Wasn't there also thread more recently with possible evidence that they were still an NGO even now?
Something about one of their representatives attending an NGO meeting? Or was that my imagination?
Posts by 88JM
-
51My chat with an Elder about the UN thing! Help!
by awakening inwell it was a very long discussion.
the elder knew nothing about the scandal, but he stated that he had no issue with it since when the case was brought to light, the society acted immediately to right their course.
in fact he thought it was a sign that that the organisation was indeed the "truth".
-
-
-
9
Elder's decisions with congregation funds £££
by 88JM inhave you ever been in a congregation (or circuit) where elders have made very bad choices on spending congegation funds?.
(summary if you don't want to read it all: elders planning to squander money on an expensive hall refurbishment while kh flat is falling apart).
i know there were assembly halls like dudley who spent a lot of money on their kitchens just before the food arrangements were done away with.
-
-
88JM
I'll do a reverse charges call
-
9
Elder's decisions with congregation funds £££
by 88JM inhave you ever been in a congregation (or circuit) where elders have made very bad choices on spending congegation funds?.
(summary if you don't want to read it all: elders planning to squander money on an expensive hall refurbishment while kh flat is falling apart).
i know there were assembly halls like dudley who spent a lot of money on their kitchens just before the food arrangements were done away with.
-
-
88JM
They're also bad at DIY
-
9
Elder's decisions with congregation funds £££
by 88JM inhave you ever been in a congregation (or circuit) where elders have made very bad choices on spending congegation funds?.
(summary if you don't want to read it all: elders planning to squander money on an expensive hall refurbishment while kh flat is falling apart).
i know there were assembly halls like dudley who spent a lot of money on their kitchens just before the food arrangements were done away with.
-
-
88JM
tiki - Yes the couple do have a lot of history, and the rent is pretty "reasonable" for a flat in the area. They could get something nicer for the same amount of money with council-subsidised housing though, but I don't think they quite realise that. Also they would be reluctant to move further with the hall being so convenient and travelling costs can be expensive here. The couple are basically just living on their pension.
They probably don't realise just how bad the flat is, but they are very aware it has problems and what the last inspection report said. They are not happy at all, but that's more about the way they are being treated more than the state of things. Actually, it's other people in the congregation that are even more vocal about it and can see just how bad things are - that's why the problem is even bigger.
The flat is in disrepair due to the high turnover string-of-elders who have always put the hall flat at bottom priority. Anything else that needed money always took priority, despite the flat being the main source of income for the congregation. The retired couple aren't pioneers or anything, so I guess they didn't have much "status".
You're right that it is a funny situation about being responsible for another congregation. I wouldn't like to reveal too much detail, as I've probably already given more away about my location than I would like, but that's the way things are. The "start-up congregation" is very small - just one elder and a ministerial servant with a dozen or so publishers - not quite enough for a full congregation.
-
9
Elder's decisions with congregation funds £££
by 88JM inhave you ever been in a congregation (or circuit) where elders have made very bad choices on spending congegation funds?.
(summary if you don't want to read it all: elders planning to squander money on an expensive hall refurbishment while kh flat is falling apart).
i know there were assembly halls like dudley who spent a lot of money on their kitchens just before the food arrangements were done away with.
-
-
88JM
Has anyone ever seen a vote like that where everyone didn't agree to the show of hands?
(Funnily enough I have, and it was the P.O. who put his hand up!)
-
138
A question about lying and the Jehovah's Witnesses
by Change Name ini have seen questions regarding how much jehovah's witnesses lie all the time on yahoo answers.
here is the latest question:.
jehovah's witnesses, is lying at any time something jehovah approves of?.
-
-
88JM
Here's what they tell the kiddies about lying in the March 2013 Public Watchtower, page 14 and 15:
-
9
Elder's decisions with congregation funds £££
by 88JM inhave you ever been in a congregation (or circuit) where elders have made very bad choices on spending congegation funds?.
(summary if you don't want to read it all: elders planning to squander money on an expensive hall refurbishment while kh flat is falling apart).
i know there were assembly halls like dudley who spent a lot of money on their kitchens just before the food arrangements were done away with.
-
-
88JM
Have you ever been in a congregation (or circuit) where Elders have made very bad choices on spending congegation funds?
(Summary if you don't want to read it all: Elders planning to squander money on an expensive hall refurbishment while KH flat is falling apart)
I know there were assembly halls like Dudley who spent a lot of money on their kitchens just before the food arrangements were done away with. The circuit here spent most of the money available in the congregations to buy a circuit flat which was uninhabitable, not in a very good part of town, and also in huge disrepair (smoke damage from a fire in the flat below). This was just before the property crash happened, and as a result, the flat became worth much less than it was bought for (slimboyfat and dozy will probably know what I'm on about). I'm sure situations like this have happened elsewhere too.
