Posts by Freeandclear

12

Reply to Bugbear: Why I believe in the Bible

by Saved_JW in

[some words i corrected for spelling & grammer] .

"i have been studying the bible for almost 20 years....after graduating in history and science comparing to the the bible, i have have come to to the conclusion that the bible cannot give you any reason to believe in it at all.

so i wonder, why do you use the bible as facit to your believes?

Freeandclear

Excellent thread, I'm in total agreement with Anders Andersen above. I do not hate God. I simply don't know if he exists or what he wants from me, and I desperately want to believe! I've asked him to reveal himself to me, to in essence "change me". I don't know how I could make it more clear to my what I desire in my heart.

I suppose that's why I find this site and everyone's comments so fascinating and why I continue to read here daily.

I want faith. I want to trust in God whomever he might be. I want to know the real "truth" but thus far no answers.

When I look around at the Earth I feel like someone had to have made this for me. When I see a sunset or sunrise or a mountain or the wonders under the waters of the sea (I scuba dive) I FEEL God there, but as for belief in a certain way of worship? That eludes me. That does not seem to be God's real intent for humanity.

There are thousands of religions, all claiming to be the "One true faith" or whatever, yet not ONE of these truly stands out. God has not made himself known to me, other than through the physical world around me in which I feel his presence. HE has not revealed to me "This is the way, walk in it." I feel none of that. I know now that JW are not the "true way", of that I'm 100% certain. But what way does he want me to follow? The only and best guess I have is that he wants me to follow my own conscience. Every human has one. Granted everyone's is different, but we all DO have one. To me this must be the only real "guide to truth" we have. So I try very hard to follow mine. I live by the rule: Do no harm. What that means to me is to not harm other people. Not to lie, not to hold grudges, not to be mean, to treat others with kindness and respect, etc.....

If at the end I come face to face with God I know that I will be able to hold my head up high in good conscience and say "I did what I thought was best. I gave it my all. I called to you and I didn't get any clear answers but I had a conscience so I followed that as that was the only moral guide I had. If that's not good enough then do with me what you will, but if you are omniscient then you know that I am telling the truth and you have nothing against me because you did not guide me."

So until God decides to "show me the way" I will continue on in my present way of living and believing for, what else do I have????????????????

41

Toasting is Pagan - How many contradictions can fit in 2 pages, I found 5?

by jwfacts in

the watchtower 2007 feb 15 pp.30-31 explains why jehovah's witnesses are not to toast.

what is astounding is that for each point they then go on an explain why the point is irrelevant, yet still conclude toasting is wrong.

what did people think when reading this?

Freeandclear

It's a cult. Modern day Pharisees.....

21

Finding time

by Jordandemm in

jw
friends

is it possible to full time pioneer while working a full time job without making up the hours?

i know of a brother who recently got married too a pioneer the guy was really desperate to get married because his wife despite her many 'spiritual credentials' has very few christ-like qualities unfortunately, anyway that's besides the point.

he is a pioneer now and i'm sure he will be a ms soon the organisation likes that type of stuff the 'pioneer couple' so it shouldn't come as a surprise.

Freeandclear

I forgot the whole point of my post.....

I never ever felt right about counting and reporting time. I saw what others did and how the fudged their time, doing all the same types of things that have already been mentioned and eventually years later I too was guilty of these things. I can remember leaving my house and with tract in hand I'd find someone walking on the street and pull my car over and simply say "Hey, want something interesting to read?" and that would be the start of my time, BEFORE the FS meeting. I'd count all the way through lunch too, maybe minusing 15 minutes or so but most times I didn't. Stuff like that. It really ate at me, but I did it to keep up appearances, that's not what we were taught God wants in the form of sacrifice. Nothing but a one legged dead dog...... shame. And we all did it. What a joke.

21

Finding time

by Jordandemm in

jw
friends

is it possible to full time pioneer while working a full time job without making up the hours?

i know of a brother who recently got married too a pioneer the guy was really desperate to get married because his wife despite her many 'spiritual credentials' has very few christ-like qualities unfortunately, anyway that's besides the point.

he is a pioneer now and i'm sure he will be a ms soon the organisation likes that type of stuff the 'pioneer couple' so it shouldn't come as a surprise.

