gingerbread

Joined

• started 21 topics
• posted 633 times   see topics posted on
• send a message

Posts by gingerbread

• 
  4

  What would it take?

  by Kool Jo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  [if gte mso 9]><xml> <o:officedocumentsettings> <o:relyonvml /> <o:allowpng /> </o:officedocumentsettings> </xml><![endif].

  [if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:worddocument> <w:view>normal</w:view> <w:zoom>0</w:zoom> <w:trackmoves /> <w:trackformatting /> <w:punctuationkerning /> <w:validateagainstschemas /> <w:saveifxmlinvalid>false</w:saveifxmlinvalid> <w:ignoremixedcontent>false</w:ignoremixedcontent> <w:alwaysshowplaceholdertext>false</w:alwaysshowplaceholdertext> <w:donotpromoteqf /> <w:lidthemeother>en-us</w:lidthemeother> <w:lidthemeasian>x-none</w:lidthemeasian> <w:lidthemecomplexscript>x-none</w:lidthemecomplexscript> <w:compatibility> <w:breakwrappedtables /> <w:snaptogridincell /> <w:wraptextwithpunct /> <w:useasianbreakrules /> <w:dontgrowautofit /> <w:splitpgbreakandparamark /> <w:dontvertaligncellwithsp /> <w:dontbreakconstrainedforcedtables /> <w:dontvertalignintxbx /> <w:word11kerningpairs /> <w:cachedcolbalance /> </w:compatibility> <m:mathpr> <m:mathfont m:val="cambria math" /> <m:brkbin m:val="before" /> <m:brkbinsub m:val="&#45;-" /> <m:smallfrac m:val="off" /> <m:dispdef /> <m:lmargin m:val="0" /> <m:rmargin m:val="0" /> <m:defjc m:val="centergroup" /> <m:wrapindent m:val="1440" /> <m:intlim m:val="subsup" /> <m:narylim m:val="undovr" /> </m:mathpr></w:worddocument> </xml><!

  [endif][if gte mso 10]> <style> /* style definitions */ table.msonormaltable {mso-style-name:"table normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-priority:99; mso-style-qformat:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para-margin-top:0in; mso-para-margin-right:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:10.0pt; mso-para-margin-left:0in; line-height:115%; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"calibri","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-font-family:calibri; mso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-fareast-font-family:"times new roman"; mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast; mso-hansi-font-family:calibri; mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin;} </style> <![endif].

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  gingerbread

  Persons will 'leave' only when the organization know as Jehovah's Witnesses ceases to exist.

  Even after 1975, dispite the allusion that an exit of many left the 'truth, most stayed 'loyal to the faith'. Suggestions of hundreds or thousands leaving the organization is probably correct, but from a percentage aspect very few threw in the towel and left.

  Some did become inactive for a while but many returned after some years ... to wait on jehovah.

  Some that became inactive after 1975 left for good in the early eighties after learning about Ray Franz's story. But in reality, most of us might have heard a general retelling of those events but never knew of any details - the Time magazine expose and interview was banned as apostate propaganda.
• 
  21

  It's yime for an introduction

  by HowTheBibleWasInvented in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i've been lurking a month or two and letting out a comment here and there.a few weeks ago someone asked if i had formally introduced myself.

  i was born and raised a witness.

  i always found meetings borning and family studies so bad.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  gingerbread

  Welcome!

  I too walked in your research shoes a few years ago. Also, I made a study of the history of the WT organization and the origins of our main beliefs. By slowly sharing my 'findings' with my spouse, we're quietly fading away from the organization together.

  It's working very well with few hassles - even though we were both raised in and have parents and siblings still in...pioneering, responsibilities, building construction... we were card carrying JW's.

  I always recommend reading books by and watching videos about Joseph Campbell.

  ginger
• 
  25

  Wait on Jehovah - What does is it truly mean?

  by ProfCNJ in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  good evening folks!

  we have encountered this advice countlessly on wt study articles.

  this especially comes out to ease the waiting pain of brothers eagerly waiting for god's new world and the end of the old system of things - with all the sufferings that go along with it.. i also noticed this being floated to try to extend the patience of brothers who are jumping ahead of the organization in terms of thinking - as if they are pre-empting the organization on certain sensitive views and issues.. if a brother has gotten an idea or insight that is far more superior than the present affairs in the society, or regarded as way in advance - he can be branded as a brother "not in order".

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  gingerbread

  Welcome to the real 'organization'.

  I've been in this situation and have seen hundreds of others experience it by being 'put in their place'. I've seen too many good brothers ( and sisters too!) with great ideas that are told NO...

  The WTBTS and it's branches are structured from the top down. Rank and position exist on every level. The 'pecking order' is very real.

  'Waiting on Jehovah' to correct wrongs in the congregation only leads to pain and misery. Just like you focus on in your experience - ProfCNJ - , it's easy to blame a rotten, controlling person in the congregation. However, you (just like I used to do) miss the point: the real problem is the organizational policies and doctrines that run the WT machine.

