Saintbertholdt

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Posts by Saintbertholdt

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  31

  What Road Would You Choose---IF?

  by John Aquila in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  say you could go back in time to when you were 15 years old.

  no watchtower in your life.

  but the experience you have now you could keep.

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  Saintbertholdt

  Ignore comment: Posted in wrong thread :(
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  15

  A Watchtower quote about apostates I never knew about

  by Saintbertholdt in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  i knew the watchtower didn't like me, but i didn't know they wanted to physically kill me (if they were allowed)from the 15 november 1952 watchtower magazine under questions from readers:.

  in the case of where a father or mother or son or daughter is disfellowshiped, how should such person be treated by members of the family in their family relationship?.

  we are not living today among theocratic nations where such members of our fleshly family relationship could be exterminated for apostasy from god and his theocratic organization, as was possible and was ordered in the nation of israel in the wilderness of sinai and in the land of palestine... (and a bit later)..being limited by the laws of the worldly nation in which we live and also by the laws of god through jesus christ, we can take action against apostates only to a certain extent, that is, consistent with both sets of laws.. so let me get this straight: if our secular pesky laws were not an obstacle and jesus was not in the way we'd be hunted and exterminated?.

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  Saintbertholdt

  Hi there all,

  I knew the Watchtower didn't like me, but I didn't know they wanted to physically kill me (if they were allowed)
  From the 15 November 1952 Watchtower magazine under Questions From Readers:

  In the case of where a father or mother or son or daughter is disfellowshiped, how should such person be treated by members of the family in their family relationship?

  We are not living today among theocratic nations where such members of our fleshly family relationship could be exterminated for apostasy from God and his theocratic organization, as was possible and was ordered in the nation of Israel in the wilderness of Sinai and in the land of Palestine... (and a bit later)..Being limited by the laws of the worldly nation in which we live and also by the laws of God through Jesus Christ, we can take action against apostates only to a certain extent, that is, consistent with both sets of laws.

  
  

  So let me get this straight: If our secular pesky laws were not an obstacle and Jesus was not in the way we'd be hunted and exterminated?

  "Exterminated"? What like cockroaches or mosquito's?
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  128

  Looking Back In Retrospect To 1975...

  by titch in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  greetings, folks: so, it's been 40 years since 1975. and, if you were actively involved with the witnesses back then, the mindset of many was, that by early autumn of 1975, it would mark the anniversary of 6000 years of human existence.

  and, the hope was then, that it would mark the start of the 1000-year of christ, from the heavenly realm.

  but, looking back now, 40 years ago, in june of 1975, only 3 more months remained until early autumn.

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  Saintbertholdt

  In 1975 West German Branch Servant Conrad Franke gave a talk on 20 January 1968 in Hamburg. In the talk he spelled out to the audience that 1975 was the year of Armageddon.

  After the talk the underground East German (GDR) overseer prepared a circular with the title: 'The shortness of time should determine your actions'. Here's are the closing remarks from the circular:

  "...Thus it is impossible that Armageddon could take place after 1975! Who has given this keyword 1975? The slave! And don't we say of this slave that he gives us meat in due season?"
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  5

  Financial Report 2013 and 2014 Australia Branch

  by Listener in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs
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  Saintbertholdt

  Did you notice the following under income: other 405 490

  This is not asset disposal (fixed) as it is listed elsewhere. This is also not interest, so this is investment income:

  At 10% growth for the year it would mean the lump sum is 5 000 000.

  At 5% growth that would mean a 10 000 000 lump sum.

  The investment return for a balanced managed fund is about 7.4% according to the Australian ASX exchange long term investing report, so the Australian Watchtower has about 7 400 000 in investments.

  ---
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  8

  Request For Information: 1935 trial of Paul Balzereit

  by Saintbertholdt in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  has anyone ever come across the court transcript of the trial of paul balzereit by the nazi state in december 1935 in halle?.

  or has anyone come across the 1936 german yearbook article discussing the matter?.

  the transcript incensed rutherford which resulted in balzereit being publicly disfellowshipped.. the watchtower corporation seems to have kept a transcript because they quoted out of it in the 1974 yearbook.. anyway below is what rutherford wrote in an open letter to the german witnesses in 1936 (as you probably already know):.

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  Saintbertholdt

  Thanks wifibandit,

  I saw most of those documents and I have gone through them.

  BTW, i found part of what I was looking for in the 1936 Watchtower reprints.

  There's enough there to give me a good idea of what Balzereit said that incensed Rutherford.

  Greetings
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  8

  Request For Information: 1935 trial of Paul Balzereit

  by Saintbertholdt in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  has anyone ever come across the court transcript of the trial of paul balzereit by the nazi state in december 1935 in halle?.

  or has anyone come across the 1936 german yearbook article discussing the matter?.

  the transcript incensed rutherford which resulted in balzereit being publicly disfellowshipped.. the watchtower corporation seems to have kept a transcript because they quoted out of it in the 1974 yearbook.. anyway below is what rutherford wrote in an open letter to the german witnesses in 1936 (as you probably already know):.

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  Saintbertholdt

  Thanks Orphancrow.

