Posts by undercover

21

A couple of questions about summer conventions (spinoff)

by razorMind in

being as i haven't been to a convention in years, i have a couple of questions:

do they still come out with that list of special-jw-rate hotels at the service meeting for the summer conventions?

also, i remember times when the list would be practically useless by the time my parents got home from that service meeting and started trying to make reservations.

undercover

Is there anything really wrong with getting free rooms if you guarantee so many other rooms are taken?

My biggest complaint is how you were labeled unfaithful if you did not use the rooming list. I am fortunate enough to be considered a seasoned traveler and in being one, I have certain standards that I look for in hotel accomodations. Usually on these lists, there were only one or two acceptable hotels. The rest were cheap and below the standards that I was used to. According to the "counsel", if your first choices were full, then you were to proceed down the line until you found one. I refuse to stay in cheap, dirty motels when just down the street there's a luxury hotel that I can afford. I understand the Society's desire to find affordable accomodations for everyone, but shouldn't the affordable accomodations be saved for those that really need it and let those that can afford more seek their own accomodations? I never was able to see how I was grieving the spirit by staying in a hotel of my own choosing.

63

The Biggest Scandal In Your Congregation

by Hunyadi in

i attended a notorious congregation as a child, the infamous winter gardens congregation!

my cousin and his best friend, both named joe, were elders, my cousin was the po and the other joe was a total loser suck up who wanted to be just like my cousin, joe.

what was even funnier, as i get off point a bit, is that "suck up" joe's wife, cathy, did everything she could do to get her pudgy lil self to dress, look, walk, and talk like my cousin joe's wife, clementine.

undercover

I wish I wasn't still trying to lay low. I've got some good stories, but if I tell them it will give me away for sure. A couple of these had to have direction from NY to straighten them out. But reading the ones here shows me that the halls I was in really wasn't any different than the ones mentioned here, which just goes to show that JWs aren't really that much better than the general populace.

125

Making 607 crumble

by ellderwho in

during my eight month long study with "elder bob" (moms husband) we have batted around many subjects to say the least.

but the one that really stands out is the dreaded date of 607 bc.

im sorry i just will not let up with this date, and him having to prove it can stand.

undercover

Apparently there cannot be much secular evidence for the traditional chronology because according to the the site you recommended there is uncertainty between 586 or 587. So much for the abundance of secular evidence.

Scholar is hung up on the fact that there is no evidence to pin the date exactly to 586 or 587 so therefore it can't be accepted. Most of us are hung up on the fact that there is no evidence to support 607 so therefore it can't be accepted. Okay, none of it can be accepted. I guess we'll have to accept the fact that nobody really knows when Jerusalem was destroyed then.

If that's the case, no one can determine when Jesus might return if his return is based on the date of the fall of the temple. We're right back where we started. The Society is still wrong. The date is wrong, and their interpratation is just that, interpretation. I can interpret however I want and be just as right as they are.

35

JWs and voting. Is it okay now?

by NikL in

jw
friends

i know there has been lots of discussion on this issue in the past year but i have been unable to find it.

i need to know where to find the questions from readers that talked about it being okay for people to vote if their concience allows.

i brought this issue up with a couple of people, one a rank and file dub and the other an elder.

undercover

The letter said that the comments in the QFR really only applied in countries where people were required to vote, may even have included a husband requiring a wife to vote,

It's a conscience matter only where you're required to vote by law but you're not allowed to use your conscience in other places? What happened to all JWs believe and practise the same no matter where in the world?

62

Got caught throwing magazines in the trash

by unbeliever in

jw
friends

i had to take my dad to the va hospital for a doctor's appointment and in almost every waiting room there was magazines not even recent issues.

you have to wait for freaking ever at the va hospital so i decided to do my civic duty and i went around this huge hospital collecting magazines and would throw them in the nearest trash can.

nobody cared until i got on the 4th floor.

undercover

I remember going to hospitals and depositing old mags in the waiting rooms. If someone was in there though, I would skip it. Too damned ashamed to do it while people were watching. Here's the really bad part; we usually did this when visiting "friends" in the hospital so we could count our time while there. Is that not just the lowest? I am thoroughly ashamed of myself right now.

Makes me wonder about the old lady that accosted you. Was she more concerned about her husbands health or counting magazines? Old bitch.

39

Are the days of the week Pagan?

by shotgun in

someone posted that the wt should discard the calendar and the days of the week as pagan because of their origins.

actually they did and tried to replace it with their own.

didn't last but it shows the mindset of those who were telling everyone god was directing them at the time and still today.

undercover

Let's see, 1903.

Harley-Davidson motorcycles came into existence.

