Oubliette

Joined

• started 96 topics
• posted 7,450 times   see topics posted on
• send a message

Posts by Oubliette

• 
  80

  Ayn Rand - Opinions?

  by cappytan in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  for those of you familiar with ayn rand and her ideas on morality, rationality and reason, what is your opinion of those ideas?.

  i'm talking about her actual ideas, not the ideals that libertarianism has adopted and, in some cases, perverted.

  do you think she's a charlatan?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Oubliette

  Viviane: the other three in the list are the same only in that there is a dystopian world.

  Thank you for understanding what I said.

  For what it's worth, I have not missed your argumentativeness.
  
• 
  80

  Ayn Rand - Opinions?

  by cappytan in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  for those of you familiar with ayn rand and her ideas on morality, rationality and reason, what is your opinion of those ideas?.

  i'm talking about her actual ideas, not the ideals that libertarianism has adopted and, in some cases, perverted.

  do you think she's a charlatan?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Oubliette

  Viviane: It's quite interesting how many "fans" of Atlas Shrugged, Anthem, the Fountainhead and objectivism don't actually understand what it means in practice and taken to it's logical conclusion.

  It's not a requirement to agree with everything an author writes to nonetheless find some value or merit in their work.

  It's been so long since I read either Atlas Shrugged or The Fountainhead that I don't remember much about them other than they were long and tedious.

  However, I currently use Anthem as part of my curriculum with my high school students. I find it helpful for them to understand the central issue of collectivism vs. individualism. There are certainly many other books that describe dystopian societies and many do so more artfully. In some ways the stark style of Rand's writing makes it easier to see the central issues.

  Many young people are familiar with The Hunger Games series and have seen recent movies such as Divergent and The Maze Runner. In many ways these stories are much more interesting, more engaging and the art of story-telling is far superior.

  It is because of this, many students often miss the central issues. Also, Anthem is a fairly short work. For all of these reasons, I find it a good entrée to the genre for high school students. After we've read that and done a critical analysis it is easier to tackle more challenging pieces.

  Other books in this vein I would recommend are:

  • Nineteen Eighty-Four
  • Animal Farm
  • Fahrenheit 451
  • The Giver
• 
  80

  Ayn Rand - Opinions?

  by cappytan in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  for those of you familiar with ayn rand and her ideas on morality, rationality and reason, what is your opinion of those ideas?.

  i'm talking about her actual ideas, not the ideals that libertarianism has adopted and, in some cases, perverted.

  do you think she's a charlatan?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Oubliette

  Viviane, I would agree that Rand was not the most polished or eloquent writer.

  Are you familiar with Lois Lowry's book, The Giver? Although it's written at a lower level and with better story structure and style, It's clearly derivative.
• 
  19

  What if JWs Viewed Disfellowshipping and Excommunication as Radical Islamists Do?

  by Oubliette in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i found this statement from a recent article about isis to be quite interesting in view of the way that any jw can be accused of apostasy with little or no possible repercussions or consequences for the accuser: .

  in islam, the practice of takfir, or excommunication, is theologically perilous.

  if a man says to his brother, you are an infidel, the prophet said, then one of them is right.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Oubliette

  Perhaps I didn't set up the OP correctly. I was trying to focus on the fact per this Islamic principal there are consequences for false and even baseless accusations of apostasy.
• 
  19

  What if JWs Viewed Disfellowshipping and Excommunication as Radical Islamists Do?

  by Oubliette in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i found this statement from a recent article about isis to be quite interesting in view of the way that any jw can be accused of apostasy with little or no possible repercussions or consequences for the accuser: .

  in islam, the practice of takfir, or excommunication, is theologically perilous.

  if a man says to his brother, you are an infidel, the prophet said, then one of them is right.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Oubliette

  VI: I was told that in my judicial committee. Specifically, "If you were in Israel you would be stoned."

  Me too.

  I told the elder in response, "Well then, I guess it's a good thing for me that we're Christians!"
• 
  80

  Ayn Rand - Opinions?

  by cappytan in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  for those of you familiar with ayn rand and her ideas on morality, rationality and reason, what is your opinion of those ideas?.

  i'm talking about her actual ideas, not the ideals that libertarianism has adopted and, in some cases, perverted.

  do you think she's a charlatan?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Oubliette

  Faye: One can enjoy reading an author without agreeing with all of their ideologies.

