undercover

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Posts by undercover

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  34

  Stereotypical ELDERS

  by tazmaniac in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a while back we had a fairly sucessful posting history on stereotypical witnesses.

  how about stereotypical elders.

  i will start the ball rolling with two:.

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  undercover

  Okay... did no one hear actually have any elders that they liked? Not as elders, I mean... just as people.

  There were a few that I liked and a couple that I could even call friend. But the vast majority were closer to the one I described earlier. I was thinking of one elder in particular when typing that. I could see him in my memory doing the things that I wrote. Others weren't as bad, but had many of the same traits.

  But to be fair, here's another:

  Brother Like a Father to Me. He was always there to encourage me. He never belittled me or unduly chastised me. He gave me my first summer job and paid me fairly. He warned me when other elders were on the warpath and how to either avoid them or outwit them. He married me and my wife. He taught by example and by word. He loved the children and was easy for them to talk to. The other elders ganged up on him, but he never let them get him down. He was merciful with those that erred. He was one of two men ever that I respected as an elder.
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  34

  Stereotypical ELDERS

  by tazmaniac in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a while back we had a fairly sucessful posting history on stereotypical witnesses.

  how about stereotypical elders.

  i will start the ball rolling with two:.

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  undercover

  Brother Sanctimonious Self-righteous SOB. He knows everything. He tells you how to do everything. He tells you what you're not doing that you should be doing. His family is perfect. He tells others that your family is weak. He gets pioneer hours but you never see him knock on a door. He editorializes all his parts on the service meeting. His answers at the WT study are several minutes long, filled with all kinds of useless facts that have nothing to do with the material. He can and will criticize and degrade anyone not meeting his expectations but cannot even take a slight joke about his weight. He can't hold a job in the real world, but he expects you to laud him as if he were one of the apostles.
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  44

  Harry Potter Promoting Occultism??

  by Satanus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  is harry potter promoting occultism, in your opinion?

  i haven't read any of the books, but i saw the first movie.

  i do some stuff that would be laballed occult by the wt, yet i didn't see any of that there.

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  undercover

  Does Harry Potter promote occultism?

  Depends on what you mean by promote. The book has wizards, witches, potions, magic and other supernatural references. Does it encourage people to become wizards, witches, etc? No. But it makes these fictional characters who use magic and supernatural forces seem normal and ordinary. To fundamentalists and extremists, this is promotion of the occult. To more liberal minded people, it's just a good fairy tale.

  I have enjoyed the movies and the books. I don't see it as harmful when you take it for what it is, a fairy tale fantasy. The one thing that did stick out as unusual to me though was the fact they observed Christmas and Easter holidays. So these are Christian wizards? I don't see the connection. Halloween makes sense but not the Christ related holidays. Just shows that it's a story meant to be enjoyed and not dissected I guess.
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  6

  did you ever feel you were being spied on? followed, cameras behind mirrors

  by topanga in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals
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  undercover

  No. I've been pretty much left alone since I went AWOL, outside of the elders push to visit inactive ones earlier in the spring.

  I have a question for those that went to the DC this year. Any of you feel like you were being watched or followed while on convention grounds? I remember a thread a while back about the "black dot" attendants following suspicious looking people and cameras being trained on the same types. I haven't been to the DC yet but will probably go, at least a day or two. I was curious as to what to look for if this should happen to me.

  Paranoid? I dunno, but when people are out to get you, paranoia is just good thinking.
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  96

  "Reinstatement Party" Called Off Per The Society

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a number of weeks ago, i mentioned how my niece was seeking reinstatement.

  well, after all was said and done, the elders allowed her back in.

  my brother and his wife were giving her a little "coming back" party with about a total of 35 guests.

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  undercover

  I always got a kick out of having to tell a person that you just disfellowshipped that they can't talk to anyone about the impending action.

  So a DF'd person isn't supposed to tell anyone they are being DF'd before the announcement is made? I didn't know that. Everyone that I knew pretty well that was DF'd always called and told me to kinda say goodbye for awhile.

  So not only are they being cast out from the group, they can't even say goodbye before being sent away. Bastards.

  "The tribe has spoken. Turn in your torch and leave tribal council immediately"
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  24

  1914, how does the Watchtower calculate this ???

  by run dont walk in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  okay i haven't been to a meeting in 15 years and my memory has slipped on this one, so to the best of your knowledge how does the watchtower come up with 1914.. i understand the 607 bce jerusalem thing, (which we know is wrong more like 587/586).

  i understand the gentile times / seven times thing that gives you 2520 years ( 7 x 360).

  i understand the day for a year calculation.. but the part i don't get is why only 360 days for a year and not 365 or 365.25, you can't calculate only 360 days a year through history because it would throw everything off.. hey maybe the watchtower will get "new light" on this and change it to 365 , it would give them an extra 35 years to work with ????.

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  undercover

  Sorry, the WTS has a lot of stuff wrong, but I don't think it's what you're accusing them of. Check that math again. 7 * 360 does equal 2520. Think of 607 BC as negative 607 (-607). -607 + 2520 = 1913. Except there's no year 0, so you can't just add like that. To make up for going directly from -1 to 1 you've got to add another year back in. So, 1913 + 1 = 1914. Not sure where you get 1877 from this.

