Posts by EdenOne

233

What is BELIEF ?

by EdenOne in

stemming from the 'absentheism' thread, an old question came to my mind.

what exactly is "belief"?.

is it the same to ask: "do you believe in god?

EdenOne

Cofty: Believers get coy about defining their god because the more they say about it the easier it is to debunk. Therefore they try to be as vague as possible when debating about god. When it comes to proselytising though they have no problem being specific. Suddenly they know exactly what god does, says, likes and dislikes.

I agree.

What then constitutes "evidence"? A theist will present as evidence certain things (creation, beauty, goodness, miracles, revelations, holy writings) that a rationalist will dismiss as valid evidence. Then the theist pulls the card that he experiences god within, a personal mystical connection that only people of faith can possibly experience. To them, that's evidence. I presume this too will be dismissed by a rationalist. So, if both cannot agree on what is "evidence", where do we stand regarding knowledge? To the theist, he "knows" because he has "evidence" that god exists.

If an atheist has lack of evidence and evidence against, but no affirmative evidence of the inexistence of god ( because logically one can't prove a negative) what can he know about a given deity?

Eden

233

What is BELIEF ?

by EdenOne in

stemming from the 'absentheism' thread, an old question came to my mind.

what exactly is "belief"?.

is it the same to ask: "do you believe in god?

EdenOne

Linking back to the OP ... Regarding Spanx, - and just pretend for a moment that you didn't have reliable information that I just made it up - do you:

a) Claim the he doesn't exist because no god, or gods, or deities exist?

b) Declare that you lack belief in Spanx because you don't have evidence concerning its existence?

c) Declare that you cannot be sure that Spanx or any deity exists, because there's not enough evidence for or against or deities are unknowable?

d) ... ?

Eden

233

What is BELIEF ?

by EdenOne in

stemming from the 'absentheism' thread, an old question came to my mind.

what exactly is "belief"?.

is it the same to ask: "do you believe in god?

EdenOne

Viviane, it was you who started this nonsensical polemic of asking me to define god. I told you over and over that I'M NOT A THEIST, and therefore I don't know how to define a god for you. If you must ask that question, ask a theist.

Since you were oblivious to what I wrote, I decided to oblige and make up a god for you; in any case, Cofty said that every god ever named is a human invention. So, I might just as well make up a prop god on the fly. Just to see where you were going with this. And naturally, I'm playing the part of a believer in said god. And I'm asking you the same questions a theist believer would ask.

Naturally, this isn't what I was asking in my OP. But since you insisted in taking the thread in this direction, so be it.

Eden

233

What is BELIEF ?

by EdenOne in

stemming from the 'absentheism' thread, an old question came to my mind.

what exactly is "belief"?.

is it the same to ask: "do you believe in god?

EdenOne

Remember that I'm playing the devil's advocate here. To me, Spanx's believer, there's abundant evidence. Now, I ask of you, atheist, how can you prove me that Spanx, whom you deny to exist, doesn't exist. How can you know for sure? Or do you not believe because you don't have sufficient evidence?

Eden

205

Hi Everyone. Answer to prayer countdown...

by Stumpy in

jw
friends

i've been lurking for about 3 months now and thought i'd better finally sign up.

you have all been an immense help to me as i have come to realize that this isn't the truth so i want to say a great big thank you!

what a crazy, emotional ride it is to finally face the truth about the doubts that i have carried for many years.

EdenOne

And those who treat me with the greatest distance are some of who used to be the closest to me. Many of those who were just acquaintances remain more or less the same. Odd.

Eden

205

Hi Everyone. Answer to prayer countdown...

by Stumpy in

jw
friends

i've been lurking for about 3 months now and thought i'd better finally sign up.

you have all been an immense help to me as i have come to realize that this isn't the truth so i want to say a great big thank you!

what a crazy, emotional ride it is to finally face the truth about the doubts that i have carried for many years.

EdenOne

phizzy: [simply a fader, but] I am seen as a "spiritual danger" because even the many Elders who have spoken with me cannot answer my questions. In consequence we get no invites to JW family events.

My situation exactly.

Eden

233

What is BELIEF ?

by EdenOne in

stemming from the 'absentheism' thread, an old question came to my mind.

what exactly is "belief"?.

is it the same to ask: "do you believe in god?

EdenOne

I don't know exactly how the holy book came to be, except that is so old and passed from generation to generation. There are references to it made in ancient texts from Sumer. The content of the book was given to a few prophets directly by Spanx. Sometimes in dreams, sometimes in visions, sometimes through voices. But no one has ever seen Spanx, because he said that no one can see Spanx and remain living. But surely, the book must be of divine origin, because Spanx made sure that his word was preserved to our time.

MRI's and other tests were performed on Spanx's believers, but at the time of the testing, no contacts took place. One never knows when Spanx will make contact.

Eden

233

What is BELIEF ?

by EdenOne in

stemming from the 'absentheism' thread, an old question came to my mind.

what exactly is "belief"?.

is it the same to ask: "do you believe in god?

EdenOne

Jonathan Drake:

really?

Eden

233

What is BELIEF ?

by EdenOne in

stemming from the 'absentheism' thread, an old question came to my mind.

what exactly is "belief"?.

is it the same to ask: "do you believe in god?

EdenOne

Spanx punishes wrongdoers with death; since all humans are inherently wrongdoers, they all die. Death is seen as evidence that Spanx Almighty exists. However, Spanx wishes to extend salvation to all those who believe in him. Those will be morphed into the spiritual realm to live with Spanx. Some who passed into that higher life ocasionally contact faithful worshippers of Spanx to reassure them of their future reward. The impact of these visits is such, that Spanx's followers are willing to die for their belief even when authorities persecute them.

in the holy book of Spanx there are stories that indicate that maybe he's not all-powerful. For example, Spanx couldn't stop a comet from hitting earth and wipe out the giant lizzards that used to roam the earth once. Incidentally, science discovered fossiles of these giant lizzards, which confirms the authenticity of the holy book of Spanx.

some question how come an Almighty Spanx isn't all-powerful. It's a mystery. His followers conclude that Spanx uses his power only whan it suits his purpose.

Eden

233

What is BELIEF ?

by EdenOne in

stemming from the 'absentheism' thread, an old question came to my mind.

what exactly is "belief"?.

is it the same to ask: "do you believe in god?

EdenOne

The only "evidence" about Spanx The Almighty is in his Holy Book; his followers point to the creation as evidence. Some claim they get direct messages from Spanx, they claim to be his prophets.

Eden