venus

Joined

• started 58 topics
• posted 901 times   see topics posted on
• send a message

Posts by venus

• 
  42

  “Tree of good and bad” means what?

  by venus in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  if “tree of good and bad” were literal, it would mean adam and eve would know what is “good and bad” only after eating of that tree.

  however, even before eating of it, they would think “it is good for us to eat of this tree” which means they are already endowed knowledge of “good and bad.” that means “tree of good and bad” is symbolic of something.. since religious organizations interpret this differently, each reader has to adopt his own conclusion.

  for me it looks like this: one thinks of good and bad in relation to himself—if something is beneficial for him he would say it is good for him, and bad for him if it is not beneficial.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  venus

  Brokeback Watchtower,

  I agree with you—story is the best humans could think of as the reason behind their fall. God is no where in the picture.
• 
  42

  “Tree of good and bad” means what?

  by venus in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  if “tree of good and bad” were literal, it would mean adam and eve would know what is “good and bad” only after eating of that tree.

  however, even before eating of it, they would think “it is good for us to eat of this tree” which means they are already endowed knowledge of “good and bad.” that means “tree of good and bad” is symbolic of something.. since religious organizations interpret this differently, each reader has to adopt his own conclusion.

  for me it looks like this: one thinks of good and bad in relation to himself—if something is beneficial for him he would say it is good for him, and bad for him if it is not beneficial.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  venus

  Deegee,

  Nice point: “God did not alert Adam and Eve to the presence of the snake or instruct them to avoid it.”

  If account is really from God, He would have included that valid point too. That shows account of tree of good and bad is the imagination humans who best thought of the reason behind humans’ fall—and that is the best they could think of.

  If man is really created His image, God doesn’t have to instruct him about any matter—humans will do exactly what God would do if He were on earth.

  If tree were not literal, then snake also could not have been literal. Snake may be symbol of sin which has access to man wherever he is.
• 
  42

  “Tree of good and bad” means what?

  by venus in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  if “tree of good and bad” were literal, it would mean adam and eve would know what is “good and bad” only after eating of that tree.

  however, even before eating of it, they would think “it is good for us to eat of this tree” which means they are already endowed knowledge of “good and bad.” that means “tree of good and bad” is symbolic of something.. since religious organizations interpret this differently, each reader has to adopt his own conclusion.

  for me it looks like this: one thinks of good and bad in relation to himself—if something is beneficial for him he would say it is good for him, and bad for him if it is not beneficial.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  venus

  Halfbana,

  Myths are like traffic lights--Red, Green, Amber. which are not simply physical objects. They carry specific messages. A story doesn't have to be historical, but the point is that it should carry some message.

  Tree of good and bad carry the message how humanity had a fall. They fell when they listened to their ego and gone into exile of unhappiness and suffering.

  That means:

  Ego creates suffering (as shown by First Adam)

  Suffering destroys ego (as shown by Second Adam--Jesus)
• 
  42

  “Tree of good and bad” means what?

  by venus in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  if “tree of good and bad” were literal, it would mean adam and eve would know what is “good and bad” only after eating of that tree.

  however, even before eating of it, they would think “it is good for us to eat of this tree” which means they are already endowed knowledge of “good and bad.” that means “tree of good and bad” is symbolic of something.. since religious organizations interpret this differently, each reader has to adopt his own conclusion.

  for me it looks like this: one thinks of good and bad in relation to himself—if something is beneficial for him he would say it is good for him, and bad for him if it is not beneficial.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  venus

  Irishdub wrote: "I think the whole point of the story (real or myth) is who do we trust ?"

  If one's life is compared to a garden, his ego stands "in the middle of the garden," around which all his intentions revolve.

  In the OP, I have suggested EGO is the tree of good and bad.

  Hence question is: Whom should we listen to--God or ego?
  
  
• 
  42

  “Tree of good and bad” means what?

  by venus in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  if “tree of good and bad” were literal, it would mean adam and eve would know what is “good and bad” only after eating of that tree.

  however, even before eating of it, they would think “it is good for us to eat of this tree” which means they are already endowed knowledge of “good and bad.” that means “tree of good and bad” is symbolic of something.. since religious organizations interpret this differently, each reader has to adopt his own conclusion.

  for me it looks like this: one thinks of good and bad in relation to himself—if something is beneficial for him he would say it is good for him, and bad for him if it is not beneficial.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  venus

  notalone,

  You brought an excellent point: "The term 'of good and bad' could also mean 'everything'.

