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  50

  Watchtower Legal's letter to Dirtclod.com (faxed image)

  by Jourles in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i am starting a new thread so folks do not have to search through several pages of posts to find this image.

  the original thread was here.

  i received the following fax this morning from my old isp(dirtclod.com was coincidentally moved the same day i received notice regarding this copyright infringement for bandwidth purposes) and was seven pages in length.

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  waiting

  wow........waddago Jourles.

  I've got to return to work - so don't have much time, but am duly impressed.

  waiting
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  68

  Who's To Blame For The Child Abuse Problem?

  by Englishman in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  just trying to get my head around this one.

  with the jailing last week of a london dub paedophile, i was wondering: .

  is it the religion itself that gives these perverts the feeling that they are invincible and immune from punishment when they commit these acts?

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  waiting

  Hello Amac,

  Just a side thought here........if we take the society of local jw's - their mentality, social structure within jw's and with worldly people ..........and compare them with a Baptist/Methodist/whatever......what's just ONE fundamental difference would we find pertaining to the care of children?

  1. Other churches usually have day cares, etc., so children can be among their peers. Mothers get a break from their darlings. Additionally, mothers aren't automatically lower class, with a disproportionately high percentage of single mothers/grandmothers bringing up kids alone.

  Jehovah's Witnesses have church meetings and field service. They can be with their peers - but aren't suppose to play during this time. Restless children, little interaction with other kids, mothers who are left to teach/entertain/control/support entire groups of kids.

  Why's this important? Because there's so many single women in the org.....with many children. Children they can't leave....but must be with them, every meeting, every time in field service, every assembly. The women are to provide mother & father image for the kids. However, women are second class - they want (particularily sons) to have a good father image to mold that child. It's a stronger urge than worldly women, imo, because we know our children's "lives depend upon they staying in The Truth."

  Then steps in the brother (and he may not be in all that good standing....just a man) who takes an interest in your child. Will go to the door with him, help him with scriptures, help him to read. In most cases........the mother will be delighted for the help. Btw, scenario works just as well if it's a young woman, particularily with your daughter or younger kids. In fact, he offers to take your son out in field service with a group of other brothers....and he'll help out by coming to your house & picking up your son - and bringing him home...."oh, btw, ok if we stop off for a burger?" It could be totally innocent...or not. Who would know?

  JW's are taught that particularily if a man is a pioneer, ms, elder.......he is a spiritural person. The WTBTS has gone back to the teaching that elders do, indeed, have Jehovah's spirit....as opposed to ordinary brothers and sisters. We've been counseled for decades to take every problem to the elders.....they will help us.

  Well, our children are our problem.....we want the best for them - but we don't have the ability, being single jw women (or married to non-believers). We're just "a large army" of women.

  This is just a sideline situation. Now add in the Two Witness Bible Law. Now add in that Jehovah's Witnesses MUST protect God's reputation....and God's religion is a clean, upright, religion. Now add in that we've always preached that Jehovah's Witnesses are a cleaner, better, religion that any in the world. Of course, now jw's say they're no worse than any other religion. Mere technicality.

  Now add in that even if a man is found guilty of child abuse by elders.......the parent & child must NEVER speak about it to anyone.....less they be brought up on charges of slander...which is a disfellowshipping sin, as we all very well know.

  And now add in the WTBTS has a file of what, 23,000 child molesters located in NY?

  And there's more reasons, some even more important than the ones I've given. I don't think Bill Bowen is off the mark. The social structure & teachings of Jehovah's Witnesses makes them more vulnerable to child molestation than some other organizations - but they're definitely not alone.

  I would think that a child molester would find the jw's attractive....just like the Boy Scouts, Catholic Church, etc. Real attractive if one thinks about the advantages.

  waiting
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  43

  Why Are So Many JWs Ex-Catholic?

  by SpannerintheWorks in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  is it just my imagination, or are a disproportionate of jws ex-catholic?.

  were you a catholic before a jw?.

  why did you feel that the jw religion was "better" than the "catholic" one?.

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  waiting

  To all who read this:

  And believe me, I tried when I started with the JWs, I met with the priest on Wednesdays and the JWs on Saturdays. And I asked more than one priest. And I looked stuff up in Catholic literature in the library. Bible education for RCs was non-existent then. - patio

  "And believe me" - patio.

  Please believe her. I was the unlucky new jw who studied with her.....her younger sister to boot. Damn, that was One Tough Catholic. lol - she was One Tough JW too.

  Now? Damned woman is still tough.

  Hiya Patio!

  waiting
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  22

  Do you consider fellow posters as strangers?

  by JH in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  do you consider other posters here that you know since months to be strangers?

  some people will say, "i don't really know you, i never saw you in person, so you're a stranger".

  do you have to meet someone in person so that he or she isn't any more considered to be a stranger?.

