undercover

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Posts by undercover

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  17

  Did you go to your prom or belong to a "worldly" club while you were a witness?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i didn't go to the prom but i did belong to a chess club until the awake article said it was a war game and suggested true christians wouldn't play such a game.

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  undercover

  No proms, no dances, no clubs, no sports, no pep rallies, no school concerts, no voting in class elections, no nuthin...

  ...and people wondered why I hated school, and couldn't wait to graduate...
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  11

  "Laughter trumps fear every time" - another method to chip away at WT's authority?

  by sir82 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  saw this article on slate.. it got me thinking - the wts are certainly providing lots of ammunition for spoofing.

  talks about tight pants, singing trolleys, rubber faced buffoonery from lett...... what if we start encouraging jws to laugh at their leadership, instead of kowtowing in reverential awe?.

  from the article:.

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  undercover

  I think there's some truth in that.  Going by personal experience...once you get someone to irreverently laugh at something once held sacred, they tend to not have the reservations of being offended, or abstaining from ridiculing the absurd or ridiculous.

  The problem is getting them to aim that irreverence at something a little more indoctrinated into their personality, such as the JW religion, it's silly traditions, indefensible doctrine, fellow members, or it's authority figures.  But, once that seal is broken, then it opens up the potential for them to see the futility of it all.  But it's baby steps.  It won't happen overnight. 
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  26

  Jesus died for US...technically

  by enigma1863 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  for god so loved the world he gave his only begotten son and then took him back.

  that's not love, its a big legal loophole.

  people have technically died in the past, and by the standards of diagnosing death in bible times you could definitely beat 48 hrs and return.

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  undercover

  It's a fairy tale.  Fairy tales usually have plot holes.

  You didn't really think Neo was resurrected just because Trinity told him to get back up, now did you?
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  54

  Mom says, "CO says there's only 15 years left!"

  by Separation of Powers in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i don't typically hear from my mom often, but i tell you, over the past couple of weeks, i have heard from her several times.

  you heard the comment about "our way of worship will be altered" and thank you for your posts by the way....but yesterday, she calls and is asking about the kids and then, in typical jw fashion mind you, says:.

  "you know, you should really get back to meetings.

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  undercover

  I remember a brother at my old hall saying 'the end is so close we can smell it'

  My F-I-L, same guy who can entertain the two concepts of 'the end' any time, and planning retirement, once said, quoting their CO, 'we're no longer in the last days... we're in the last hours'.  Oh yeah, that was several years ago.  Hours just drag on and on, when you're in expectation of something...
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  54

  Mom says, "CO says there's only 15 years left!"

  by Separation of Powers in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i don't typically hear from my mom often, but i tell you, over the past couple of weeks, i have heard from her several times.

  you heard the comment about "our way of worship will be altered" and thank you for your posts by the way....but yesterday, she calls and is asking about the kids and then, in typical jw fashion mind you, says:.

  "you know, you should really get back to meetings.

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  undercover

  When I was young, an embarrassing number of decades ago, the standard line was that "this system of things can't go on another 5 years!"

  I remember my father-in-law saying almost word for word the same thing.  Two sentences later he was talking about his retirement plans...10 years in the future.  For JWs, that is typical cognitive dissonance.  Repeating the mantra as heard from the WTS over and over and over, yet managing to overcome that notion when dealing with personal plans.

  I remember being 10 years old KNOWING that I would never graduate high school being told that the end was SO CLOSE! 

  I remember that as well...and I've got a decade plus on you. I remember as an early teen, worrying about the system lasting longing enough to get my driver's license and a car, graduating high school, getting laid ... the list goes on. Here I am staring retirement in the face with no real retirement plan. Never went to college, never planned a career, never worried about pensions or 401Ks until I finally woke up to the lie I was in.
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  143

  Prank call to Governing Body member Anthony Morris III gets through

  by Watchtower-Free in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  alert..............alert.....breaking news .......... john cedars of jwsurvey has pranked called governing body member anthony morris iii at bethel .

  over 2 minutes of pranking .

  as i type he is editing the recording into a video .

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  undercover

  Not that my opinion really matters in the wide scheme of things, but I was disappointed that Cedars pulled this prank. I like his website, but pulling a stunt like this can hurt credibility, especially to a doubting JW who reads his site, but then stumbles on the childish prank.  

  And don't forget, when you make a frontal attack on cult members, or their leaders, it only causes them to scurry for cover.  

  As  much as I hate the WTS, and religion in general actually, I know that at least in the USA, people have freedom of religion. If someone chooses to be JW, Mormon, Catholic, Westboro Baptist even, that's their choice. I don't agree with them, and I'll fight em if they try to force their beliefs or doctrines on me, whether thru personal/family situations, or thru political means even. But they have as much right to their religions as I have to not be in their religion. And attacking them on their turf is bad form, in my opinion. Defending is one thing. Attacking is another.

  No one person is going to bring the WTS down. No one website will bring it down. Stooping to childish antics only serves to bolster their persecution complex.