Freeandclear

Man, it's nuts to read all of these experiences of service and how closely they all resemble what I went through. It's was no different for me either.

I got baptized at 18 and the elder who studied with me was a very close friend and father figure. I did not like service, I mean come on, who really does? I did not want to pioneer, hell I didn't even want to be a JW but I saw the light at a convention and that was it for me. I'm an all in or all out kind of person and so I bit it and got baptized. I really did believe it was the truth 100%

My friend the elder was the PO of our hall and I really looked up to him. He seemed like Jesus himself in many ways. Never ever did anyone wrong and I still believe that about him. He's very sincere and loving. So I followed his lead and when he encouraged me to pioneer after hs I did. I didn't want to but it seemed like what Jehovah wanted from me. I gave up a 4 year MIT scholarship too.

I used to hate pretty much every minute of FS. I all too well remember "Let's hit this RV right here by the hall so we can get our time started...." then we'd drive straight to McDonalds and eat crap. Then drive a million miles away to the edge of the territory for another RV that was always known to be not at home because they worked during the day! Come on. "Maybe they'll be there" was always the justification. I had a good buddy who was my pioneer partner. I should mention, I auxiliary pioneered for about a year prior to going full time (back then 1991 or so it was 60 for AP and 90 for regular). My good buddy, Lawrence hated service too. He never said anything but I could see it in his eyes every day and by his actions. He always drove and it was the slowest driving ever! Always from one edge of the territory to the other for each RV. We rarely did walking territory if he could help it. Rainy days and snowy shitty days (which we very often had here in our lovely little corner of NE Ohio) were ever more dreadful.

I was young, full of energy and life. I worked a part time job three days a week but I put in nearly 40 hours in those three days. I would get up on my off days and go in service ALL day to make my time. It was dreadful and exhausting and I always was depressed and felt like something was wrong with me. I mean, I was doing God's work! I should be full of joy shouldn't I? I should be overflowing with happiness at being so privileged but I wasn't, ever. Once in a while it was nice to have an upbuilding conversation with someone, or to genuinely help someone with a positive thought from the Bible. I tried very much to focus on these types of conversations with people.

God forbid, sorry ladies, if there were sisters in the car group. Nothing but a very backhanded gossip session all day long.

We had so many crazies in our congregation too. Just severely mentally unbalanced. But was it them or the bOrg that made them that way? Personally I think it was lack of sex! I know it nearly made me mad and eventually put me right out of the Truth.

Sorry for the incredibly long and boring post! Fun to reminisce.

63

How the Watchtower Screws Up Your View of Scripture

by CalebInFloroda in

while i do not argue the stand of atheism (because as a jew i find it totally logical and acceptable), i have noticed that there are odd carryover preconceptions about scripture that some hold as axiomatic about the bible (at least the hebrew texts), misconceptions that have nothing to do with the jewish scriptures themselves.. so regardless of what you may think of scripture, whether you believe it is of g-d or not, i thought some of you might enjoy a reference to see how much the watchtower teaching on scripture might still be influencing the conclusions you are making today...at least about the tanakh.

jews read their texts acknowledging the following:.

1. no scriptural concept of original sin.

Freeandclear

Just reading over some of this just now and all I really got out of this was the same old thing....namely: Confusion.

The Jew's think one thing, the Christians (all 45,000 of their sects) think another, the Muslims another, etc etc etc and on and on ad nauseum.

For me God and Truth boil down to one simple thing..... Here it is: IF there is a God, he/she/it does not care one bit about how or if we worship.

Why conclude this? Because there is NO solid "truth" out there. That's why there are a billion different ideas about truth. IF God really exists and is truly Almighty and REALLY wanted a specific style of worship from US lowly humans then HE WOULD HAVE MADE THIS KNOWN and not just known to a few or one, but to all. And he has not. End of discussion for me.

I hope there is something better after this human life. But if not I won't know anyway since I'll be gone, ie. Dead in the truest sense of the word.

Perhaps the only real truth in life really is after all: Death and Taxes. Maybe that'll be my new religion.

