Posts by EdenOne

27

Directed panspermia - a plausible theory of intelligent design?

by EdenOne in

i have just read an interesting article by astrobiologist jacob haq-misra.. in this article he describes a process called "directed panspermia" as a plausible way that one form of intelligent design - one not related with religious driven agendas involving theism - could be involved in the process by which life developed on earth and possibly in other planets as well.. sounds like a speculation that's worth entertaining.

your thoughts?.

EdenOne

But besides the fact that extraterrestrial life is highly speculative (as there is no evidence) you are still left with the problem of where did the extraterrestrial designers come from in the first place? Wouldn't they have had to evolve themselves? It doesn't really answer the question of where intelligent life came from.

True, it doesn't answer that question. But it might answer where OUR earthly life came from. And it would close the case for theism - at least on OUR planet with OUR religions and OUR 'holy books' :)

And since you mention Space Odyssey, it's more or less what's behind the plot of Carl Sagan's "Contact".

27

Directed panspermia - a plausible theory of intelligent design?

by EdenOne in

i have just read an interesting article by astrobiologist jacob haq-misra.. in this article he describes a process called "directed panspermia" as a plausible way that one form of intelligent design - one not related with religious driven agendas involving theism - could be involved in the process by which life developed on earth and possibly in other planets as well.. sounds like a speculation that's worth entertaining.

your thoughts?.

EdenOne

Only problem is that the entire Intelligent Design exercise is already - and always was - intended to be a "religious-driven agenda".

Not in this case. Have you read the article? The very assumption in which it rests is obviously at odds with the biblical account of creation.

27

Directed panspermia - a plausible theory of intelligent design?

by EdenOne in

i have just read an interesting article by astrobiologist jacob haq-misra.. in this article he describes a process called "directed panspermia" as a plausible way that one form of intelligent design - one not related with religious driven agendas involving theism - could be involved in the process by which life developed on earth and possibly in other planets as well.. sounds like a speculation that's worth entertaining.

your thoughts?.

EdenOne

I have just read an interesting article by astrobiologist Jacob Haq-Misra.

In this article he describes a process called "Directed Panspermia" as a plausible way that one form of intelligent design - one NOT related with religious driven agendas involving theism - could be involved in the process by which life developed on Earth and possibly in other planets as well.

Sounds like a speculation that's worth entertaining. Your thoughts?

137

Mouthy has Passed Away

by Simon in

jw
friends

update on mouthy (grace gough)this is graces granddaughter.

i wanted to send an update that today my beautiful grandmother passed away - surrounded by friends and family.

- may 22 1927 - sept 2nd 2016. mouthys_granddaughter.

EdenOne

I'm saddened to hear the news.

Mouthy was a real grandmother figure to this forum and deeply respected.

On a positive note, I'm happy she passed away surrounded by people who loved her.

Rest in peace!

24

WTS investment in Ford-Werke - 1943

by OrphanCrow in

*thanks to reddit poster ahilexxx for this information*.

the watchtower society was invested in the german branch of ford motor.

in 1943, their investment was worth $597,595 ($8,363,677.95 in today's value - over 8 million!)..

EdenOne

How could the WT had made an "investment" in their German branch in 1943 (in the middle of WW2) and that not being considered high treason? Plus, wasn't the Bethel in Magdeburg seized by the Nazis even way before 1939? How could money be send to Germany in 1943? Or is it a compounded figure? Something doesn't check.

60

The problem of sex (or why I'm not an atheist)

by EdenOne in

as i write this under the shadow of the walls of saint jorge's castle in lisbon, two very bored jws are standing just five metres away from me with a literature cart .... in my journey away from jwism i accepted evolution as a fact.

i also became anti-religion, agnostic and apatheist.

and, while i lean towards the persuasion of the atheist arguments, there are a few reasons that make it difficult for me to completely discard the notion of an intelligent origin of life.

EdenOne

So Eden what say you now?

I'm inclined to say that there is substantial circumstantial evidence supporting the transition to sex differentiation and sexual reproduction in the early stages of life than I previously knew of. The fact that there are examples in observable nature NOW that may give us clues as to how the process might have evolved THEN, in a very remote past, offers powerful clues on how simple organisms might have adopted sexual reproduction. Still, it doesn't quite explain how very complex organisms developed fully distinct yet necessarily complementary reproductive apparel.

