trevor

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Posts by trevor

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  56

  Just posting a few pics here - I hope you don't mind!

  by tim hooper in

  1. social
  2. entertainment

  i'm a bit of a newbie here i suppose, but i've been fascinated by the photo threads that pop up now and then - notably leo's, purps and sparks.

  so i thought i'd do my bit for posterity and bring you some pics from the uk that i've taken over the last few years, if that's all right with you that is!.

  although i'm fully digital these days, my early work was film-based so, as a result of that training i tend to just use photoshop in the same way that i used to use my darkroom - ie.

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  trevor
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  14

  What's a "Non Believer"?

  by JH in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  as far as i'm concerned, a "non believer" is one that doesn't believe in god.. as for the jw's, a non believer is someone that doesn't believe 100% of what the watchtower says, no matter if there were flip flops on many subjects.. i find it insulting when a jw will consider a member of another religion that prays ,and who may devote lots of time helping people, like jesus said to do, and still be branded a "non believer", no better nor worse than the worst scum of society that may be in jail for murder..

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  trevor

  A non Believer is someone who will not accept concepts on the basis of faith.

  They want to analyze evidence and facts. If 'spiritual eyes' or any other invisible, imaginary equipment is required then they walk away.

  Just my personal take...
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  299

  Are JW's generally better than average people?

  by JH in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i for one, would blindly trust just about anyone on this forum, just the fact of knowing that you already were a jw.. does this mean that jw's in general are better people or are we a very close bunch of people?.

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  trevor

  It must be clear by now that Rosalee is not here for seriously debate or to help us. He/she is here to wind up the punters and he/she knows just which buttons to push.

  Clearly Rosalee was once a witness but does not ring true now. Possible a frustrated disassociated JW who wants a little attention. Nothing wrong with that and it has been an entertaining thread (although FredHall was more fun)

  What surprises me is the number of bright posters who have allowed themselves to be taken in and started playing word games and exchanging insults. Rosalee is practised at using diversion, sarcasm and double-speak to appear to never be wrong in argument.

  Rosalee - If you really are a female using a pseudonym was I married to you once?

  trev
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  13

  No more fiendish punishment could be devised

  by slimboyfat in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  no more fiendish punishment could be devised, if such a thing were physically possible, than that one should be turned loose in society and remain absolutely unnoticed by all the members thereof.

  if no one turned around when we entered, answered when we spoke, or minded what we did, but if every person we met cut us dead and acted as if we were nonexistent things, a kind of rage and impotent despair would before long well up in us, from which the cruelest bodily torture would be a relief.

  - william james, the principles of psychology.

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  trevor

  Altough cutting ties to Jws when we leave is hard, it is healthier for us in the longrun.

  Sometimes JWs are prepared to see relatives that have left. The problem is that being friends with people who secretly despise you for being what they see as weak and deserting their faith is damaging to us. It holds us back from making new friends with people who value us. It holds us in abusive relationships. We hang on to the crumbs that are offered and are constantly puzzled at why the love and acceptance that we seek is always out of reach.

  This was my experience for many years. I left quietly and kept my mouth shut. I was tolerated and an uneasy truce existed between my relatives and my wife's. I lived in fear of being shunned for speaking the truth about how I felt and why I left.

  I then wrote and published a book about the JWs. That was when the curtain came down. It hurt a lot but I got through it started to become a real person with with friends who I could talk. my stand cost me a brother who I loved with all my heart - but I would not want to go back to that halfway house that I called tolerance.

  Life is too short to spend with people who do not accept us or approve of us.
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  13

  No more fiendish punishment could be devised

  by slimboyfat in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  no more fiendish punishment could be devised, if such a thing were physically possible, than that one should be turned loose in society and remain absolutely unnoticed by all the members thereof.

  if no one turned around when we entered, answered when we spoke, or minded what we did, but if every person we met cut us dead and acted as if we were nonexistent things, a kind of rage and impotent despair would before long well up in us, from which the cruelest bodily torture would be a relief.

  - william james, the principles of psychology.

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  trevor

  I appreciate the comments that have been made regarding what I said.

  I did leave by choice - but whether we intended to leave or were thrown out for speaking our minds when we had been warned to keep quiet, we still made the choice to give ourselves permission to question. We then made the decision to rebel against the tyranny of the Watchtower. Or we may have committed some other offence that we knew was forbidden in their society.

  I say again - For as long as we place value on family that shun us we will hurt, miss them and want things to be different. The pain stops when we realize that they have no longer have any value to us. They once had huge value but have now become worthless.

