Posts by undercover

68

My Mother Passed

by Roberta804 in

thank you for all of your support durning the two difficult weeks my mother was on her death bed.

last night at 10:30pm she breath her last with my sister and i by her side.

this is a real end of an era for me as i have known little these past 8 years other than taking care of my parents.

How long did it take you to prepare for talks or parts in the KM school?

by OneDayillBeFree in

several years ago, whenever i got a talk slip i would get really nervous but accept it and work on it almost immediately.

of course that was way back when i still believed it all.. now they gave me a #3 talk out of the blue about a month ago and i had forgotten all about it till the meeting night.

i really thought about not showing up at all but at the last minute, i decided to go.. so when i got there the meeting had already started and so i just stayed in the back looked at the info, found 2 scriptures and then without any notes i went up and gave the stupid talk!.

undercover

I usually got it up the week of. And even then, faked my way through it. I wasn't a good speaker and my nervousness usually showed.

But the best talk I ever gave was when I forgot I had a talk. Found out when I showed up at the hall and saw my name on the list. I spent the instruction talk looking some scriptures, made a few notes and faked my way through it. It was a no 5 talk, I think. I was too good. They started using me to be a substitute after that. If I could whip up a talk on a moment's notice, I was their man, er, patsy.

80

The "Pop-In"

by Mr. Falcon in

so last night the wife is working, the kids are getting ready for bed and i'm watching futurama.

doorbell rings.

now it's dark, snowing and i live on a back road, so it's very odd to have a visitor.

undercover

The best advice I've ever heard on this board on how to handle "pop-ins" was to step outside to talk to who ever was so rude to pop over without calling first.

That's what I do now. If they're 'pop-in's, I never invite them in. The last two that popped in, it was cold and rainy. I held the door open just enough to converse but make it clear that it wasn't open enough to let them in. They didn't stay long.

80

The "Pop-In"

by Mr. Falcon in

so last night the wife is working, the kids are getting ready for bed and i'm watching futurama.

doorbell rings.

now it's dark, snowing and i live on a back road, so it's very odd to have a visitor.

undercover

A friend of mine, sorta... we were friends back when I was active, but he's an elder and hasn't totally given up on me. He is prone to the drop-in visits. Never called ahead, never made plans... just showed up. Saturday mornings (ah, the ole 'count-your-time-while-visiting ploy'), Sunday afternoons, Tuesday evening during dinner. At one particularly interrupting dinner time drop-in, he mentioned about getting together and 'studying' the bible together (code for: re-indoctrinate me). I agreed that it sounded like fun (I lied) and told him we would have to do that. My plan was to wait a couple of weeks and just show up at his house at his dinner time, with bible in hand ready to study. And when he protested that we shouldve planned ahead, I would throw his drop-in visits back at him. But I never did it. Re-runs of The Simpsons prevented me from getting up off the sofa.

But, yea - it is a trait particular to JWs: to actually visit a person to make plans to ... visit a person

50

The Watchtower Society has come to grips with the futility of D2D preaching

by wasblind in

you don't even have to read between the lines, they say it straight out on their website.

" in many countries, more and more people obtain information online.".

who'd a thunk it .

undercover

Mormons point out that their members are supposedly just normal people. "I'm a surfer, and I'm Mormon."

Didn't work for Mitt Romney...

Seriously though, Mormons do come across as more normal than JWs. They're more part of the world around them. They run for president, they vote, they join the military, they celebrate local/nations customs/holidays.

In some ways, it's more sinister too. Because they appear more normal, when one realizes the faultiness of their religion, and want to leave, the cult aspects are less tangible to point out.

But their system seems to work for the LDS; they tithe, so they get their money and don't have to coerce their followers with other cult tactics like the WTS does.

62

How do apocolytpic cults start?

by EntirelyPossible in

i was doing some reading on jonestown recently, which led me to some reading on the branch davidians and the heaven's gate folks.. it seems to me (and this is the part i want to discuss) doomsday or apocolyptic cults all share some common characteristics:.

- secret knowledge of am impending disaster.

- their survival if they follow the messages from a higher source that their leader receives.

undercover

Secret knowledge of am impending disaster - This doesn't fit the JW's. They have been printing loads of literature about this and the Armaggedon has been part of the teaching of the JW's since very early. It's not a "secret knowledge".

This knowledge is revealed only to the leaders of the JW religion, i.e. the Faithful and Discreet Slave Class, these days just the GB. The ones who dispense spiritual food at the right time. Without their private pipeline from Jehovah, this knowledge would not be available. And they don't mind letting all their followers know just how fucked they'd be if they don't follow their lead. So ... yes it does fit the JWs.

Insulation from the outside world (either mentally and/or physically). Partially true (mentally), not true (phisically).

If you wanna nitpick it from a literal sense, then no, JWs are not physically insulated from the outside world...that is, they aren't hogtied in a compound basement, never allowed to step outside and be seen.

But - since JWs are forever warned and counseled about the evils of the world, and associating with worldly people, they are in a sense being insulated, not only mentally but physically. By instilling fear of worldly events, people, activites, JWs tend to isolate themselves from the world around them to a large degree. So ... yes there is a form of physical insulation from the world.

A charismatic leader that appeals to the desires of the followers - Completely untrue with the JW's.

This one is a bit tricky when it comes to JWs. Since Russell and Rutherford, they haven't had a charismatic leader, and they have over time focused on a leadership group, instead of one man. While there is no Jim Jones, or David Koresh, that is charismatic, the leadership does appeal to desires of the followers, in telling them they can live forever, be saved from destruction, etc. They appeal to a delusional longing of being special and different than the world around them. While not charismatic, they appeal to the followers by making all of them feel special by being in association with the "brotherhood" as led, conveniently enough, the very men who just told you they were being used by God.

