Posts by momentofsurrender

50

How many members of our forum are there, and where are most from?

by stuckinarut2 in

i would love to know where most of our fellow forum members are from.... is there a way to compile a quick list?.

for example, i would love to know how many live near me......

What was the most rebellious thing you did while you were a devout jw?

by DuvanMuvan in

jw
friends

i was just thinking about how humans being imperfect and satan's influence was the root of everything bad that anyone has ever done.

well i know that apparently everyone is vulnerable which got me thinking about what "bad" things people have done while they were a jw.

i'll start it off.

momentofsurrender

I joined the Y. I was pioneering and couldn't afford heat and hot water. The Y offered really cheap membership and I was able to get in a hot shower before service every day.

38

"Deep down inside even they know it is BS." Discuss

by rory-ks in

nope, bungi bill's interesting statement from this post didn't take, so i'll start its own.. from my own experience, i hated the field ministry.

it might just be because of the kind of character i am, whatever, i never was able to overcome that feeling of dread every time i went door-to-door.

i felt aware of how much people disliked having strangers cold-calling trying to sell them something.

I can only speak from my own experience here. As a born in, who was doubly isolated by also being home-schooled, I truly believed that we had the truth. When doubts or questions came up I blamed myself - and there was that overwhelming guilt that enshrouded me. There were a few times in an attempt to understand certain reasonings I brought up questions to the elders. I was very sincere. I thought of these elders as men I could trust, one being my own uncle. The result was being severely chastised and basically told never to mention such things again.

Questions such as David not being stoned for adultery and such always received the same yada yada yada...I figured I had to accept the answers because if I didn't it just meant that I was spiritually weak, immature, or not intelligent enough to understand. And they do play the "not intelligent" card quite often - especially when you are a sister.

One of the questions was regarding wearing a hat at one of my bible studies when an 11 year old baptized brother was accompanying me. I was an adult pioneer in my late 20's. I had babysat this kid when he was an infant. It just seemed so unecessary and demeaning. Of course, I didn't bring it up that way. I tried to be the humble and sincere sister wondering about correct protocol. I ended up leaving the conversation in tears because of being completely verbally torn down. I believe that was the last time I ever raised a question. If others have the same experience - of course that are going to end up being beaten down sheeple.

Or, like myself, gradual exposure to a different process of thinking will allow them to take the steps towards healing and development of critical thinking skills.

15

Help needed with some research

by Doug Mason in

i was reading the wts 2103 brochure "how can you have a happy life?".

in section 3, it relies on "professor george zinsmeister, formerly of the university of massachusetts".. at: http://www.masslive.com/news/index.ssf/2012/06/jehovahs_witnesses_coming_to_a.html.

i located reference to:.

momentofsurrender

Same person. I grew up in Western Mass. Br. Zinsmeister's son was my age.

29

WT Mantras / Thought Stoppers

by Ding in

i've been thinking about how the gb controls jws through the use of short phrases or scripture quotes (often partial quotes ripped out of context).. think of the sound-bite responses you know jws are going to give you in response to points you try to make to them.. ones that come to my mind immediately are:.

-- "the light gets brighter and brighter.".

-- "who, then, is the faithful and discreet slave?".

momentofsurrender

Not so much a thought stopper, but definitely a mantra...especially if you are a born in:

"Bad association spoils useful habits"

47

How Many Remember the Mass Skating Rink Parties of the Late 70's ?

by Perry in

jw
friends

they were a hoot weren't they?.

momentofsurrender

In Western Mass (in the 80's - Rollaway Agawam Mass) we used to have them about once a month on Saturday afternoons. I was a pre-teen and young teenager. Then at an assembly or convention they had a talk and suddenly they stopped. They were really something us kids looked forward to. It was a chance to hang out with kids from other congregations. They were supervised, it was a family thing with all age groups represented - many elders were present. I'm sure there probably were cases where things got out of hand at large gatherings -however those who usually got in trouble would have got in trouble somewhere else anyway. As an innocent indoctrinated JW you rationalize that wow these things must really be bad and venues for all kinds of immoral behaviour. As an adult, out of the organization, all I can do is think how taking away such outlets alienates and compartmentalizes so many young ones. If kids don't have the necessary recreation within the organization, they are going to stray outside. The organization is truly, sorry for the term "screwing" themselves.

47

Share the Craziest far out ideas/arguments you have heard about life in the "NEW SYSTEM"

by BU2B in

jw
friends

really the whole thing is ludicrious but it is hilarious and sad at the same time to see grown people arguing about weather there will be cars, planes, eat meat, what about fish, etc in a place as imaginary as oz, yet to them it is reality.. the teaching of a paradise earth was so illogical it really was the first thing that started me on the path to waking up.

just the thought that someone could greet their beloved spouse who had died only to come to the realization that they could never be together again struck me as so cruel, i didnt want to live there even if it was all true.. i have heard jws say they think we might be able to fly, read minds since we will be able to use 100% and some seem to think life would be an endless vacation, with modern conveniences with no thought to all the processes and work that goes into something simple like a pencil.

i love the article jwfacts has on the flaws of any theory or teaching of paradise earth.. what are some things you have heard discussed/argued in car groups, gatherings etc when you were in?.

momentofsurrender

My grandmother believes that in the new system there will be a tree that you can tap and beer will come out. Jehovah will create it especially for my Grandfather that passed away almost 40 years ago, because he loved beer so much. She also believes that she will be married to him again, even though she married again after he died - and that the scriptures that say this isn't true are not meant for her. She is old, but she has pretty much always been that out there about what it is going to be like in the new system. She is going on 65ish years as a witness.

I personally think the beer tree is a pretty cool idea!

