Posts by TheLiberator

8

Helping My Children

by TheLiberator in

i try not to think about it everyday but every now and then i seem to get very down about the fact that i see my adoptive children being raised as jehovah's witnesses.

they are 10 and 13 years of age.

my wife continues to raise them in this religion.

I try not to think about it everyday but every now and then I seem to get very down about the fact that I see my adoptive children being raised as Jehovah's Witnesses. They are 10 and 13 years of age. My wife continues to raise them in this religion. And they seem to like what they are experiencing. Dad is viewed as a person of the world, someone that does not love Jehovah.

I always wonder if later on, if they discovered TTATT, that they will either hate their mother because she did not listen to their father concerning this religion , or hate us both. Hate me for not forcing them to know what this religion is all about. It really breaks my heart when I think about how strange of a life they actually are living right now. I want to somehow explain things to them but they are young and this can make waves. But I can't handle the thought of them finding out the real truth perhaps late in life and realizing that Dad was correct. This could have devastating effects on them and I just can't think about what would go through their mind.

What have you been doing or what would you do in such a situation? Life is too precious to waste. I always thought that maybe when they graduate from high school, I will give them an envelope that will read the Greatest Gift. Inside it will be a short story you could say, perhaps somewhat poetic in nature explaining how important it is to protect your life from other people ruling over it. And how precious freedom is and how we need to research something that affects our life so greatly,before we continue to follow it. It it would not be an attack on the Watchtower.

The boy is a very highly intellectual boy. He has the traits of a genius. His IQ is beyond the average child in school. He is one that I believe would listen to me even now. I always wonder if I should speak with him in private. I feel that he could even keep our conversations secret. But of course I don't think that this would go over too well. He is a child, and we would quickly see changes in him and my wife would know that I said something. But honestly I just can't handle seeing my children waste their life. I just know that they are not going to think too well of their parents,if and when they find out.

8

You Need to Heal

by TheLiberator in

it has been awhile since i posted.

but i wanted to say a few things that may help those recovering from the watchtower, especially if you have just discovered ttatt.

it is with humility that i come here to express these thoughts.

TheLiberator

It has been awhile since i posted. But I wanted to say a few things that may help those recovering from the Watchtower, especially if you have just discovered TTATT. It is with humility that I come here to express these thoughts. The Liberator (also known as Vinman previously) often would talk much of the Bible. I would see people hurting and I wanted to fill their void. I even tried promoting a non-high control group that had similar beliefs as JW's. As a deeply indoctrinated overzealous witness, I quickly set out to find answers to my questions and I tried to channel my former zeal into my new belief system. I hadn't even recovered myself, but was trying to help others.

My enthusiasm though was not real. I felt that if I displayed that kind of attitude, the feelings would eventually kick in. I attended my Bible study group and continued studying the Bible online. But everytime I came home from that group, I felt very depressed and lonely. I would try to read the Bible and it would have the same affect. I studied about five hours everyday for almost two years trying to find answers. Of course I found many answers. But the truth is, you can find any support for whatever opinion you want online.

My older children are out and they just now started celebrating all the holdays with my two grandchildren. The fact is, while I was still in limbo, trying to figure things out, my children were far happier than me. I just couldn't figure it out. I almost went to a therapist. But a friend of mine sent me a link that helped me see my situation.

What I learned and had to be painfully honest about, is that in the Watchtower, my God was the Watchtower. I didn't consciously know that, but it is typical cult mind control. That was the real problem.

As I read the Bible, I couldn't get the Watchtower out of my head. God's voice and Bible characters mimicked the Bible dramas of the society. When I attended my small church, I knew why I was there. I was replacing the Watchtower.

If you are a born-in, you were put into this claustrophobic box that controlled your thoughts and actions. You never chose that box, your parents did. Now I escaped from that tiny box and found great freedom. But the problem is, you are now in a bigger box (Christianity). The painful truth is, you never chose that box either. Some feel they must remain in that box to prove that not all leave God after the Watchtower. It is a form of pride.

But the situation is far more complex than the Watchtower portrays it. IT IS TRULY A CULT. It finally hit me that I was still recovering. I can't help what I feel when I read the Bible or attend a study group. I don't want to feel this way. God knows I tried. But I am a victim of spiritual abuse, and I can't let pride take over and act like I stood by God's side after Watchtower and everything is fine. I have been lonely and lost since leaving. The cult had left its mark on me. It is what it is.