  Amen to that!
• 
  5

  Psychology Today - interesting articles about Cult Leaders and Predators in clergy or organization positions

  by wannabefree in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  i stumbled upon some articles in psychology today written by joe navarro, an ex-fbi counterintelligence agent.. this one talks about predators as priests or clergy as well as in other organizations and why they are attracted to it .... https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/spycatcher/201404/why-predators-are-attracted-careers-in-the-clergy.

  this article talks about identifying dangerous cult leaders ... how many characteristics do you see in some of the gb leaders past and present?.

  https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/spycatcher/201208/dangerous-cult-leaders.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Oubliette

  WBF, I read with great interest the second article, Dangerous Traits of Cult Leaders, by Joe Navarro M.A.
  

  Navarro's concluding comment is very telling:
  

  When a cult or organizational leader has a preponderance of these traits then we can anticipate that at some point those who associate with him will likely suffer physically, emotionally, psychologically, or financially. If these traits sound familiar to leaders, groups, sects, or organizations known to you then expect those who associate with them to live in despair and to suffer even if they don’t know it, yet.

  I would say that at least 48 of his list of 50 apply to the GB members individually and collectively. (It might be 50 for 50, but I have no knowledge concerning items #9 or 10).

  Let's review: It's a cult!

  
  
  
• 
  19

  What if JWs Viewed Disfellowshipping and Excommunication as Radical Islamists Do?

  by Oubliette in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i found this statement from a recent article about isis to be quite interesting in view of the way that any jw can be accused of apostasy with little or no possible repercussions or consequences for the accuser: .

  in islam, the practice of takfir, or excommunication, is theologically perilous.

  if a man says to his brother, you are an infidel, the prophet said, then one of them is right.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Oubliette

  I found this statement from a recent article about ISIS to be quite interesting in view of the way that any JW can be accused of apostasy with little or no possible repercussions or consequences for the accuser:

  In Islam, the practice of takfir, or excommunication, is theologically perilous. “If a man says to his brother, ‘You are an infidel,’ ” the Prophet said, “then one of them is right.” If the accuser is wrong, he himself has committed apostasy by making a false accusation. The punishment for apostasy is death.

  Imagine if JWs had THIS policy in place? It would make a lot of elders think twice before accusing or even insinuating that a person was guilty of apostasy.
• 
  55

  Are we pro-shunning or against it?

  by Simon in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  just to continue my theme about religious freedom and how we approach criticizing the wts, i've also been thinking about 'shunning'.. i think shunning is the most unifying complaint that most ex-members of religious groups that practice it have in common.

  it is the layer that runs under every other complaint - whatever the reason for leaving it seems "... and i was shunned" can be added to it as the final rap on the charge sheet.. of course it seems like a no-brainer to many of us and we hardly ever stop to really think about it - shunning is bad, the watchtower believes in shunning therefore the watchtower is bad.

  they need to stop it.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Oubliette

  BTW, who are the "we" in the thread title?
• 
  55

  Are we pro-shunning or against it?

  by Simon in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  just to continue my theme about religious freedom and how we approach criticizing the wts, i've also been thinking about 'shunning'.. i think shunning is the most unifying complaint that most ex-members of religious groups that practice it have in common.

  it is the layer that runs under every other complaint - whatever the reason for leaving it seems "... and i was shunned" can be added to it as the final rap on the charge sheet.. of course it seems like a no-brainer to many of us and we hardly ever stop to really think about it - shunning is bad, the watchtower believes in shunning therefore the watchtower is bad.

  they need to stop it.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Oubliette

  R&R: I believe any religion has a right to throw you out of church for bad conduct. They own the building and have the right to not allow any member who's conduct is unbecoming of the congregation.

  Agreed!
  

  R&R: They don't have any rights out in the streets, funeral homes,hospitals,wedding banquet halls and any other meeting place. The only reason they shun members is to scare the rest of the members (that you will be in the same predicament if you do the same).

  Exactly!

  Ultimately, with cults such as JWs, the practice of institutionalized shunning is really about control, not morals.