i would like this to become a permanent thread, because i think there are grounds - at least in europe - to take this matter up to the european court of human rights.
not sure we'll ever get there, but one must start somewhere.
objective: force, by legal means, the watchtower society and the jehovah's witnesses to stop the practice of shunning ex-jehovah's witnesses, on grounds that it constitutes a violation of human rights.. what is needed: all written material ever published by the watchtower society, especially since 1940's, concerning the practice of shunning.
Another thing: When you leave, either by going inactive, fading, DF'd or DA'd, you can prepare yourself in advance for shunning, so that it doesn't come as a surprise. However, nothing can properly prepare you for the brutal impact of shunning once you experience what it is to become an object of shunning. It makes you sick, depressed, angered, revolted, no matter how 'prepared' you think you are.
Eden
are you out there, brother elder?.
are you finding our little show entertaining?.
in your bloodshot eyes do we appear pathetic or just disturbing?.
Very well written, Terry.
Those, elders or not, who dare in secrecy to come take a peek in here, are in fact giving the first, timid, step in a long descent from the Kingdom of Fantasy into the realm of reality. And it hurts, it really hurts sometimes, because, the more you have invested a great deal of your life into this cult and its romantic/tragic ideology, and experiencing early doubts, can be devastating inside. And it can cause some to just dump their rage onto others, as if projecting in others who experience doubts the punishment they think it should be inflicted upon themselves.
Being here is taking the first step towards that descent, but it ends up in liberation. If you're reading this message, it's a matter of time. You **will** leave the Organization, sooner or later.
Eden
i would like this to become a permanent thread, because i think there are grounds - at least in europe - to take this matter up to the european court of human rights.
not sure we'll ever get there, but one must start somewhere.
objective: force, by legal means, the watchtower society and the jehovah's witnesses to stop the practice of shunning ex-jehovah's witnesses, on grounds that it constitutes a violation of human rights.. what is needed: all written material ever published by the watchtower society, especially since 1940's, concerning the practice of shunning.
I have experienced shunning and I'm not even DF'd. That's how stupid this is. When the rumor is out that you dare to disagree with the Governing Body, and an Elder slips out (usually to wife) that you have "apostate" thoughts, you're toast. The word gets out and gets passed around, way beyond your congregation. Some will think you're already DF'd and won't bother to check the story, and will shun you by default, just to be safe. Your loving brothers and sisters will never look at you the same way, even if you're still officially a Witness. My best friend told my wife that she can't even look me in the eyes anymore, so disgrunted she is with me going inactive. As if I had the plague and a simple eye contact could propagate my 'disease'.
Eden
i've been looking on this site for some time but never posted.
i'll give a little about myself, but not too much.
i'm a ex-bethelite ( brooklyn )and currently serving as an elder (10 years) (thinking about stepping down) on the service committee.
Welcome to this forum, Mr. Theocratic.
I think there's a split mentality - liberal, prosperous areas, where most people don't buy into the WTS' propaganda, but choose not to leave or rock the boat because they don't want to lose friends and family, and they can live with their doubts, because it's a "respectable" way of life, after all.
On the other hand, in areas of poverty, unemployment, hard-liner conservative, most take the Bible literally and hang on to every word from the GB as if it were from Jehovah himself. For these, the Devil and the demons are very real, present and active. And they will jump at any and every hint that Armageddon is around the corner. Where I live is a mixed bag, with both types coexisting in the hall. But the liberal ones are afraid of the hard-core loyalists and keep their mouth shut.
It must be me, but I wouldn't be able to cope with serious doubts (or, rather, knowing TTATT) and stay in as if nothing happened. I just can't conceptualize. But I know some people do it. And they will be among the first ones to shun you if you fall out of the boat, which is really strange.
Eden
what would be your answer?
are you are a righteous person?
on a scale of 1-10, how righteous do you feel you are?.
What's the standard for 'righteousness' that we should measure against? The deity of the Bible?
Let's see ... A God that condones slavery (I don't), polygamy (I don't), incest (I don't), genocide (I don't), capital punishment for sexual misconduct albeit consensual (I don't), tolerates rape (I don't), is too willing to kill for petty reasons (I don't), considers women as inferiors to men ( I don't)...
Seems to me I don't measure up to the righteousness of 'Yahweh'. My bad.
Eden
just can't wrap my head around this.
the guy (a) evidently did all of this on purpose, and (b) evidently had no reason at all to do so.. there is a huge chunk of the puzzle missing from this one (so far)..
Start using the train more often ....
i'm in contact with service and writing and brochure first step there bleeding publishers they can't take it anymore publishers are depressed because they feel they must shun others and they know it's unloving.
The power of the GB over the rank & file is in the fear of the shunning that ensues a disfellowshipping or dissociation, or even in the treatment of cold avoidance and indifference that inactives usually receive, especially if they're seen as dissenters. I don't see them letting go of such power.
Eden
i would like this to become a permanent thread, because i think there are grounds - at least in europe - to take this matter up to the european court of human rights.
not sure we'll ever get there, but one must start somewhere.
objective: force, by legal means, the watchtower society and the jehovah's witnesses to stop the practice of shunning ex-jehovah's witnesses, on grounds that it constitutes a violation of human rights.. what is needed: all written material ever published by the watchtower society, especially since 1940's, concerning the practice of shunning.
Since you still don't address the issue of shunning as a violation of human rights, and all you attempt is to derail this thread, you don't merit a reply. And still, you show a great lack of knowledge about the Catholic excommunication. I suggest you start a new thread on how excommunication and shunning are good, loving and lawful.
Eden
i would like this to become a permanent thread, because i think there are grounds - at least in europe - to take this matter up to the european court of human rights.
not sure we'll ever get there, but one must start somewhere.
objective: force, by legal means, the watchtower society and the jehovah's witnesses to stop the practice of shunning ex-jehovah's witnesses, on grounds that it constitutes a violation of human rights.. what is needed: all written material ever published by the watchtower society, especially since 1940's, concerning the practice of shunning.
As for the pertinent bit of your post, why does an action taken before the European Court of Human Rights can't single out the Jehovah's Witnesses?
Eden
i would like this to become a permanent thread, because i think there are grounds - at least in europe - to take this matter up to the european court of human rights.
not sure we'll ever get there, but one must start somewhere.
objective: force, by legal means, the watchtower society and the jehovah's witnesses to stop the practice of shunning ex-jehovah's witnesses, on grounds that it constitutes a violation of human rights.. what is needed: all written material ever published by the watchtower society, especially since 1940's, concerning the practice of shunning.
Before you try to impress me with your TH'D, you should get your facts straight, because Catholic excommunication is different from the protestant disfellowshipping. Namely, because it only barrs an ordained member of the clerigy to officiate and the rank and file from participating in the Eucharistia. There's no shunning, no cut off from communication with others. Again, you're obscuring the discussion by attempting to mix up disfellowshipping with shunning. This discussion is about shunning alone, and how it constitutes a violation of human rights as a form of unlawful discrimination.
Eden