A sense of tension due to the impending doom (that never seems to happen). The hype around 1914, 1925 and 1975 momentarily corresponds to this, but without a given date-target, the JW's are much more relaxed about "the end".

They aren't relaxed. They're just more confused. The WTS has stumbled and haven't found a way to keep the sheeple focused on 'the end', but there is a sense of tension. How many dubs go 'round saying, "this world is so bad. I'll be glad when the new system gets here and solves all our problems". Procrastinating and avoiding problems to the point of expecting some invisible entity to take care of them for you is bound to create tension.

23

ravens! super bowl

by unstopableravens in

ravens super bowl!.

undercover

with the bro vs. bro storyline, ESPN will be unwatchable during the next two weeks. Wait, I take that back. ESPN is always unwatchable.

I rarely watch any sports channel, unless they're actually showing, oh, I dunno - SPORTS! I know! What a concept! I love watching the game, but I never watch crap before the game or during the week. Same with other sports. I hate tuning into a NASCAR race that was advertised for 2pm but they're not gonna drop the flag for another hour. So they spend an hour following drivers around the pit asking them stupid questions. And I have to mute the first lap when Darryl Waltrip is covering the race. If you know NASCAR, you know why...

Somewhere along the line sports became about the event, not the game/race/match itself. NASCAR is the leader in that concept. Forget the race. Who's playing in the pre-race concert? Who will be the Grand Marshall? How many and what kind of military planes will do the fly over? What stars are in the crowd? I don't care. Just drop the rag and go racin.

The NFL seems to be copying that as well. Pre-game hype and concerts. "special" nights of games... "Welcome to the Thursday edition of Sunday Night Football" Wait, what? Why not just call it Thursday Night Football? And why do you need a five minute intro recorded song with Faith Hill? It's the NFL, not the Grammies or the CMAs.

And the Super Bowl.... the most overhyped sporting event in the world. And the game rarely lives up to the hype. They usually aren't as good as the conference finals. The pre-game starts over 4 hours before kick off. Hell, the game only lasts 3 hours. What is the point in all that? And who actually sits down and watches 7plus straight hours of that? You need a lobotomy... wait, that is a lobotomy.

38

Top Ten most SHOPLIFTED items?

by Terry in

jw
friends

i realize that such stolen items would have to be in some way portable and this eliminates most large items from the list.

still, i was surprised!.

does anybody have any thoughts as to whether this list is indicative of any special need trends among humanity today?.

undercover

Some places go overboard on trying to keep stuff from being lifted. I understand locking certain things up, or keeping them behind counters, but there is a point where you have to trust that the average person isn't there to steal you blind.

I was in an electronics store and they had a nice camera section. I was looking at a particular model I had read about. It was on the counter, in a long line with other models. They all had cables attached so you couldn't walk off with them. And that's okay. Makes sense. But they went a step further to make sure no one stole anything. I didn't know this - until - I picked the camera up to feel it in my hands. Red lights and alarms went off all over the damn place. At first I thought it was something else and then realized everyone was looking at me and pimply faced sales assistants were running toward me. I was fussed at for looking the item without a store rep present. I was embarrassed until I got my wits back and then I was mad. You got the damn things on a cable. All I wanted to do was pick it up and feel the weight and see how the controls were set up. Pissed me off to the point that I never went back in that store. Refused. I'd pay higher at a competitor before I'd go in there again. And then they went out of business. Nyahhh....

56

JEHOVAH NEEDS YOUR MONEY FOR 2014!!!!!!!!

by DATA-DOG in

has anyone else recieved the letter from the gb about international conventions in 2014?

according to the letter the missionarys/order of full time servants desperately need to get to the conventions in their homeland.

so to accomplish this, jehovah needs 15 cents per publisher, per congregation for some months ( sorry i can't remember the exact length of time ).

undercover

When I first read the initial post, I immediately started doing the math.

But - back when I was still in, at the height of my indoctrination, and those type letters were read, I never did that. Fifteen cents a month. I can afford that, heck, I can afford a dollar in case some poorer brother or sister can't. It seemed so small, but pennies add up, and if they needed a few bucks to help missionaries or special pioneers, surely we could all help out.

Now though, knowing that they're getting hit for a huge payout on a lawsuit, with more to come I'm sure, they need money. And a story that they need it so missionaries can get home for the conventions. Bullshit. 1. That should be part of normal operating expenses. They do it at every international convention. 2. Several million dollars to just fly people around? And that's all it will be. They'll expect families and local congregations to pick up the rest - housing, food, local travel. 3. and most important. The WTS doesn't give a rat's ass about individuals, be they missionaries, or plain old publishers. Everything they do - EVERYTHING - is about the organization and it's survival, not the followers. The expense of covering missionary travel expenses is a ruse. They need a quick infusion of cash, and this is how to further fleece the flock, and let them feel good about it as well.

50

The Watchtower Society has come to grips with the futility of D2D preaching

by wasblind in

you don't even have to read between the lines, they say it straight out on their website.

" in many countries, more and more people obtain information online.".

who'd a thunk it .

undercover

It's obvious that the door-to-door doesn't work. It's a horrible business model.

So, the WTS is starting to come out and admit it. While the WTS slowly rebuilds from a publishing empire to a real estate holdings empire, just what do they do with the millions of door-to-door sales people? How do you keep them motivated to keep knocking on doors, when the product they were pushing is slowly regulated down to a few brochures and tracts?

JWs have become dumber over the last couple/three generations. No more knowing their bible and being able to look up scriptures on the fly, trying to give a 20 minute disertation at the door. They de-evolved into human robots, giving out magazines. How do you transform them back into bible study hunters (that's make a good reality show btw) and keep them motivated to going door-to-door, looking for converts without the tools they once had?