, but at the cost of losing their "non-mainstream" views.

I'm not 100% sure that it's that cut and dry. First, I haven't heard of any high demand, controlling group, such as cults, that has made changes to become a mainstream religion. In fact, one of the characteristics of a cult is precisely that they choose to diverge from mainstream religion, and their "out of the ordinary" teachings attract people, which becomes their signature.

As an example, I don't think that the word "disfellowship" is going away any time soon from the WT, just like the word "defoo" will be retired from another cult I know uses that word.

Cults don't "lose their mainstream views", their non-traditional views is one of their core characteristics. Some organizations evolve into cults, but the opposite hasn't happened (as far as I know).

Could you think of any christian denomination that teaches non-mainstream stuff and is NOT a cult in the BITE model sense?

My sister in law and her husband are involved in this Christian organization that has had some non-traditional events, one of them in a theater. It was explained to me second hand, but as I understand, they asked people to take their shoes off and leave them in the theater and return to their homes barefoot. Not sure what the point of that was.

Non-traditional practices do exist in mainstream religious organizations. As per the BITE model, the difference is not the B, I,T or E words, but their modifiers which is one word, control. Many things can be done in the spirit of providing healthy spirituality to people, for as long as there's no intention of controlling, as you state, I see no reason to see them as unnecessary.

And of course, please keep in mind that all the things in the BITE model occur to people once in the cult. People don't submit themselves to control voluntarily (I mean, under normal conditions). People always neglect to consider why many people actually join those groups, which have everything to do with what they feel, not with what they know. When they join they know nothing, but feel something.

Also, I'd like to ask, if I may:

Christadelphians? Cult.
JW's? Cult
Mormons? Cult
SDA's? If they are strict, Cult.
Bible Students? Cult
Iglesia Ni Cristo? Cult
Two-By-Two's? Cult
Christian Scientists? Cult
Worldwide Church of God? Cult

Where does that come from?

33

Can the dead hear?

by AmyWatson916 in

the "what does the bible really teach?

" book says we cannot speak to the dead (page 64) and that the dead do not hear (page 58) but on page 68 the book has jesus talking to a dead man and the dead man apparently hearing and responding.

the same thing happens on page 69 when peter talks to a dead woman and the dead woman apparently hears and responds.

scratchme1010

Can the dead hear?

No, they are dead.

29

The Ultimate Conversion

by Etude in

one thing that surprised me shortly after joining this site was the number of individuals who, after experiencing the deception of being a jw and the hypocrisy of the “truth”, switched to being catholic or “born-again” evangelists.

it seemed to me like jumping from the hot pan into the fire.. i don’t want to piss anyone off for his or her choices.

i feel everyone is free to believe what they may.

scratchme1010

Etude, what I have come to learn is that people have needs, other than learning something about god, or the bible. Again, most people join religious organization because of what they feel, not for what they know.

People have other needs that may trump reason or doctrine. Some people need to belong to something, need to have some structure in their lives that they cannot come up with themselves, need a sense of community, need a sense of certainty, are too disappointed with the state of affairs in the world, feel like there are good role models to follow in the organization they join, feel close to other family members who are devoted to the church they go to, like the opportunities to socialize and events that they provide, feel that the church setting helps them stay away from drugs and other behaviors, or simply feel that the only way they can feels any spirituality is by having a community place where they can go.

The list of reasons are endless and VALID. In fact, JWs who join know nothing about what the WT teaches. They join because of what they feel. They learn what they believe later. Their feelings is what governs their decision of joining a religious organization.

14

Where did Jesus plug in the blow dryer?

by compound complex in

greetings!.

looking at images of jesus lookalikes, i found a vaguely familiar item!.

http://althouse.blogspot.com/2013/03/what-does-jesus-look-like.html.

scratchme1010

Greetings!
Looking at images of Jesus lookalikes, I found a vaguely familiar item!

Hey, sexiness sells. I'd be the bride of that Jesus.