  This religion will never be improved or reformed from within.

  ginger
• 
  34

  "Whether These Appear Sound From a Strategic or Human Standpoint or Not." - What do YOU think?

  by jw07 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  http://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/w20131115/seven-shepherds-eight-dukes/.

  paragraph 17.

  "at that time, the life-saving direction that we receive from jehovahs organization may not appear practical from a human standpoint.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  gingerbread

  I've come to realize over the past couple of years that the Watchtower doesn't 'hide' what it's thinking. The GB and it's writers are blatant and obvious regarding what is expected from everyone.

  This is another statement that tells the membership that the GB is in charge of their lives.

  The one word that concerns me in JW07's quote is in the last sentence: 'help'.

  This last sentence is a directive to the elders to pressure any that are educating themselves or advancing their careers. On the flip-side, this kind of 'help' will awaken the balanced ones in congregations and also cause even more young adults to flee 'the faith'.
• 
  29

  Steve Hassan Interviews XJW elder, Roberto di Stefano, at ICSA Conference in Italy

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  trieste, italy - icsa conference - july 6, 2013. both roberto di stefano and steve hassan were speakers at the conference.

  you can see the hassan interview on his website.

  here's the link:http://freedomofmind.com/media/video.php?id=59.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  gingerbread

  Excellent video with complete honesty, sincerity and smiles. We'll be watching this as a family tonight.

  Thanks for the link!

  ginger
• 
  40

  Former Longtime Elder : Contributions

  by James Jackson in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  for a year now, i have been handling the accounts.

  we have 6 elders and 7 ms, and none of them ( i am not serving), want to do the accounts, so they asked me to do it.

  here is what i have noticed.. 4 elderly sisters cover the whole congregation in donations monthly!

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  gingerbread

  Contributions are considered an indicator of the congregation's overall 'spiritual health' - just as much as average service hours, active commenting during meetings and lively interaction of publishers before and after meetings.

  For older ones, it's a lifetime habit to budget money aside for congregational expenses. For the "under 40" crowd, that is a rarer thing - except if a young guy want to get noticed for future appointments (he always writes a check!).

  With increased pressure on CO's to tabulate and inspect, a decrease in contributions will cause the elder body real trouble.

  In my observation, publishers that are high earners give lump contributions and lower income folks give service time.
• 
  31

  What Is The "Typical" Elder In The Organization Like Now?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  when i was an elder, most of the elders were pretty independent 40 to 80 year olds.

  they had no issue speaking up to the circuit overseer.

  i wonder what the average elder is like now.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  gingerbread

  It's still a boys club.

  More now than ever the elders are burdened by more meetings, new rules and procedures & the stress of organizational business.

  They deal with a congregation full of aging folks. And people with depression issues or emotional problems. The WT leadership continues to ramp up fear in talks and publications. The result of that is average publisher is scared to death - every 'bad' story to hit the news is a new piece of evidence that the big A is on it's way. The persecution complex is on full throttle (with apostates being the main source of the torment).

  Some elders show sympathy. Many have become policemen bent on enforcing branch 'directives'.

  Nuts.

  ginger
• 
  17

  Marathon service days before Sept 1

  by gbrn in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  so my wife showed me her instagram and one of her friends posted a picture of herself and a couple other pioneers with the title "20 hours in so far on our 24 hour day of service!

  " mind you they were all sitting in starbucks.

  this just made me want to scream!!

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  gingerbread

  After a half-lifetime of involvement as a publisher, I've concluded that many join the 'pioneer ranks' with good intentions - to reach others in the community with the religion.

  But, if a full time pioneer is honest they would admit that they do it for themselves. They like the title, position, special meetings and training schools.

  Listen to interviews of pioneers at the assemblies. One question that is ALWAYS asked is "please tell us how full time service has benefited you spiritually."

  ginger
• 
  30

  One Day is as 1000 years to Jehovah

  by confusedandalone in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i wake up this mornign to find this on my facebook page... instant deletion.

  if 1000 years is as one day...the following is true....if 1000 years is as one day...the following is true..... .

  someone did the math, of the 1000 years = one day equation.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  gingerbread
• 
  19

  Who benefits from the money they receive?

  by unfamiliar in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i keep seeing people on here (and other places) talk about the wbts making money .

  .

  sorry if it should be obvious!.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  gingerbread

  The Watchtower corporation(s) in themselves don't generate an income like an individual does through employment. The corps hold assets such as property and investments. These assets can be converted into cash.

  The corps protect the assets and cash. Without these the organization ceases to function.

  Like any well managed corporation, the WT finds ways to reduce costs, maintain the strength of it's assets and look for new ways to increase funding.

  All funding is given voluntarily to the corportation (branch) by members. The WT corporation has millions of members that give funds and personal assets to them every week as 'donations.'

  So, the corporation (branch) benefits from the money received. Of course, the persons in control of the corps spend a lot of money but they never risk the long-term financial health of the Org.

  No strings attached. No accountablility.

  ginger