If I continue on this course, I will never feel happy. I will feel like a "weak witness" who is not pleasing the gb, but never begins to live either. In addition, what has driven me in this direction, ironically, are the things that should of helped. I appreciated Berean Pickets website, but it made things very confusing. Everyone spoke of their beliefs with much certainty. You can't do that. It is ALL opinion. I also realize, that while I would have died for the Watchtower, I do not have the certainty to be killed by ISIS. No way would I die as a Christian for them.

I will never bash the Bible or Christianity. I have no reason to. Besides, I could be very wrong. I must remain humble. I do not want a title, such as agnostic. No need for that. The point is, you do not have to polarize yourself. This is not just about God, it is about you. The human brain can only handle so much.

I am a "mentally sick" victim of a cult. YOU MUST ALLOW TIME TO PASS IN ORDER TO HEAL. It is vital that you do not claim ownership to the larger box. You need to let go and realize that you can CHOOSE that "box" later. But, now IS NOT THE TIME. IT IS A VERY IMPORTANT PART OF THE HEALING PROCESS. It is not my fault that I was dominated by a cult for 44 years.

So for the sake of healing, I have just text my children, telling them that I want to fulfill all of my childhood dreams through the eyes of my grandchildren. They are three and one years old. I want to fully embrace Christmas, Halloween, July 4th, you name it. I want to visit haunted houses on Halloween. We will go through the haunted house at Disneyland. We will run through corn mazes. I will celebrate birthdays. I will do a good deed and say "Merry Christmas". I will fulfill my oppressed desires to watch horror films. 2017 will be a good year. I will see the happy faces of my grandchildren who will experience color in there life and not that gray dreary overcast of a witness knocking on doors on a holiday. Grandpa will be a real grandpa that will be loved.

I have no fear of my choices. I do not have to be a death oriented Watchtower automaton. Life and death happens no matter who you are. We are all in this together. We are a part of a greater community.

I am not alone now. My children and their wives and grandchildren are my friends. By embracing this reality and not fighting the healing process, I am lonely no more.

DO NOT RUN FROM THE WATCHTOWER INTO THE BIGGER BOX. Your exit is your birthday. You simply have not lived yet. YOU NEED TO BE IN CHARGE OF ALL CHOICES. I never believed in my life that i would draw this conclusion. I now have greater respect for many here on this site. Especially those that don't speak with such certainty on matters that are open to various interpretations and opinions.

7

My Freedom as an "Apostate"

by TheLiberator in

just curious.

how many of you are "apostates", but not disfellowshipped?

i know this happens if you keep this stuff secret.

TheLiberator

Just curious. How many of you are "apostates", but not disfellowshipped? I know this happens if you keep this stuff secret.

But the fact is, the elders in my old hall know my anger and hatred for the Watchtower. I have vocalized this. My wife regularly attends meetings and I know for a fact that I am the talk of the circuit and many in the district. I have only been out less than two years.

A strong warning talk was given early on. The message of that spread far and wide like fire. Everyone knows that I influenced my two baptized sons to get out of the organization. I send "daily texts" to my mom to try to wake her up. I have openly slammed the Watchtower extensively online. I openly express TTATT to those who I feel are showing "cracks" in there armor.

I simply have no fear. Yet the elders have made zero contact. I know of some possible reasons, but even they do not hold water. Have any of you had a similar experience?

24

If you could speak to your former self, what would you say?

by LoveUniHateExams in

if you, knowing ttatt, could go back in time and speak to your former jw self, what would you say to wake yourself up from the wt religion?.

i would speak to my unbaptised publisher self.

at that stage, i believed.

TheLiberator

What would you do, if you allowed your son, daughter, or wife to die, due to not allowing blood transfusions, and then you discover TTATT a year later?

44

What crime should elders report?

by kramer in

jw
friends

so, i am trying to get my head around what the right position of elders should be when they come across crime is.. i think i get the issuess around clergy confidentiality - and how that might potentially be breached when they talk about it to other elders, let alone the police.. but if people are saying that elders - or clergy of another faith should report crime to the police when it is confessed to the, then where are the boundaries.. so if someone says they should report to police on a confessed example of child abuse, that's one thing.. how about reporting to police consensual sex between a 19year old and 15 year old - which is statutory rape in the uk.

how about criminal fraud if they come across it.

assault on a congregant?.

TheLiberator

It makes no difference what the law requires the elders to do. We are not talking about just any legal entity here. We are talking about an organization that claims to be God's organization.