  This may turn out to be a promising lead.
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  8

  Request For Information: 1935 trial of Paul Balzereit

  by Saintbertholdt in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  has anyone ever come across the court transcript of the trial of paul balzereit by the nazi state in december 1935 in halle?.

  or has anyone come across the 1936 german yearbook article discussing the matter?.

  the transcript incensed rutherford which resulted in balzereit being publicly disfellowshipped.. the watchtower corporation seems to have kept a transcript because they quoted out of it in the 1974 yearbook.. anyway below is what rutherford wrote in an open letter to the german witnesses in 1936 (as you probably already know):.

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  Saintbertholdt

  Hi coalize,

  Thank you for trying. I've been looking as well and I can't find it.

  Perhaps a copy of the German 1936 yearbook?

  Supposedly the matter was also discussed there.
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  8

  Request For Information: 1935 trial of Paul Balzereit

  by Saintbertholdt in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  has anyone ever come across the court transcript of the trial of paul balzereit by the nazi state in december 1935 in halle?.

  or has anyone come across the 1936 german yearbook article discussing the matter?.

  the transcript incensed rutherford which resulted in balzereit being publicly disfellowshipped.. the watchtower corporation seems to have kept a transcript because they quoted out of it in the 1974 yearbook.. anyway below is what rutherford wrote in an open letter to the german witnesses in 1936 (as you probably already know):.

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  Saintbertholdt

  Hi there Magnum,

  "I don't remember ever hearing about this. I'd like to know more. What exactly was it that Balzereit did or didn't do that so incensed Rutherford?"

  Balzereit was the head of the German branch. After the preaching ban in 1933 Balzereit wanted to placate the Nazis whereas Rutherford wanted to take a hard line because the Magdesburg printing presses and property had been seized.

  The German witnesses split in two. One group (the majority) stopped preaching whereas the second group (a couple of thousand) kept on preaching. When Balzereit was arrested in 1935 Rutherford charged that during the trial Balzereit denied ever having promoted illegally preaching after the ban. Its unclear whether he had and was lying or whether he actually listened to the ban.

  Rutherford had wanted Balzereit to martyr himself through the trial. When Balzereit didn't he was excommunicated. Rutherford accomplished two things with this:

  1. He got rid of Balzereit who irritated him.

  2. He sent a clear message to all the German witnesses: You better preach or else you're out.

  The Nazi court didn't believe Balzereit had always abided by the ban and sentenced him to two and a half years in prison.

  I would like to see the transcript because I want to see the evidence (if any) that was brought against Balzereit and what the exact original charges were.
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  8

  Request For Information: 1935 trial of Paul Balzereit

  by Saintbertholdt in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  has anyone ever come across the court transcript of the trial of paul balzereit by the nazi state in december 1935 in halle?.

  or has anyone come across the 1936 german yearbook article discussing the matter?.

  the transcript incensed rutherford which resulted in balzereit being publicly disfellowshipped.. the watchtower corporation seems to have kept a transcript because they quoted out of it in the 1974 yearbook.. anyway below is what rutherford wrote in an open letter to the german witnesses in 1936 (as you probably already know):.

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  Saintbertholdt

  Hi there all,

  Has anyone ever come across the court transcript of the trial of Paul Balzereit by the Nazi state in December 1935 in Halle?

  Or has anyone come across the 1936 German yearbook article discussing the matter?
  

  The transcript incensed Rutherford which resulted in Balzereit being publicly disfellowshipped.

  The Watchtower corporation seems to have kept a transcript because they quoted out of it in the 1974 Yearbook.

  Anyway below is what Rutherford wrote in an open letter to the German witnesses in 1936 (as you probably already know):

  “To Jehovah’s faithful people in Germany:

  “In spite of the wicked persecution upon you, and the great opposition put forth by Satan’s agents in that land, it is gratifying to know that the Lord still has a few thousand in that country who have faith in Him and who persist in proclaiming the message of His kingdom. Your faithfulness in standing out against the persecutors and remaining true to the Lord is in striking contrast to the action taken by the one who formerly was the manager for the Society in Germany, and others associated with him. Recently a copy of the testimony taken at the trial of those men at Halle has been furnished to me and I am astounded to find therein not one of those on trial at that time gave a faithful and true testimony to the name of Jehovah. It was especially incumbent upon the former manager Balzereit to hold high the banner of the Lord and declare himself for God and his kingdom amidst all opposition, but not one word was uttered showing his complete reliance upon Jehovah. Time and again I had called his attention to the fact of things that could be done in Germany and he assured me that he was putting forth every effort to encourage the brethren to get on with the testimony. But at the trial he emphatically stated that nothing was done. It is needless for me to here discuss that further. Suffice it to say that the Society will henceforth have nothing to do with him, nor any of those who on that occasion had an opportunity to bear testimony to the name of Jehovah and His kingdom and failed to do so. The Society will put forth no effort looking to release them from prison, even if it had the power to do anything.

  “Let now all those who love the Lord turn their faces to Him, Jehovah and His King, and remain true and steadfast on the side of the kingdom, regardless of all opposition that may come to you. . . .”

  
  
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  10

  27 Questions

  by Saintbertholdt in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i've been on and off the forum for a couple of years now.

  mostly lurking.. the last time i set foot in a kingdom hall was back in 2005 before i disassociated myself formally.. over the years i've kept up with the doctrinal changes and changes in practices.

  the problem is that because i haven't been practically experiencing these changes, much of the new information has not stuck clearly in my head.

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  Saintbertholdt

  FadingTruth

  "need greaters" - So they're basically missionaries brought in to train up elders and ministerial serpents.

  
  

  oh by the way, do people still use the term PO or are they using COBE? lol