  That would mean they were forbidden from doing anything. This is an indication that story was poorly copied from other cultures.
• 
  7

  The Resurrection narrative can make perfect sense if you consider it to be a lie.

  by Island Man in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  there are aspects to the resurrection story that seem unnecessary but make perfect sense if you consider them as patches to shore up the lie of jesus' resurrection.. (1) why did there have to be angels present at jesus' resurrection?

  there is no other resurrection account in the bible that mentions the involvement of angels.. possible explanation: jesus' disciples really did steal jesus' body from the tomb.

  two or three of them ambushed and knocked/drugged unconscious the guards on the scene before stealing the body.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  venus

  If his resurrection was historical, all the four gospels would have given exactly the same details about it. Mark 16:8 shows the first ones who were told of his resurrection were "Trembling and bewildered" rather than being overjoyed and empowered. Yet John 20:18 gives a totally different picture about the same.

  Mathew 28:15 shows that resurrection account was written many years later.
• 
  42

  “Tree of good and bad” means what?

  by venus in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  if “tree of good and bad” were literal, it would mean adam and eve would know what is “good and bad” only after eating of that tree.

  however, even before eating of it, they would think “it is good for us to eat of this tree” which means they are already endowed knowledge of “good and bad.” that means “tree of good and bad” is symbolic of something.. since religious organizations interpret this differently, each reader has to adopt his own conclusion.

  for me it looks like this: one thinks of good and bad in relation to himself—if something is beneficial for him he would say it is good for him, and bad for him if it is not beneficial.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  venus

  If “Tree of good and bad” were literal, it would mean Adam and Eve would know what is “good and bad” only after eating of that tree. However, even before eating of it, they would think “it is good for us to eat of this tree” which means they are already endowed knowledge of “good and bad.” That means “tree of good and bad” is symbolic of something.

  Since religious organizations interpret this differently, each reader has to adopt his own conclusion. For me it looks like this: One thinks of good and bad in relation to himself—if something is beneficial for him he would say it is good for him, and bad for him if it is not beneficial. This is the characteristic of ego. That means “tree of good and bad” represents ego. Our experience is that the day we start interpreting things and happenings as good and bad our happiness ‘positively dies.’ Hence it would seem God’s command was not to interpret things and happenings as “good and bad.” Such a command is reasonable because good and bad are relative. One may say wheat is good but weed is bad whereas a herbalist may find this so-called weed as precious medicine. Rainy season may be good for certain business people whereas summer season may be good for another business.

  When I stopped interpreting things and happenings as good and bad but started as seeing them as flow of events which are totally neutral, it keeps my happiness in tact.
• 
  29

  The bizarreness of Genesis 6:2

  by doubtfull1799 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  "the sons of the true god began to notice that the daughters of men were beautiful.

  so they began taking as wives all whom they chose.".

  it may be feasible to some to accept the bible's assertion that the first humans were tempted to pursue independence from god, especially since they were created in his image and he is independent from any authority.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  venus

  Story unwittingly betrays human tendency to blame others (fallen angels in this case) for own mistakes
• 
  29

  The bizarreness of Genesis 6:2

  by doubtfull1799 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  "the sons of the true god began to notice that the daughters of men were beautiful.

  so they began taking as wives all whom they chose.".

  it may be feasible to some to accept the bible's assertion that the first humans were tempted to pursue independence from god, especially since they were created in his image and he is independent from any authority.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  venus

  Great points that argue against divine inspiration!
• 
  10

  Whether Jesus was a historical figure or not matters not

  by venus in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  when i suffered some loss what jesus said came to my mind: “if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, let him have your coat also.” (mathew 5:40) principle behind this statement made flash to me: ‘here shirt is only a symbol of material things/comfort.

  if you suffer a loss, have the mind-set that i have no problem even if i suffer some greater loss,’ and my worry immediately disappeared.

  whether jesus was a historical figure or not matters not if what he (supposedly) said happens to be of great practical help..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  venus

  scratchme1010,

  I was trying to show that apostate can understand the Bible better