Posts by DavePerez

39

Does JESUS Have Wings?

by Cold Steel in

the jehovah's witnesses believe jesus is an angel.

they also apparently believe that angels have wings.

jesus was a spirit being before he was born, we're told, and he was resurrected as a spirit (even though jesus insisted he wasn't a spirit), then does he still have his [ring bell] wings?

DavePerez

BOC said:

What the hell good would wings do you in heaven anyway? As far as I know, there's no air up there, showings are pretty ineffectual.

Yeah, but you're forgetting angels need to also fly in Earth's atmosphere. Aha!!

But yeah, that inefficient design lacking jet propulsion really doesn't support the whole 'intelligent designer' claim, does it? You'd think the creator would've worked out the aerodynamics of wings and such with the angels, before proceeding with the dodo?

Oh, well: practice makes perfect, right?

184

A picture so outrageous, it deserves its own thread...

by cedars in

i mean no disrespect to sd-7 or his fine thread on which this picture has already featured, but i think it is just so ridiculous that it deserves a thread all of its own.. lurkers and apologists, this is how your precious organization views itself.... behold the madness.... .

.

cedars.

DavePerez

Alan V said:

As for the fact there is no Jesus here, some have given reasons why he may not be, but it is strange I admit.

Isn't the Kenny Rogers base jumper figure supposed to represent Jesus, the master returning to inspect how the head slave was taking care of the other domestics while he was away (and I don't understand why he can't just look down at Earth from the edge of the platform, just to keep an eye on things? Is Jesus highly myopic or something?) That's what I'd guess, but it looks like he's not wearing a nametag or football jersey (unless someone wants to take a look under high-power magnification?), so that explanation seems as likely as any.

BTW, the JW's don't need to dispose of Jesus anytime soon, eliminating him from their theology: the mortal man has been dead for 2,000 yrs, and it turns out that someone being dead works really well for those who'd like to manage their image.

It's just like how a dead famous person is a much-safer merchandising bet as an celebrity endorser vs someone who is alive, since the dead celebrity cannot tarnish their legacy. Think of Lance Armstrong: he would've died a hero if only he had been hit by a car before the doping scandal emerged. He didn't die, of course, but the doping scandal emerged and now manufacturers are dropping his endorsements like he's radioactive waste. Marilyn Monroe's estate continues to make HUGE amounts of money by licensing out rights to use her image in commercials, etc. She is a solid-gold generator of $$$, not only now, but for likely for a few centuries.

Similarly, Jesus doesn't represent a threat to the GB: he lives on in the concept of Jesus, and they control the interpretation of the Bible, and hence his image for their followers. The GB is not threatened by him, in the least (unless some blood doping scandal were to emerge from archaeological digs in Jerusalem, showing he may have used steroids, which would explain the rage he displayed in the table-overturning hissy fit incident).

BTW, the irony is most of us (me included) probably didn't give JW theology as much thought while we were in, LOL!

184

A picture so outrageous, it deserves its own thread...

by cedars in

i mean no disrespect to sd-7 or his fine thread on which this picture has already featured, but i think it is just so ridiculous that it deserves a thread all of its own.. lurkers and apologists, this is how your precious organization views itself.... behold the madness.... .

.

cedars.

DavePerez

Alan V said:

But it is probably still true that most dubs have no idea who they are or what qualifications they may have for the job.

Yup.

Perhaps the title of this thread should be something more like:

Breaking News! Evidence Uncovered That Proves WTBTS Spreads Their Beliefs In Their Publications!

Now sure, I can see that. And why would you expect anything else?

In journalism, this is a "dog bites man" story, ie that which is expected. The REAL noteworthy story would be if WT ran something OTHER than the expected (eg showed a pix of YHWH smoking a cigarette, etc). Now THAT would be newsworthy and outrageous. But suggesting they're subtly trying to introduce subtle position shifts to the rank and file via their artwork? A bit reminiscent of those who look for subliminal messages (clawed hands, etc) buried in the WT artwork to create vast conspiracies involving Free Masons, etc.

This same image has been scrutinized as the subject of at least two other threads over the past few days, and this is the first time (AFAIK) that someone with an eagle eye (good pick-up, BTW!) has pointed out the presence of identifiable GB members in it.

But look at it this way: if 'apostates' scrutinizing the image with a fine-tooth comb and looking for something to ridicule have only noticed it NOW, what are the odds that the average JW is going to: 1) notice it, or, 2) care?