  Would we really want to spend our free time after a weeks work with people who hold such negative thoughts, about us and the world, in their heads? Understanding that we have changed and moved on to another place in life that they can not join us in is the first step.

  Admitting that we don't want them to join us in their present state of mind is the next step. Then we welcome the fact that they stay away from us and allow us to make new friends and succeed in that new place. Moving on has to be done totally to half move on is to be caught in the in between.

  I have been told by my family that if there is a change in Watchtower policy, they may one day be able to see me again. I have told them that if they remain in their discredited religion I am not prepared to associate with them. Having yet another change of policy will not be enough for me to consider them worthwhile people to spend my time with.
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  24

  Ok here is my problem.........

  by fifi40 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i just read some of the thread about keeping our kids away from jws and their teachings.......this is my situation and any helpful advice would be appreciated.......... i have a 14 year old son.

  his father and i have not been together since 1999, when i was disfellowshipped.

  we now share custody.

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  trevor

  so I used to think at least he will get saved at Armageddon (Sad I know).

  This suggests a certain compliance on your part. A sort of turning a blind eye as an insurance policy.

  You need to be absolutely clear in your own mind about your beliefs and the unconscious forces that motivate you, before you can help your son.
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  13

  No more fiendish punishment could be devised

  by slimboyfat in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  no more fiendish punishment could be devised, if such a thing were physically possible, than that one should be turned loose in society and remain absolutely unnoticed by all the members thereof.

  if no one turned around when we entered, answered when we spoke, or minded what we did, but if every person we met cut us dead and acted as if we were nonexistent things, a kind of rage and impotent despair would before long well up in us, from which the cruelest bodily torture would be a relief.

  - william james, the principles of psychology.

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  trevor

  A very good quote. The difference in being shunned by Jws, is that we have chosen to remove ourselves from their way of life or society.

  We have REAL society to move in and make friends. We can only be hurt by JW shunning for as long as we continue to place value on them or the society they belong to.

  trev
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  34

  For those who've settled on 'no contact' with their JW families . . .

  by Madame Quixote in

  1. social
  2. family

  for whatever reason.

  do you question it sometimes and think you should try to "reach out" to them again?

  i was this morning and then came across the thread above and was reminded why i need to stay away.. but, still, i read threads of people who have managed somehow, despite being d'f'ed or faded or d'aed and think i might try to be more understanding, supportive, reach out or something.. despite all the problems growing up in a fairly dysfunctional family, i still feel a deep attachment to them and hope against hope that they might come to their senses (if they ever had any to begin with) and get help and leave the cult of jehobo; and we might reconcile,etc., etc., blah blah blah dream dream dream.. i deeply wish for them all freedom and happiness and healing and feel so helpless to free them of their bonds and yet see so much possibility for it, if only they could be reached somehow.

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  trevor

  The only way to deal with that is to realise that I don't actually want contact with them again. Their conditional love is worthless to me.

  sass-my-frass

  For as long as we place value on family that shun us we will hurt, miss them and want things to be different. The pain stops when we realize that they have no longer have any value to us. They once had huge value but have now become worthless.

  Would we really want to spend our free time after a weeks work with people who hold such negative thoughts, about us and the world, in their heads? Understanding that we have changed and moved on to another place in life that they can not join us in is the first step.

  Admitting that we don't want them to join us in their present state of mind is the next step. Then we welcome the fact that they stay away from us and allow us to make new friends and succeed in that new place. Moving on has to be done totally to half move on is to be caught in the in between.

  I have been told by my family that if there is a change in Watchtower policy, they may one day be able to see me again. I have told them that if they remain in their discredited religion I am not prepared to associate with them. Having yet another change of policy will not be enough for me to consider them worthwhile people to spend my time with.

  trev
• 
  299

  Are JW's generally better than average people?

  by JH in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i for one, would blindly trust just about anyone on this forum, just the fact of knowing that you already were a jw.. does this mean that jw's in general are better people or are we a very close bunch of people?.

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  trevor

  T-TR-TRO-TROLL-TRANSITION
• 
  299

  Are JW's generally better than average people?

  by JH in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i for one, would blindly trust just about anyone on this forum, just the fact of knowing that you already were a jw.. does this mean that jw's in general are better people or are we a very close bunch of people?.

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  trevor

  The original question was: Are JW's generally better than average people?

  If Rosalee is typical of the 'average' JW then I think we finally have our answer.