Mind you, this won't tip the scale towards Intelligent Design. It's infinitely more complicated the assumption of an intelligent creator behind the process than the process driving itself.

60

The problem of sex (or why I'm not an atheist)

by EdenOne in

as i write this under the shadow of the walls of saint jorge's castle in lisbon, two very bored jws are standing just five metres away from me with a literature cart .... in my journey away from jwism i accepted evolution as a fact.

i also became anti-religion, agnostic and apatheist.

and, while i lean towards the persuasion of the atheist arguments, there are a few reasons that make it difficult for me to completely discard the notion of an intelligent origin of life.

EdenOne

Cofty how tiring is it to have to go over this stuff like every day.

Well, to be honest Cofty has been a relentless promoter of a certain worldview and we had a handful of ugly clashes in the past, but I have a tremendous amount of respect for him. We don't always agree (sometimes we don't even agree to disagree) but Cofty has been a lot more helpful to me and I'm sure others too that he may imagine. Only he knows if it's been a worthwhile endeavor or not. I'm showing here my appreciation.

60

The problem of sex (or why I'm not an atheist)

by EdenOne in

as i write this under the shadow of the walls of saint jorge's castle in lisbon, two very bored jws are standing just five metres away from me with a literature cart .... in my journey away from jwism i accepted evolution as a fact.

i also became anti-religion, agnostic and apatheist.

and, while i lean towards the persuasion of the atheist arguments, there are a few reasons that make it difficult for me to completely discard the notion of an intelligent origin of life.

EdenOne

Nicolau - It seems to me that you actually are an atheist but that you're rather hesitant to accept the label, why would that be? Correct me if I'm wrong.

I will be an atheist the day irrefutable evidence leads me that way. When that day comes - and I suspect it will come eventually - I won't have any problems to take on the label. For the time being, apatheist, agnostic and anti-religion seem to fit with the evidence at my disposal.

60

The problem of sex (or why I'm not an atheist)

by EdenOne in

as i write this under the shadow of the walls of saint jorge's castle in lisbon, two very bored jws are standing just five metres away from me with a literature cart .... in my journey away from jwism i accepted evolution as a fact.

i also became anti-religion, agnostic and apatheist.

and, while i lean towards the persuasion of the atheist arguments, there are a few reasons that make it difficult for me to completely discard the notion of an intelligent origin of life.

EdenOne

What I've read so far revolves around the advantages of sexual reproduction over asexual, and why life favored sexual reproduction.

But I'm yet to read evidence of HOW organisms went from asexual reproduction to sexual. It requires two different phenomena that necessarily have to occur simultaneously: sexual process (fusion and recombination of genetic information from two individuals) and sexual differentiation (separation of genetic information into two parts) PLUS requires that two strains of individuals with sexually differentiated genetic material developed differentiated yet complementary reproductive structures (not to mention behavioral strategies) to make the whole process work.

60

The problem of sex (or why I'm not an atheist)

by EdenOne in

as i write this under the shadow of the walls of saint jorge's castle in lisbon, two very bored jws are standing just five metres away from me with a literature cart .... in my journey away from jwism i accepted evolution as a fact.

i also became anti-religion, agnostic and apatheist.

and, while i lean towards the persuasion of the atheist arguments, there are a few reasons that make it difficult for me to completely discard the notion of an intelligent origin of life.

EdenOne

Back on the OT:

What troubles me about the issue of sexual reproduction is this:

a) It appears to be general consensus that the earliest life forms reproduced by means of asexual replication. This is an integral copy of the original that copies itself and then separates. It's a simple, elegant and effective method.

b) It appears to be the general consensus that sexual reproduction appears in a much later stage of life.

The problem is, how did some organisms evolved from asexual to sexual reproduction? Because it's not a simple variation of the asexual method. It's a much more complex process that requires an enormous level of complexity at the very beginning (not saying that asexual reproduction isn't complex; but sexual reproduction is immensely MORE complex; it's a huge leap forward from asexual reproduction.)

For starters it requires that two separate organisms develop specialized, yet necessarily complementary genetic material, cut by half, that will be recombined by means of sexual activity. This is a gargantuan conceptual difference from asexual replication and can only work with a high level of complexity to start with.