9

Going to listen in on the meeting today...just for fun

by Freeandclear in

jw
friends

so real quick.

i'm df'd, also awake to ttott, no desire to go back but of course i still have unresolved issues.

so i think i'm going to listen in today just to see how things are at my old hall..... should be sickening....er i mean "encouraging"

Freeandclear

They changed the call in number and pin on me those bastards....lol I have to call the PO to get the new one. Oh well.....I guess my "spirituality" isn't worth passing along a simple number to through text without going through the proper channels.... what a bunch of dog shit. Must be Jehovah telling me something.

9

Going to listen in on the meeting today...just for fun

by Freeandclear in

jw
friends

so real quick.

i'm df'd, also awake to ttott, no desire to go back but of course i still have unresolved issues.

so i think i'm going to listen in today just to see how things are at my old hall..... should be sickening....er i mean "encouraging"

Freeandclear

So real quick. I'm df'd, also awake to TTOTT, no desire to go back but of course I still have unresolved issues. So I think I'm going to listen in today just to see how things are at my old hall..... should be sickening....er I mean "encouraging"

13

any Near death experiences any one can relate

by baker in

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbkgj5j91he.

this is as close as it gets to the other side....

Freeandclear

Near Death Experiences - My rational take on it (and not my own thought here but this is based on what I know and have read, so somewhat of a rehashing of already known facts):

DMT - Dimethyltryptamine

This substance is produced by the human pineal gland in the brain. It's what makes you dream, and at death the pineal gland releases all of it's DMT. This causes you to have very intense very real (after all, what is real? Real is simply our brain processing information coming in from our 5 senses right? That is as real as things can get for a human) visions which seem like reality. Just as a very intense realistic dream may be very hard to forget once you awaken from. It may seem "real" but it's simply a process of the brain and DMT.

So, when a person get's very close to death as in a NDE the pineal gland does it's natural function of expelling all it's DMT and a NDE happens. It seems as real as real can be for a human and thus when the person is "brought back" to life he/she remembers this vision and attributes reality to it, viewing it as "real" as in, "This is the truth! This is what happens at death! I have experienced it!" etc......

These NDE are all different. If you look at them all, explore them, you will find they vary greatly. IF they were reality would they not all be the same? The world around us is the same for everyone. We breath air, we eat food, we walk on the ground, etc.... it's in this way I'm speaking of it all being the "same". NDE are very different for the different people who construct them. No basis in reality, simply a function of DMT and their own individual brains.

In short, NDE are nothing more than a very real feeling complex dream caused by the release of DMT at the time of death.

14

Mentally challenged DF

by James Mixon in

there was a df of a mentally challenged young man he sexually assaulted a young girl.. in jesus day people were possessed by demons but we know today they had mental issues.. do you know of any cases where a mentally challenged person was df.. the case that i mention the young man was 18-20 years old and it was a case where he was.

functional, school, friends and was baptized.

i knew the family and if you didn't know he was a. typical teenager.. my question, if a mentally challenged person is able to answer the questions to qualify to be.

Freeandclear

We had quite a few at my old Hall. One was a very good friend of mine who at the age of about 18 had a mental breakdown and has been on psych meds ever since. He regularly get's df'd then reinstated, I think he's on his 5th one atm. Or he might be back in by now, idk.....crazy.

17

We give more to the Watchtower Society than for our local KH

by James Jack in

i have been doing the accounts for our local congregation now for 3 years.

i just thought, wow our local expenses total just $500 a month, yet we have an ongoing expense each month of $600 for the kh expansion work(ie:world wide work), $60 for the traveling overseer insurance and $54 for the local kingdom hall insurance, in addition to the operating committee expense of $525.. so, our one congregation sends $714 a month plus what the publishers contribute towards the world wide work usually between $600 to $700 per month.

in other words, we are at least sending, for our little congregation of 75 publishers, $1314 a month!

Freeandclear

Here's a serious question. Where does the money go? I mean who exactly is benefiting from it? Don't all the GB members live at Bethel and live modestly? What are they spending it on? It doesn't seem to be on themselves or on big fancy cars or houses......just curious.