Posts by Rattigan350

15

The Good News Is: The Great-Crowd-Of-Other-Sheep Do Not Exist

by Sea Breeze in

the watchtower conflates two different groups into one fictional church-age group that according to the watchtower, are saved by works and faith/membership in the jehovah witness organization.

according to watchtower, only the now mostly dead 144k receive the promises of god regarding justification .

everbody else missed the boat and must work for their justification for a thousand years.

Rattigan350

Spiritual Israelites are the Israel of God. Same thing.

"Yes, and there is no such thing as a Christian who is not born of and indwelt by the Holy Spirit. Jn.3:3; Ro.8:9 Neither is there any Christian who cannot call God his Father or who is not justified by the blood of Christ. I Jn.5:1; Acts 13:39"

There are millions of Christians who have not been anointed with holy spirit. Anointed, not born of and indwelt by the holy spirit.

As for Romans 8:9 "you are in harmony, not with the flesh, but with the spirit, if God’s spirit truly dwells in you."

15

The Good News Is: The Great-Crowd-Of-Other-Sheep Do Not Exist

by Sea Breeze in

the watchtower conflates two different groups into one fictional church-age group that according to the watchtower, are saved by works and faith/membership in the jehovah witness organization.

according to watchtower, only the now mostly dead 144k receive the promises of god regarding justification .

everbody else missed the boat and must work for their justification for a thousand years.

Rattigan350

"There is no 2nd class according to scripture. Ephesians 4:4 mentions only 1 hope."

There are 144,000 spiritual Israelites that fulfill Jehovah's promise to Israel about Israel becoming kings and priests. Revelation is clear on that they serve in heaven with Jesus.

There were billions that died before Jesus died and could not be anointed with holy spirit. Their hope is to be resurrect to life on earth

Then there are the many billions who died after Jesus but were never anointed with holy spirit. They are no different than the ones who died before he did. They are dead and in the grave waiting for the resurrection to life on earth.

Then there are the ones who don't die at all. They are the ones that John sees in Rev 7:14 as a great crowd of people who come out of the great tribulation.

152

Do JWs believe Jesus is an angel?

by slimboyfat in

i would suggest:.

the short answer is yes.. the longer answer is a qualified yes, with some caveats.

the short answer is yes because jehovah’s witnesses teach that jesus is michael the archangel, their leader, eldest and most powerful, and have taught this since the very beginning of the religion.

Rattigan350

Jeffro said "The story in Genesis doesn’t say anything at all about the snake being Satan, and doesn’t mention Jesus at all."

Genesis does not mention a snake. It was a serpent.

Rev 12:9 "So down the great dragon was hurled, the original serpent, the one called Devill and Satan"

Revelation ties them all together.

Also, it is well known and accepted that Jesus is that seed.

152

Do JWs believe Jesus is an angel?

by slimboyfat in

i would suggest:.

the short answer is yes.. the longer answer is a qualified yes, with some caveats.

the short answer is yes because jehovah’s witnesses teach that jesus is michael the archangel, their leader, eldest and most powerful, and have taught this since the very beginning of the religion.

Rattigan350

Vanderhove7:

"Yet eight million Jehovah’s Witnesses still tend to address God somewhat remotely as "Jehovah God". My take is that because Jehovah’s Witnesses do not know or relate to Jesus they do not understand or appreciate God as their Father."

Well, that is his name. But how do you know what 8 million JWs address God? Jesus addressed Jehovah as his Father because he was. Jehovah is not our father until the end of the 1000 years when everyone alive will be adopted as sons of God.

"Eight million JWs do not personally know Jesus Christ. The extent of their "relationship" with Jesus is tacking on his name at the end of their prayers. He is not their Saviour or even their Mediator."

What is there to personally know about Jesus? Jesus is our savior and he is the mediator of the new covenant with the 144,000.

152

Do JWs believe Jesus is an angel?

by slimboyfat in

i would suggest:.

the short answer is yes.. the longer answer is a qualified yes, with some caveats.

the short answer is yes because jehovah’s witnesses teach that jesus is michael the archangel, their leader, eldest and most powerful, and have taught this since the very beginning of the religion.

Rattigan350

"In the Lord's Prayer though, Jesus does not end with 'through Jesus Christ Amen', he doesn't even mention himself once in that prayer."

Well, it would be lame if he did.

But he later teaches that you approach his Father through him.

152

Do JWs believe Jesus is an angel?

by slimboyfat in

i would suggest:.

the short answer is yes.. the longer answer is a qualified yes, with some caveats.

the short answer is yes because jehovah’s witnesses teach that jesus is michael the archangel, their leader, eldest and most powerful, and have taught this since the very beginning of the religion.

Rattigan350

KerryKing,

The reason that Jesus died was to fulfill the prophesies.

152

Do JWs believe Jesus is an angel?

by slimboyfat in

i would suggest:.

the short answer is yes.. the longer answer is a qualified yes, with some caveats.

the short answer is yes because jehovah’s witnesses teach that jesus is michael the archangel, their leader, eldest and most powerful, and have taught this since the very beginning of the religion.

Rattigan350

Vanhoven7 said
"I am more and more convinced that JWs do not believe the Bible.

Acts 2: 38-39 Peter said to them, "Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins"

You are correct. Matt 28:19 says to be baptized in the name of the Father, Son and Holy spirit. But just 10 days later Peter was saying to baptize in the name of Jesus and he left off the Father and holy spirit. So I don't believe that Matt 28:19 says to baptize in the trinity.

152

Do JWs believe Jesus is an angel?

by slimboyfat in

i would suggest:.

the short answer is yes.. the longer answer is a qualified yes, with some caveats.

the short answer is yes because jehovah’s witnesses teach that jesus is michael the archangel, their leader, eldest and most powerful, and have taught this since the very beginning of the religion.

Rattigan350

"JW have as much of a personal relationship with Jesus Christ as they do with the angel Gabriel.

Imagine not even being able to say "Thank you Jesus for dying for my sins""

Why would we want a personal relationship with Jesus? He is our high priest. Did the Israelites have a personal relationship with the high priests? No? They just brought the sacrifices to him so he could do his job.

Why would we thank him for dying for our sins? as that is not why he died.

152

Do JWs believe Jesus is an angel?

by slimboyfat in

i would suggest:.

the short answer is yes.. the longer answer is a qualified yes, with some caveats.

the short answer is yes because jehovah’s witnesses teach that jesus is michael the archangel, their leader, eldest and most powerful, and have taught this since the very beginning of the religion.

Rattigan350

Why is Jesus being Michael the archangel even a subject that comes up?

It's one of those givens.

Gen 3:15 says the seed will crush the serpent which is the devil. The seed is Jesus.

Jesus said in John 14:2 "for I am going my way to prepare a place for you"

His going to prepare a place was his casting out Satan and his demons.

Jesus did the things stated in Rev 12:7-9 Battled with the dragon/devil and cast him out.

Four names are used for the devil in there, dragon, original serpent, devil and Satan.

Did it need to explain that this Michael was Jesus?

If Michael is not Jesus, why is someone else doing what Jesus said he would do, (prepare a place for his apostles) and battle and crush the devil?

38

"A Jehovah's Witness"

by NotFormer in

a very certain distinctive of jws is how they refer to themselves.

"one of jehovah's witnesses".

it's one of those coded jargon thingies.

Rattigan350

Jeffro said:

Everyone says 'One of Jehovah's Witnesses' because it sounds right.

"This suggests you live in a JW bubble."

No, it does not. It suggests that I like what sounds right. I am not 'a' anything. Israel was a people, Christians are a people. not 'a' anything.