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  waiting

  I started hundreds of threads and responded in thousands of posts gave my opinion on many topics and posted my picture. - jh

  We've noticed that too.

  waiting
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  22

  Do you consider fellow posters as strangers?

  by JH in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  do you consider other posters here that you know since months to be strangers?

  some people will say, "i don't really know you, i never saw you in person, so you're a stranger".

  do you have to meet someone in person so that he or she isn't any more considered to be a stranger?.

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  waiting

  OMG! When I saw the thread subject,

  I thought the same as Tammy...............but she'd already posted it. Thanks a lot, Tammy.

  waiting - as strange as the rest of us. Some days stranger.
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  68

  Who's To Blame For The Child Abuse Problem?

  by Englishman in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  just trying to get my head around this one.

  with the jailing last week of a london dub paedophile, i was wondering: .

  is it the religion itself that gives these perverts the feeling that they are invincible and immune from punishment when they commit these acts?

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  waiting

  Dear Amazing,

  When I agree with you - I tend to fully agree. Thank you.

  There are also different types of pedophiles. Most are preferrential, and are of the type that Core and Odrade speak of. Some are violent predators. My own father was a mean, untrustworthy son-of-a-bitch. Some pedophiles are the more rare type - situaltional, and may only molest one child, usually an older child. - amazing

  This is what got me going yesterday.......the seeming lack of qualifying statements. I understand Core & Odrade's type of molester -preferrential - they're as common as flys, sad to say.

  Violent predators, thankfully, are rare. Seems your father and my father had similarities. My father was also violent with beatings & knives, particularily with animals.

  Situational molesters - well, they're common too, and I still would think that's the type that social workers tend to try and work with to keep the family united if possible.

  Thanks again, Amazing.

  waiting
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  68

  Who's To Blame For The Child Abuse Problem?

  by Englishman in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  just trying to get my head around this one.

  with the jailing last week of a london dub paedophile, i was wondering: .

  is it the religion itself that gives these perverts the feeling that they are invincible and immune from punishment when they commit these acts?

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  waiting

  And remember this, friends, virtually EVERY ABUSER WAS ABUSED AS A CHILD THEMSELVES. It's where they learned it was normal behavior. They're just passing it on. -francois

  Please note, Francois stated that "EVERY abuser was abused...." - and I asked him for proof.

  Francois never stated that "All abused children became abusers."

  Big difference.

  waiting
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  68

  Who's To Blame For The Child Abuse Problem?

  by Englishman in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  just trying to get my head around this one.

  with the jailing last week of a london dub paedophile, i was wondering: .

  is it the religion itself that gives these perverts the feeling that they are invincible and immune from punishment when they commit these acts?

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  2. 
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• 

  waiting

  And remember this, friends, virtually EVERY ABUSER WAS ABUSED AS A CHILD THEMSELVES. It's where they learned it was normal behavior. They're just passing it on. - francois

  Definitive statements would do well with proof to back them up. May I have recently published proof that "virtually EVERY ABUSER WAS ABUSED AS A CHILD THEMSELVES"?

  There was a study done on approx. 18 death row inmates. Not all of them had been sexually abused (as was thought) - but all of them came from family backgrounds of massive violence. More than anything else - violence begets violence. But I don't think it's been proven that sex abuse automatically begets sex abuse.

  waiting
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  58

  Reminders of an abuser

  by Lady Lee in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  reminders of an abuser

  forty years later.

  you reach out from the grave.

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  waiting

  Yo Lee,

  I knew you would. It's in your spirit.

  Take care.
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  68

  Who's To Blame For The Child Abuse Problem?

  by Englishman in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  just trying to get my head around this one.

  with the jailing last week of a london dub paedophile, i was wondering: .

  is it the religion itself that gives these perverts the feeling that they are invincible and immune from punishment when they commit these acts?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  waiting

  Hello core,

  What about the pedophiles who DO finally accept what they've done? Whether they're sorry or not is a different matter.....but on a level.....they know. Some men actually do admit they abused a child/children. Where do they fit in your equation?

  There was a program on H20 (last year?) about a father molester who raped all his children - 4 or 5 - their whole childhood, the mother knew, she just had a hard time accepting it. All his children confronted him, one had written a book, and they had gotten H20 to do the show. The children were all damaged. He refused to acknowledge his actions. He was not deluding himself - all his children were convinced he absolutely knew & remembered. He came near to spitting on them like dogs....lol - from his wheelchair, and he was NOT senile, just ill health. He just refused. He was just an evil man.

  Some sociopaths aren't delusional, they know what they're doing......they just think they have the right to do it. They know there's laws against some of their actions...they just feel they're above that law. ie - Ted Bundy.

  I believe what we have is talking over different types of pedophiles. Pork Chop wrote of one kind - situational molesters. You write of men who either delude themselves or are true sociopaths who are out of the realm of seeing themselves within social laws. I write of men who damned well know what they're doing.....and they don't care.

  From all that I've read, Pork Chop's and your definitions fit the vast majority of molesters. As long as the statements are qualified, no problem with me.

  Thank you - and thank you for your kind private message.

  waiting