84

How do I as a future "Therapist" help ex-jws that won't move on from the WT?

by booker-t in

i am halfway through my master's program in psychology/sociology and plan on being a therapist/sounselor.

i left jw's in 1988 and i have never looked back.

i enjoy my life so much after getting my aa degree, then my ba degree, and now i will soon get my ma degree.

momentofsurrender

If there is nothing else I have learned in the nearly nine years I have been out, it is that each one of us has our own journey. Some can walk away, and never look back. But for many (probably most) of us being in the "truth" was all we ever knew before we left. Many of us have family and friends still in that we love and miss dearly. There can be much ambivalence regarding our choice - perhaps not on the actual leaving, but the consequences - the loss and shunning. When you have never celebrated your birthday or holidays, or attended a 4th of July parade...when you still have nightmares about Armageddon even though you don't actually believe the theology anymore - life can be very confusing. Witnesses use the word "inculcate" when explaining how parents should teach their children the "truth". In Latin the word inculcate is closely associated with trampling and stuffing something in. It is a type of teaching that doesn't just influence the intellect but also penetrates a persons emotional makeup. Normal people can't just forget that stuff and "move on". Those who can I would be much more worried about.

Personally, after being disfellowshipped following 33 years as a JW (born-in), I had to learn a whole new life. I had no idea how to interact with non-witnesses on a friendship level. I didn't even know how to date someone. So, in addition to being shunned and all alone and having 33 years worth of JW theology swimming around in my head, socially I was completely asea. After a few years, I finally found myself on stable ground, but after starting a family a lot of the old feelings started creeping in. Having children brought up many fears about the past and questions about how I was going to handle those fears and past beliefs while attempting to raise my children in a stable loving manner.

This forum is a place for those who have survived experiences in common to come together and vent, help one another, and find their own path. A haven to share all the crap that has been "inculcated" into us. Some might seem to "rehash" things over and over, or show curiosity about Watchtower developments, but you have no idea what their actual lives are like. I find this forum to be educational and comforting. But when I am not on the forum, I live a life. I have a family. I am very busy raising two small children. I have many hobbies and interests, and I also see a professional therapist (who can only help me so much regarding certain issues because she has never been a JW). I am sure it is the same for other members.

I might not be a therapist, but I have been in "therapy" for many years. : ) Those that have helped me the most are the ones that let me talk things out without judgement, and then gave practical advice on ways to occupy my time rather than dwelling on the negative until I could figure out things. They suggested personal research and reading. They didn't expect me to make changes on their timeline. One therapist actually did her own research and told me about this site. She teamed me up with two of her colleagues, one who had left the priesthood, and one that had graduated from divinity school and then became a buddhist. A good therapist is someone who is proactive in helping a person find their own path to healing. Someone who helps their client educate themselves so they can make informed decisions. Empathy and non-judgement are key traits that are needed on a therapists part. Someone of your purported education, who chose to go into the field of psychology should already know this stuff. You cannot expect clients to follow your personal agenda and schedule for "fixing" them. It is very scary that you are already pre-judging ex-JW clients as to how they should feel, and how quickly they should get over things. Maybe due to your past experience you are too close to the subject and should refrain from treating such clients.

36

Introduction - longtime visitor

by momentofsurrender in

just a (slightly) quick introduction for now.

i am a 4th generation born in.

father an elder since i was an infant.

momentofsurrender

Hello,

Just a (slightly) quick introduction for now. I am a 4th generation born in. Father an Elder since I was an infant. Homeschooled most of my childhood. Baptized a few weeks after I turned 13 - regular auxilliary pioneer at 13. I left for a while in my early 20's but was never disfellowshipped. I was back in at 23, and then went on to regular pioneer. I was disfellowshipped almost 9 years ago at age 32, after going to the elders in despair and confessing to misconduct. I had every intention of going back and being reinstated. I truly believed that it was the truth, plus at 32 I lost all my local family and all the friends I had ever known in one fell swoop and couldn't see living out the rest of my life alone.

Desperation led me to seek out new "worldly" friendships in the meantime. Fast forward a few years and I met my now husband. We now have two small children. It was during my pregnancy with my first child that I started researching doctrine. I was trying to figure out how to reconcile the celebration of holidays and birthdays, situations that with a child could no longer just be ignored, with my beliefs that such things were truly evil and from Satan. Visons of my child dying at Armageddon because of my choices disrupted my sleep. Slowly, after much research I was able to find compromises so that such things would not be such crushing issues. That initial research led to further research on other doctrines and beliefs.

At this point, at a little over 40 years of age, I am only in the beginning stages of my spiritual journey. I still am at times plagued with nightmares about Armageddon. My view of religion, the bible, and spirituality continues to evolve. I find this forum to be a comfort. Those who have never been inside just cannot understand. My husband views it as completely bizarre, and often asks if I am making up this stuff. The more I look from the outside in, I cannot help asking myself the same thing.

Anyway, there is a lot more to the story. My childhood family seemed perfect to all in the congregation, but was filled with abuse and violence at home. I suffered for years from depression and social anxiety ...and shame and guilt for not being the happy JW pictured in all the books and magazines.

Some of my immediate family have escaped, some are still diehard jw's. I don't want to return to my former life, but I can't deny missing friends and family that I dearly loved.

That is all for now - the kids are waking up from their naps. : )

63

What were your favorite assembly foods?

by NoRegrets in

so i'm young enough to not remember having hot prepared meals at assemblies, but heard all about it from my parents and the like.

but what i do remember were all of the cold sandwiches and institutional snacks and soda.

remember the food tickets we started to use?

momentofsurrender

Oh man so many to choose from.

Apple danish, burritos, pudding, ... and the soft serve ice cream at the CA's in Natick, MA.