Posts by EdenOne

68

Help needed: Written material regarding shunning of DF'd and DA'd individuals

by EdenOne in

i would like this to become a permanent thread, because i think there are grounds - at least in europe - to take this matter up to the european court of human rights.

not sure we'll ever get there, but one must start somewhere.

objective: force, by legal means, the watchtower society and the jehovah's witnesses to stop the practice of shunning ex-jehovah's witnesses, on grounds that it constitutes a violation of human rights.. what is needed: all written material ever published by the watchtower society, especially since 1940's, concerning the practice of shunning.

EdenOne

I have experienced shunning and I'm not even DF'd. That's how stupid this is. When the rumor is out that you dare to disagree with the Governing Body, and an Elder slips out (usually to wife) that you have "apostate" thoughts, you're toast. The word gets out and gets passed around, way beyond your congregation. Some will think you're already DF'd and won't bother to check the story, and will shun you by default, just to be safe. Your loving brothers and sisters will never look at you the same way, even if you're still officially a Witness. My best friend told my wife that she can't even look me in the eyes anymore, so disgrunted she is with me going inactive. As if I had the plague and a simple eye contact could propagate my 'disease'.

Eden

104

The Secret is out....but nobody cares

by MrTheocratic in

i've been looking on this site for some time but never posted.

i'll give a little about myself, but not too much.

i'm a ex-bethelite ( brooklyn )and currently serving as an elder (10 years) (thinking about stepping down) on the service committee.

EdenOne

Welcome to this forum, Mr. Theocratic.

I think there's a split mentality - liberal, prosperous areas, where most people don't buy into the WTS' propaganda, but choose not to leave or rock the boat because they don't want to lose friends and family, and they can live with their doubts, because it's a "respectable" way of life, after all.

On the other hand, in areas of poverty, unemployment, hard-liner conservative, most take the Bible literally and hang on to every word from the GB as if it were from Jehovah himself. For these, the Devil and the demons are very real, present and active. And they will jump at any and every hint that Armageddon is around the corner. Where I live is a mixed bag, with both types coexisting in the hall. But the liberal ones are afraid of the hard-core loyalists and keep their mouth shut.

It must be me, but I wouldn't be able to cope with serious doubts (or, rather, knowing TTATT) and stay in as if nothing happened. I just can't conceptualize. But I know some people do it. And they will be among the first ones to shun you if you fall out of the boat, which is really strange.

Eden

47

If someone asked you, 'Are you a righteous person'? What would be your answer?

by Esse quam videri in

what would be your answer?

are you are a righteous person?

on a scale of 1-10, how righteous do you feel you are?.

EdenOne

What's the standard for 'righteousness' that we should measure against? The deity of the Bible?

Let's see ... A God that condones slavery (I don't), polygamy (I don't), incest (I don't), genocide (I don't), capital punishment for sexual misconduct albeit consensual (I don't), tolerates rape (I don't), is too willing to kill for petty reasons (I don't), considers women as inferiors to men ( I don't)...

Seems to me I don't measure up to the righteousness of 'Yahweh'. My bad.

Eden

21

Today's groundless speculation thread - so why would a German copilot deliberately fly an airplane into a mountain?

by sir82 in

jw
friends

just can't wrap my head around this.

the guy (a) evidently did all of this on purpose, and (b) evidently had no reason at all to do so.. there is a huge chunk of the puzzle missing from this one (so far)..

EdenOne

Start using the train more often ....

52

It's starting shunning will stop brochure first.step

by poopie in

jw
friends

i'm in contact with service and writing and brochure first step there bleeding publishers they can't take it anymore publishers are depressed because they feel they must shun others and they know it's unloving.

EdenOne

The power of the GB over the rank & file is in the fear of the shunning that ensues a disfellowshipping or dissociation, or even in the treatment of cold avoidance and indifference that inactives usually receive, especially if they're seen as dissenters. I don't see them letting go of such power.

Eden

68

Help needed: Written material regarding shunning of DF'd and DA'd individuals

by EdenOne in

i would like this to become a permanent thread, because i think there are grounds - at least in europe - to take this matter up to the european court of human rights.

not sure we'll ever get there, but one must start somewhere.

objective: force, by legal means, the watchtower society and the jehovah's witnesses to stop the practice of shunning ex-jehovah's witnesses, on grounds that it constitutes a violation of human rights.. what is needed: all written material ever published by the watchtower society, especially since 1940's, concerning the practice of shunning.

EdenOne

Since you still don't address the issue of shunning as a violation of human rights, and all you attempt is to derail this thread, you don't merit a reply. And still, you show a great lack of knowledge about the Catholic excommunication. I suggest you start a new thread on how excommunication and shunning are good, loving and lawful.

Eden

68

Help needed: Written material regarding shunning of DF'd and DA'd individuals

by EdenOne in

i would like this to become a permanent thread, because i think there are grounds - at least in europe - to take this matter up to the european court of human rights.

not sure we'll ever get there, but one must start somewhere.

objective: force, by legal means, the watchtower society and the jehovah's witnesses to stop the practice of shunning ex-jehovah's witnesses, on grounds that it constitutes a violation of human rights.. what is needed: all written material ever published by the watchtower society, especially since 1940's, concerning the practice of shunning.

EdenOne

As for the pertinent bit of your post, why does an action taken before the European Court of Human Rights can't single out the Jehovah's Witnesses?

Eden

68

Help needed: Written material regarding shunning of DF'd and DA'd individuals

by EdenOne in

i would like this to become a permanent thread, because i think there are grounds - at least in europe - to take this matter up to the european court of human rights.

not sure we'll ever get there, but one must start somewhere.

objective: force, by legal means, the watchtower society and the jehovah's witnesses to stop the practice of shunning ex-jehovah's witnesses, on grounds that it constitutes a violation of human rights.. what is needed: all written material ever published by the watchtower society, especially since 1940's, concerning the practice of shunning.

EdenOne

Before you try to impress me with your TH'D, you should get your facts straight, because Catholic excommunication is different from the protestant disfellowshipping. Namely, because it only barrs an ordained member of the clerigy to officiate and the rank and file from participating in the Eucharistia. There's no shunning, no cut off from communication with others. Again, you're obscuring the discussion by attempting to mix up disfellowshipping with shunning. This discussion is about shunning alone, and how it constitutes a violation of human rights as a form of unlawful discrimination.

Eden

99

Shunned again, and you won't guess where. EVER.

by kwintestal in

jw
friends

well, we were going about our business today as we usually do on a monday.

mrs kwin went to work, kids went to school, i stayed home and made apple sauce and beer.

2:30 comes along and it's time to pick up everyone and, oh yeah ... we have that appointment today.

EdenOne

I wonder what was the outcome of this story...?

Eden

68

Help needed: Written material regarding shunning of DF'd and DA'd individuals

by EdenOne in

i would like this to become a permanent thread, because i think there are grounds - at least in europe - to take this matter up to the european court of human rights.

not sure we'll ever get there, but one must start somewhere.

objective: force, by legal means, the watchtower society and the jehovah's witnesses to stop the practice of shunning ex-jehovah's witnesses, on grounds that it constitutes a violation of human rights.. what is needed: all written material ever published by the watchtower society, especially since 1940's, concerning the practice of shunning.

EdenOne

For those who think that the First Ammendmend protects the right of a religion to shun ex-members because the Bible says so: let's imagine that a religion takes the OT to the letter. One of its members is caught in adultery. Since the OT prescribes death by stoning for that sin, this religion advocates the right to stone to death its member. Now, would the First Ammendment protect this action under the "freedom of religion" excuse? What is the difference regarding shunning?

Eden