Any JW who has problems accepting this most-central JW tenet (ie that the GB is God's Earthly representatives) would likely not have a problem seeing the concept depicted in a graphical representation: they 'buy' into it. And if anyone inside dared to stand up and voice their doubts, they'd quickly be DFed. So it's not really an issue to anyone, except those struggling with the basic policy of GB = FDS.

Hint: the WT is not trying to present this image to convince anyone who knows TTATT. Those people (apostates) have already voted with their feet, and are to be shunned by active JWs.

FWIW, I see the art and have to laugh: I bet if you showed it to the average person on the street who didn't know anything about the source or JW theology, most would ask what comic book it was from, LOL!

In fact, there's an interesting idea for an video to make, taking the image without captions or revealing it's source, and asking total strangers on the street to explain what message the image conveys to them, AKA a reaction video. Then the interviewer can offer the actual JW interpretation, and watch their reaction. Now THAT would be useful video for active JWs to see, showing them how the World sees their policy as nutty. But even there, some people's persecution complexes are so strong, they will just go into seeing themselves as targets of others.

Not that it matters, anyway: this is all just a matter of personal opinion, and people are free to assign whatever significance they wish to assign to such images. If anyone feels it is a persuasive argument working against the WT, then they are free to think that: everyone is entitled to their opinion (including those they are trying to convince).

Regards,

David

44

California TV Personality Huell Howser Dead at Age 67

by kurtbethel in

jw
friends

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/huell-howser-death-california-gold-185922911.html.

.

DavePerez

Yeah, Lisa, he would not be familiar to those who don't watch PBS, as that's the network over which his show was broadcast. I wonder if his death will broaden his audience even wider? His shows are available on DVDs, which should be easy to locate on the net.

Interesting comments, which I totally agree with: I learned more about towns and places in CA from watching his show than from visiting, or even LIVING in the towns. Of course, he'd get special access to sites not available to just any average citizen (like the trip to the top of the pyramid of the Transamerica Building in SF: it was funny, as you could feel the slightly uneasy fear of heights that he was feeling. Or the tunnel under Lake Arrowhead, that even many locals aren't aware of its existence).

MAN! Soooo many great episodes, and what a life truly well-spent.

30

WT 4/15 GB: narcissism in high functioning individuals (big ego or severe disorder)

by Gorbatchov in

jw
friends

there is anonther topic about the new organizational sheet of the jw organisation.. it's nice to see the gb (=fds) on top of the earthly part of it.

read some interesting information about the.

severe disorder they must have:.

DavePerez

Prologos, yeah, the Kenny Rogers dude defo looks like a base jumper, lol! Actually, if you look really closely on the top of YHWH's angel carrier, there's white fluffy clouds sitting on the surface, and the one on the right especially looks F-4ish or Starfighter..... On the other hand, it's probably like a Rohrsach test, where what we see it as says something about us?

30

WT 4/15 GB: narcissism in high functioning individuals (big ego or severe disorder)

by Gorbatchov in

jw
friends

there is anonther topic about the new organizational sheet of the jw organisation.. it's nice to see the gb (=fds) on top of the earthly part of it.

read some interesting information about the.

severe disorder they must have:.

DavePerez

Huh. Anyone else seeing that art like it was inspired by an aircraft carrier, with an angelic F-4 Phantom or F-104 Starfighter taxiing for take-off on either side of YHWH?

It sure seems like YHWH is able to dispatch angels (who look alot like Michael McDonald or Kenny Rogers!) configured in attack mode, headed out on sorties, while most angelic hands are waiting below deck for their mission.

44

California TV Personality Huell Howser Dead at Age 67

by kurtbethel in

jw
friends

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/huell-howser-death-california-gold-185922911.html.

.

DavePerez

Kurt said:

I don't know that he was openly gay. There was no mention of this on his official site, or the wiki entry on him. I saw a few internet claims by anonymous people who said he was gay. My "gaydar" pinged a bit when I saw him, but since he chose to be private about who and how he loved, I respect his privacy and did not give that much more thought. I hope that whoever he shared his life with brought him much happiness and fulfillment, just as he enriched many people by documenting and sharing his road trip adventures.

Yeah, that's a valid good point, as "openly gay" was perhaps overstating it (in that he never made any big media announcement of it or the like, and was content to live in a "glass closet", as was his right). Huell emerged in an era and part of the country much less tolerant of homosexuality than today (a Tennessee boy, who served in the USMC and became a newscaster), and reasonably didn't want his orientation to overshadow or cloud his work: people discriminate.