  Oh well... another day in the life of a self important apostate, I guess...
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  12

  The last refuge of a cult

  by undercover in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the wts struggles to survive in the 21st century, what with the internet, social media, instant communication, instant video, instant music, instant porn, er, not that i'd know anything about that last one... but anyhoo.... as they struggle to keep the young ones indoctrinated, they've finally realized that sitting in wt meetings four days a week, and knocking on doors at least once a week is not appealing to millennials, and with all the new technology at their fingertips, it doesn't take but a couple of clicks of a mouse to find enough disturbing info on the wts to encourage them to fade away.. so what to do?

  well, if you can't beat em, join em.

  after years of demonizing the internet, televangelists, showboating religious leaders, and discouraging anything that could lead a person to question their authority, they finally figured out they can't beat em.

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  undercover

  The WTS struggles to survive in the 21st century, what with the Internet, social media, instant communication, instant video, instant music, instant porn, er, not that I'd know anything about that last one... but anyhoo...

  As they struggle to keep the young ones indoctrinated, they've finally realized that sitting in WT meetings four days a week, and knocking  on doors at least once a week is not appealing to millennials, and with all the new technology at their fingertips, it doesn't take but a couple of clicks of a mouse to find enough disturbing info on the WTS to encourage them to fade away.

  So what to do?  Well, if you can't beat em, join em.  After years of demonizing the Internet, televangelists, showboating religious leaders, and discouraging anything that could lead a person to question their authority, they finally figured out they can't beat em.  So, they joined em.  JW TV on the Interwebs, featuring GB members giving talks...ala televangelist style.  A new JW logo designed to make people proud to wear the logo.  CGI videos of children obeying Jehovah the GB, and now YouTube style videos of singing carts.  

  They've lost the 30somethings and 20somethings.  They have to reinvent themselves in order to keep little kids indoctrinated, without thinking or doubting.  So they have started these new trends that us oldsters have trouble believing, because in our day, just watching TV or listening to music was frowned on.  When kids are playing games on smartphones and tablets before they can walk, you damn well better change your position on technology if you want even a gnat's chance in hell at retaining the youth when they hit their teens.

  On one hand, it's an admittance of defeat...that the old ways don't work and are dead, but on the other, it's a diabolical plot to reinvent, and keep running, a dangerous mind control cult.
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  7

  Curious how today's JWs view the anti-vaxxer movement

  by undercover in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i wonder how the average jw in our modern world views the new anti-vaxxer movement.

  do they sympathize, agree - or - see them as kooky, out of touch, nutso - or - somewhere in between.. remember, back in the olden, golden days...or should i say, the golden age, the wts took a hard line stance against vaccinations.

  see jwfacts info regarding the the anti-vaccination stand taken by the wts:.

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  undercover

  I wonder how the average JW in our modern world views the new anti-vaxxer movement. Do they sympathize, agree - or - see them as kooky, out of touch, nutso - or - somewhere in between.

  Remember, back in the olden, golden days...or should I say, The Golden Age, the WTS took a hard line stance against vaccinations. See JWFacts info regarding the the anti-vaccination stand taken by the WTS:

  http://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/medical.php#vaccinations

  Of course, by the 50s the WTS had started back pedaling from that hard line stand, but as a child in the 60s, I remember that some JWs were still against vaccinations. When we were vaccinated in school for something or other, I vaguely remember there being some disagreement in our household over whether I should be vaccinated.  It's all very murky now, but I think my father vetoed my mother's position of denying us the vaccinations.

  I'm sure that most JWs today have no clue about that tidbit of WT history. I'd be curious as to how they would react, if presented such information. Would they see a correlation between nut jobs like Pat Robertson, and ignorant Tea Party Republicans? Probably not for most of them, but it might be that gentle nudge for some of them that might have some doubts...
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  19

  Negative forum behavior

  by Simon in

  1. forum
  2. suggestions

  another good codinghorror blog entry perfectly describes some people's online behaviour and an approach to handling it.

  i'll post part of it below but to summarize, these tend to be behaviours that don't violate any specific rules as such as the people doing it try to carefully skate just up to the line but they are nevertheless disruptive and we're not going to tolerate them on this site.

  if you are here to do these things then this isn't the site for you - move along, find someplace else on the internet to inhabit.. hate is easy to recognize.

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  undercover

  ...some exJW's seem to bring a unique level of dysfunction to things especially if it involves any whiff of "authority" which of course is inevitable.

  
  

  I think I've been guilty of that one myself.  Being raised as a JW, but escaping, doesn't automatically make you a well adjusted new person.  You still have to come to terms with your past, your present, and how you face the future.  

  After 10 years of either lurking, being active, going away, lurking again, I think I've finally grown some, and stuff that bothered me once isn't worth the trouble anymore, including board politics, feuds, popularity contests, and disagreements on how best to 'fight' the WTS.

  I'm grateful the forum exists so we can keep up with the shenanigans of the WTS, and to vent when it affects us personally.  If friends are made, that's even better.
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  28

  WTF... what happened? or - I'm old and hate change

  by undercover in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i leave you people alone for one holiday, and you go and change the whole dern place around.

  i can't find anything, don't recognize anything, i'm lost... wait, i sound like my grandfather... .

  why, would you look what you've done to the place.

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  undercover

  I leave you people alone for one holiday, and you go and change the whole dern place around.  I can't find anything, don't recognize anything, I'm lost...   wait, I sound like my grandfather...  

  Let's try this again...  

  Why, would you look what you've done to the place.  I hardly recognize it.  It's amazing what a makeover can do to a place.  It'll take some getting used to, but I hope to feel right at home again soon.

  
  

  (Actually this was just to test to see how to post, and how it shows up)