  7 x 360 = 2520 Where does 360 come from? It's how many days are in a year(jewish calender).

  The end of gentile times formula is based on 2520 which is arrived at by using 360. But when adding 2520 to 607 the formula changes to 365 day years. Where does 365 come from? How can we use that as a constant when 360 has been identified as the constant? So 607 plus 2520 years of 360 days instead of 365 days equals 1877 plus or minus.

  They start the calculations using 360 day years but end the calculations using 365 day years.

  607 + 2520(360 days) = 1877 give or take (1877 may be in error but it's within a couple of years)

  607 + 2520(365 days) = 1914 (I had a typo on the original formula. Sorry bout that)

  There's a difference of 12600 days between 2520 years of 360 days and 2520 years of 365 days. That equals 35 years of 360 days or 34.5 years of 365 days.

  I'm not a mathmatician by any stretch of the imagination, but I'm pretty sure you can't change the constants of a formula in the middle of a formula. But that's exactly what is being done in trying to come up with 1914. Mathmatically it can't work that way.

  Any math whizzes out there that can explain this better? Or show me how I'm wrong?
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  23

  Do You Have the "I Was Just A Publisher" Mentality?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  .....and that's why i hate, dislike, can't stand, anyone that used to be an elder???

  ..........after reading so many "bad elder" stories, i can understand why some might feel that they were just one of the rank-and-file and were treated poorly vs. someone like an elder that could have authority and try to intimidate those that they felt they could push around.

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  undercover

  Adding to that, having been one, I got the feeling that there was something uncomfortable about it. I always just wanted to be 'one of the boys' and to just be liked, but often times, being an elder got in the way of that to some extent.

  I was an MS. Appointed at an early age. Earlier than anyone else in my peer group. I didn't get big-headed about it(as best as I can remember). I always felt undeserving actually. But all my buddies(so called) started to not include me in weekend activities anymore. Can't have the MS along. He might counsel us or tell on us. After they were appointed later, it kinda went back to normal but I remember that not being "one of the boys" was not fun and I felt left out somewhat.
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  25

  Disctrict conventions and hot days

  by JH in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  as far as i can remember, the district convention was always the last week of june or first week of july in my region.

  in either case it was always very hot out, and where we gathered for the convention it was always very hot there also.

  this year would have been no exception since it was in the upper 80's and lower 90's since a few days here.. i can remember a couple of times when the temperature inside the olympic stadium in montreal was about 90f.

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  undercover

  I was in Atlanta in 1968. I remember my knees got sunburned (guess I was wearing my skirts a little too short, huh?). Didn't it rain during a drama and they had to put it off for a day?

  I got sunburnt too. We had to skip a couple of sessions because the whole family 'bout had heat stroke. I do remember it raining one day. Thunderstorm came up and it poured. It was a relief to me. From 90+ to 70 degrees and cool rain. I loved it. I ran around in it(I was only a kid at the time). Can't remember if they postponed anything or not. I didn't pay much attention to any of it.
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  24

  1914, how does the Watchtower calculate this ???

  by run dont walk in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  okay i haven't been to a meeting in 15 years and my memory has slipped on this one, so to the best of your knowledge how does the watchtower come up with 1914.. i understand the 607 bce jerusalem thing, (which we know is wrong more like 587/586).

  i understand the gentile times / seven times thing that gives you 2520 years ( 7 x 360).

  i understand the day for a year calculation.. but the part i don't get is why only 360 days for a year and not 365 or 365.25, you can't calculate only 360 days a year through history because it would throw everything off.. hey maybe the watchtower will get "new light" on this and change it to 365 , it would give them an extra 35 years to work with ????.

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  undercover

  Here's what gets me:

  A day for a year, a year being 360 days, for whatever reason. The seven times prophecy. 7 x 360 = 2520. Destruction of the temple at Jerusalem, 607(wrong, but hey give em a break). A day for a year again, modern fulfillment of seven times prophecy. 607 + 2520(360 days) = 1877 give or take. But somewhere in the middle of the formula, the WTS goes from a year equaling 360 days to a year equaling 365 days so that they figure: 607 + 2530(365 days) = 1914. You can't change a constant in the middle of a math equation, but the WTS does. Not only have they twisted prophecy, they have twisted mathmatical rules.
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  25

  Disctrict conventions and hot days

  by JH in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  as far as i can remember, the district convention was always the last week of june or first week of july in my region.

  in either case it was always very hot out, and where we gathered for the convention it was always very hot there also.

  this year would have been no exception since it was in the upper 80's and lower 90's since a few days here.. i can remember a couple of times when the temperature inside the olympic stadium in montreal was about 90f.

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  undercover

  The District Conventions were always inside with decent A/C but I remember going to International assemblies in the late 60s and 70s. 1968 in Atlanta, 7 days, in the old baseball stadium. Atlanta in June/July? What the hell were they thinking? Baseball at night was hot enough, but to sit in the scorching sun, in meeting clothes, for not two sessions, but three sessions a day was absolute torture.