10

Jehovah's Witnesses: DO THEY FACE REALITY

by TerryWalstrom in

article

1.the organization itself denies access to reality and substitutes its own version, interpretations, and meanings.

a.only watchtower approved publications are allowed.

scratchme1010

Jehovah's Witnesses: DO THEY FACE REALITY

No. That's what religions and cults are about, not facing reality.

18

Maybe you can help with this?

by vienne in

as some of you know, i'm not a witness, but i am the co-author of a series of history book that discuss the watch tower's earliest years.

russell mentions a 'brother' van der ahe as an early days wt evangelist.

we can't identify him.

scratchme1010

I wish I could help. I'd like to know when you find out.

7

So poopie decided to go to meeting today so poopie now say

by poopie in

jw
friends

after a long long time after today's wt i can finally say hello to df ones because they are made in gods image yes i can even ask how they are doing without feare i will get df because if an elder walks up i will pull out trusty wt that says fellow humans deserve hover and respect..

scratchme1010

Good for you (I guess).

16

How much time and money did we waste traveling to meetings alone?

by longgone in

quick answer: way too much!.

this is something that really gets to me, all the way back to my childhood.

twenty minutes each way, three times a week.

scratchme1010

Twenty minutes each way, three times a week. Month after month. Year after year. Wow. Plus the wear on the vehicle. That money could have gone toward food and clothes which we were already short of.

I wish it was at least that! As as have posted, my uber JW father felt that he had to be more devoted than anyone. He volunteered to use his own vehicle to transport people to/from the KH. to do that he made two and sometimes three trips to/from the KH taking people. Of course, he would take us his family first, so we were at the KH at 5pm for the 7pm meeting. Also we were the last people to leave as he would take the others he transported first, meaning that we were still in the KH at 10:30pm, sometimes 11pm waiting for him to come pick us up.

He saw absolutely nothing wrong with that, still to this day he doesn't. I refuse to even look at how much it costed him in gas and time, but the largest cost was in the resentment that he got from his own family, all for his attitude that he always had to do more than the rest.

11

This is a txt message I just had with a JW

by joe134cd in

the following is a txt message i just had with a jw about why i decided not to attend meeting.

i fully realize that this will get me blocked.. jw : you dont want to answer me why you dont go to the meetings.. joe : ok.. (1) the 2 witness rule in the handling of a accusations of child sex abuse.. (2)the covering it up and out of court settlements that they are making to victims of sexual abuse.

unfortunatley the brothers and sisters are totally unaware of what is going on and the magnitude of it.. (3) the comments of geoffrey jackson when testifying before the australian royal commision on its handling of child sex abuse.

scratchme1010

Conversation ends and I am yet to get a reply. So I'm guessing I'll either be blocked or get the imperfect humans reply. I fully realize many here will tell me this is the wrong approach, but I needed to vent.

I think time will tell about that being the best approach. That is how you feel, those are your thoughts, so I personally see nothing wrong with that approach.

Also, I know that we call it a conversation, but those lame reaching out attempts are unilateral. they ask questions but not with any interest in anything you have to say. Their purpose is a mixture of curiosity, they want to know what you thin, but only with the purpose of determining how they will treat you from than point on, not because they have any interest in you.

If you asked me, you got a whole lot of nosy brainwashed inappropriate people off your back.

1

TED talk on education

by zeb in

i have been viewing the ted talks.

a huge range of topics schools of thought religions and races.. take a look at this one.. https://www.ted.com/talks/karim_abouelnaga_a_summer_school_kids_actually_want_to_attend.

hugs.

scratchme1010

So much of our education reform is driven by a sympathetic approach, where people are saying, "Let's go and help these poor inner city kids, or these poor black and Latino kids," instead of an empathetic approach, where someone like me, who had grown up in this environment, could say, "I know the adversities that you're facing and I want to help you overcome them."

That's the best line of the talk. I know that even with the best of intentions, this "talk down" attitude that decision makers have towards education in this country is causing harm and has proven to be ineffective.

Great talk. Very inspiring.