It looks like a similar situation will be happening all over again in the congregation here - bearing in mind it is a pretty small congregation and any issues are a HUGE thing. Also bear in mind that each individual congregation in Scotland is a registered charity (mainly for tax purposes).
The main congregation here sponsors a smaller "start-up congregation" who meet quite a way away in a rented building. They have been given notice by the landlord that they will have to vacate this building in the near future. The elder overseeing the start-up congregation would like to refurbish an adjoining property. However, it is in an extreme state of disrepair and will take more money than the congregation has available. Even the estimate the brother thinks seems still far too low - this building is an outhouse to look at.
Now you might think the sensible thing to do would be to at least get a written agreement with the landlord on what the terms of refurbishing one of their buildings would be, and get a professional estimate on the work required first, or even think about looking elsewhere for somewhere to meet before making a descision, and certainly do this before putting anything to the whole congegation like a local needs item.
Well this is what the local needs here tonight was about - basically the decision seems already made that money the congregation does not have will be spent refurbishing a hovel. The "start-up congregation" is not even sure when it will be evicted from it's existing building yet (though it could well be at short notice). The elder there has a "verbal agreement"with the landlord that they can refurbish the other building and after doing so, will be expempt from rent for an unspecified period of time - none of this is in writing, of course.
Got that? Now it gets even more complicated.
The main congregation here (sponsoring the "start-up congregation") is a little unique for a couple of reasons. For one, the kingdom hall is wholly owned by the congregation - no morgage, no rent, nothing paid to the society for it, and the deed still belongs to the congregation, not the society.
On top of that (literally), the kingdom hall has a small flat which is occupied by a retired brother and sister who pay rent. The rent from this flat is pretty much the main income for the congregation in reality, and the congregation would not be able to afford anything at all were it for the years of rent from this flat. I should also mention that the daughter and son-in-law of this retired couple are also in the congregation.
This flat has not had any money spent on it since the 70's, and it shows it. In fact, if the authorities inspected it, I'm sure they would condemn the building (the last hall inspection said as much). Recently, our all-new body of elders here have finally decided to spend the least amount possible on this flat to make it liveable, and using the cheapest labour and materials (read: elder DIY). Our previous local needs was about contributing for this actually.
This is causing quite a division in the congregation, though elders are not yet fully aware of how much. The retired couple in the kingdom hall flat are relatively "popular" and have been in the congregation longer than many - certainly longer than all the elders.
Many are unhappy that the kingdom hall flat has fallen into such disrepair and are dismayed at the attitude taken to repairing it in such a shoddy manner. Now with this new situation with the sponsored "start-up congregation", it looks like very little will be spent on the kingdom hall flat at all, as it will take more money than the congregation has to refurbish the building for the "start-up congregation".
As for me - I'm just watching it all from the (fading) sidelines. It does make for good viewing though - it will be interesting to see how this one turns out, espepcially when the C.O. visit comes around in 8 weeks time. I suspect a few brothers will be having a word with the C.O. - not just the elders.
-
7
Emotional Abuse - 10 signs to watch out for in a relationship
by sd-7 inhttp://shrink4men.wordpress.com/2009/01/30/10-signs-your-girlfriend-or-wife-is-an-emotional-bully/.
the above link explains it well.
i've probably encountered it before, but i think it warrants a mention once more.
-
-
88JM
Sadly, this also describes my mum and dad's relationship exactly at the moment.
-
11
What ever happened to Douglas Walsh?
by St George of England indoes anyone know what happened to douglas walsh when the society lost the case?
all the references to the case concentrate on freddie franz and his inabilty to translate a single verse of the bible into hebrew and to grant suiter who let the cat out regarding disfellowshiping and altered doctrine.. walsh, i understand was a pioneer and possibly the congregation servant.
did he go to prison?
-
-
88JM
Thanks dozy
-
11
What ever happened to Douglas Walsh?
by St George of England indoes anyone know what happened to douglas walsh when the society lost the case?
all the references to the case concentrate on freddie franz and his inabilty to translate a single verse of the bible into hebrew and to grant suiter who let the cat out regarding disfellowshiping and altered doctrine.. walsh, i understand was a pioneer and possibly the congregation servant.
did he go to prison?
-
-
88JM
Sorry slimboyfat - our congregation is now in a different circuit this service year, so will be heading eastwards. I've forgotten when ours is though.
If I get down your way I'll be sure to let you know. Will probably be down at least at the end of August for the DC in Glasgow.