The Wright Brothers made the first powered flight.

Henry Ford started the first automobile assembly line production facility.

The Bible Students invented a new calender.

Which of these was to prove to be of most significant in the upcoming 100 years?

35

JWs and voting. Is it okay now?

by NikL in

jw
friends

i know there has been lots of discussion on this issue in the past year but i have been unable to find it.

i need to know where to find the questions from readers that talked about it being okay for people to vote if their concience allows.

i brought this issue up with a couple of people, one a rank and file dub and the other an elder.

undercover

...first they say that you are to be treated as if you are disfellowshiped if you vote and then they say that it's a personal choice. Then they say that if there is a law that says you have to vote then it's ok. But what did they do during the vietnam draft? They said that if you went into the draft you were DF'd. So most young men either went to jail for a year or fled to Canada. The draft was a LAW that said you had to go into the military. So they said that they will not follow man's laws if it means breaking God's laws. So if it's a law that says you have to vote...and the WTS says you are to remain neutral....and then they say that it's your choice...are they saying that it's ok to break God's Laws to live in harmony with Man's Laws?

Oh what a tangled web we weave, when at first we practice to deceive.

13

NEW WT ARTICLE ON SAYING THE WORD PAGAN?

by sandy in

does anyone know of this article?

my friend just told me her mom came home the other day and told her you are not supposed say the word pagan.

but she did not tell her why but instead gave her the wt article to read.

undercover

Instead of saying, "the Society teaches," many Witnesses prefer to use such expressions as, "the Bible says" or, "I understand the Bible to teach." In this way they emphasize the personal decision that each Witness has made in accepting Bible teachings and also avoid giving the false impression that Witnesses are somehow bound to the dictates of some religious sect.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

all I have to say about that is, PAGAN PAGAN PAGAN PAGAN PAGAN PAGAN.

35

JWs and voting. Is it okay now?

by NikL in

jw
friends

i know there has been lots of discussion on this issue in the past year but i have been unable to find it.

i need to know where to find the questions from readers that talked about it being okay for people to vote if their concience allows.

i brought this issue up with a couple of people, one a rank and file dub and the other an elder.

undercover

*** Reasoning from the Scriptures (1985, 1989) pp.269-76 Neutrality ***

Neutrality

Definition: The position of those who do not take sides with or give support to either of two or more contending parties. It is a fact of ancient and modern-day history that in every nation and under all circumstances true Christians have endeavored to maintain complete neutrality as to conflicts between factions of the world. They do not interfere with what others do about sharing in patriotic ceremonies, serving in the armed forces, joining a political party, running for a political office, or voting. But they themselves worship only Jehovah, the God of the Bible; they have dedicated their lives unreservedly to him and give their full support to his Kingdom.

*** Pay Attention to Yourselves And To All the Flock, Unit 5(c) p.140 ***

Jehovah's Witnesses maintain neutrality with regard to the political and military affairs of the nations. (John 17:16; rs pp. 269-76)
They do not interfere with what others do as to voting in political elections, running for or campaigning for political offices, joining nonneutral organizations, shouting political slogans, and so forth. (w86 9/1 pp. 19-20; w68 6/1 pp. 351-2)
Since true dedicated Christians are "no part of the world," if a member of the congregation unrepentantly pursues a course in violation of his Christian neutrality, he thereby disassociates himself from the neutral Christian congregation. (John 15:19; 17:14-16; w82 1/15 p. 31)
Elders should talk to one known to be contemplating taking such a course, since he may be doing so in ignorance. (Ps. 119:67; Gal. 6:1; 1 Tim. 1:13)
If he disregards the help proffered and pursues a course in violation of Christian neutrality, a committee should send the facts substantiating the disassociation to the branch office on the S-77 and S-79 forms.
An announcement is usually made that the individual has disassociated himself from the congregation, and the person should be told orally about his position. If for some extenuating reasons no announcement is made, persons in the congregation who might be visited by the disassociated person may be informed privately. The individual should be treated as one who is disfellowshipped. See Unit 5 (a), pages 101-2 .

So does the 99 Watchtower replace the thoughts and instructions shown here?

18

Pretzels are Pagan, will you eat just one?

by codeblue in

last night mr. cb and i were watching the travel channel which had an interesting program about pretzels.

the pretzel was originally made in 620 a.d. by the monks.

the meaning of the shape of the pretzel we found even more amazing.

undercover

You jogged my memory, CB! I remember as a kid that some of the JWs had discovered the origin of pretzels and made a big deal of not buying or eating them. Then someone asked if eating the little straight ones was okay. God, I forgot all about that.