That stated, personally knowing a few who work in the L.A. entertainment industry (where he was based) who ARE gay, it's long been accepted and known within the local gay community. The first video on this page shows the NBC LA news broadcast of his death announcement, featuring an interview with openly gay KPCC radio host, John Rabe (and most LA viewers who know who them already know the unstated message):

http://lgbtpov.frontiersla.com/2013/01/08/californias-ambassador-of-wonder-huell-howser-dies/

But again, to let that overshadow his life's accompishments would be undermining that which he wanted everyone to focus on: the ideas he presented, and not him (Huell was the antihesis of a "star", instead shunning fame). As a communicator, he didn't want his personal life to ecclipse his work (which actually IS the goal of those seeking acceptance of groups: a world where it isn't even an issue).

30

WT 4/15 GB: narcissism in high functioning individuals (big ego or severe disorder)

by Gorbatchov in

jw
friends

there is anonther topic about the new organizational sheet of the jw organisation.. it's nice to see the gb (=fds) on top of the earthly part of it.

read some interesting information about the.

severe disorder they must have:.

DavePerez

Phizzy said:

That picture really encapsulates the huge arrogance and egos of the GB, how demeaning to the others pictured to put themselves at the top

Surely a slave should be right at the bottom ?????

Remember that the parable co-opted by the GB of the worshippers of YHWH would place them in the role of the master slave, left in charge of the other domestic slaves: think of a slave who was promoted to slave-driver.

Has Jesus been thrown under the same bus as CT Russell ? Jesus is not evidently important in the scheme of things. Although I can vaguely make him out sitting at the RH of Jehoober as he has idly been doing for 99 years, lazy bugger.

You also can make out the four wheels of that hot-rod jalopy, great for layin' some patches and doin' brodies!

44

California TV Personality Huell Howser Dead at Age 67

by kurtbethel in

jw
friends

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/huell-howser-death-california-gold-185922911.html.

.

DavePerez

That's a great picture of him, kneeling over a patch of wildflowers in bloom at the Antelope Valley Wildflower Preserve.

What a true sweetheart of a man, the living embodiment of the message of Elohim through exploration of a State that abounds with natural beauty that he was able to share with many in the Nation, via PBS. What a wonderful life...

Ps some may not have known that Huell was openly gay, and hence destined to die at Armageddon (per JW's YHWHist doctrines). Who is the bad guy again, exactly, such men as Huell, or those fervently praying for the destruction of such a positive force in the World?

73

New York Times Essay - The Blessings of Atheism

by Band on the Run in

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/06/opinion/sunday/the-blessings-of-atheism.html.

i found this essay today.

it reminds me of obama's first national speech when he pleaded for dems not to let right wing gop fundies define christianity.. how do you create a clickable link in chrome?.

DavePerez

EP said:

I'm rather enjoying the DP interaction too.

They should it on TLC right after Honey Boo-Boo, "Voice Wars"

Proving my point, are you? It's exactly those kind of ego-driven silly comments and "mine's bigger than yours" posters that don't exactly make this an environment conducive to discussions.

Tell you what, TEC: I registered on another "apostate" site (LOL! Love that title: it makes me feel like such a rebel) on the basis of a friend's recommendation (a kid from our local congregation who is now OUT! Thanks to JWN and my posts here, he was able to track me down IRL (I'm apparently not as hard to locate as I thought, LOL!). Pretty cool stuff, indeed.

Hopefully it's not violating any unwritten rule to post a link (which seems hard to imagine: why would anyone not want to share in the "good work" of speaking out against the WTBTS? Brothers in arms, and all that)? But if so, please let me know, and I can edit the link out (but let me know BEFORE the 30 minute time limit!!). If not, then perhaps a mod can kindly remove it, right?

I don't want to step on toes here (well, maybe a few opposable toes that need some opposition (cough! AGuest! cough)..... Just kidding, AGuest: you KNOW Elohim luvs you, right? You ARE the Goliath to his David, the John the Baptist to OUR Savior).

TEC, I'm pretty sure you can read (lurk) there, even if you don't register (as I just did), so I'll post later tonight responding to the questions you asked. But if you want to respond, I think you've got to register ie I don't think they allow anonymous comments, as some websites do. I will continue to post here (as it's got many interesting comments esp in the archives), but likely limit it to short replies (like this).

Regards,

David