They may say that they technically did the right thing or what is minimally required by law, but did they do the GOOD thing for the victim? In addition no matter what the crime is, you are talking about an organization that claims to be from God, and so it is by necessity they need to think first of the victim. They need to stop thinking about their stupid image and do what is right AND GOOD. God requires us to go beyond the bare minimum.

Clergy confidentiality should mean nothing to the Watchtower. They are supposed to be the most loving organization. They are supposed to do what is good for the victim. They have failed at this. They have failed at their God-given responsibility.

Maybe they should start applying the scriptures that they cram down other people's throats. Namely:

1 Corinthians: 10. 23. "All things are lawful for me," but not all things are profitable. "All things are lawful for me," but not all things build up. 24. Let no one seek his own, but each one his neighbor's good."

Galatians: 5. 22. "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, GOODNESS, faith, ..."

12

"What is in it for me."

by stuckinarut2 in

jw
friends

so if there was no promise of a "reward" for faithfulness...no paradise...no eternal life etc, how many witnesses would stick with the "faith"?.

sure, the reward might be "making god happy", but he supposedly holds out the paradise promise with eternal life as an incentive right?.

before anyone says, that's what satans challenge regarding job was about, just think.

TheLiberator

Agree with Perry.

1 Corinthians: 15. 32. If I fought with animals at Ephesus for human purposes, what does it profit me? If the dead are not raised, then "let us eat and drink, for tomorrow we die."

That's pretty much how Paul fealt.

5

The "Fellowship of Sufferings"

by Perry in

jw
friends

i came across this title phrase while reading a daily devotional one morning and it reminded me of this discussion board.

there really is a fellowship of sufferings here.

never since adolph hitler has an organization done so much to destroy families as the watchtower has done.

TheLiberator

"But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ. Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ..."

Those words I have on the home screen of my phone. It is a reminder as to why my mom cut me off. And yes, I count all things that I have lost as dung. In fact, Christ has taken all pain away. Everything lost, seems nothing compared to the "excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord".

"Thanks to God through Jesus Christ my Lord."

113

New letter, re: Fully Utilizing Kingdom Hall Auditoriums

by suavojr in

jw
friends

let the merging begin!!!.

to all bodies of elders in the united states branch territory.

re: fully utilizing kingdom hall auditoriums.

TheLiberator

Here in my area, in the state of Washington, a merge with my old hall is happening. They dissolved one English and combined them with my old congregation. The Spanish are also in that same hall. So now they have three congregations meeting in a very small hall. And now, the two territories are humongous. It was already a tight squeeze in that hall. Sign of the times.

41

Convention Weirdness

by BlackWolf in

jw
friends

well i just got back from 3 days in hell, and geez was this convention strange or what?

im sure someone's probably made a topic about this already but i can't believe that there weren't any new releases besides the movies.

has that ever happened before?

TheLiberator

BlackWolf said: "there was nothing about going out in service or experiences that people had like usual."

That to me is the weirdest part of your OP. Something is brewing.

19

Is Knowing/Using The Name Of God Important?

by Vanderhoven7 in

i say no.. although the tetragrammaton appears close to 7000 times in the hebrew scriptures, the personal name of god does not.

seems to me that god made sure that both that his personal name does not appear therein and that no one would ever actually know it or learn even how to pronounce it.

he also made sure that his name (baring 3 hallelujahs in revelation) did not appear in the new testament.

TheLiberator

That is one subject that I just couldn't understand after discovering TTATT. But now it makes sense, and now I only use his name in a very specific or discerning way, especially in prayer.

For the believer, he is there Father. For everyone else, he is Yahweh. Now when I read the OT, it is clear, that those in God's favor were his "friends", and only his sons in the sense that he is there creator. But then Jesus introduced the Father, or we could say it more affectionately, daddy. Paul made that point when he used the expression"Abba Father".

Also, Paul used many scriptures that were originally applied to Yahweh, in connection with Jesus Christ. (This is what leads many to the trinity, but I have a different view). So now, God wants all attention to be on His Son. Now I appreciate scriptures like this even more today: Mark: 9. 7. "A cloud came, overshadowing them, and a voice came out of the cloud, "This is my beloved Son. Listen to him.""

What I never discerned before, is how each religion, has it's "main" doctrine they focus on. Seventh Day Adventists, Pentecostals, Christian Scientists, etc. For Jw's, it was the name, the name, the name, the name...... It feels so good to now understand such a simple concept. But until they wake up, this subject is beyond the grasp of Jw's.