Well Bangalore it was just an instinct to me I have to say. I felt that Watchman didn’t always tell the truth either as with 3W so I am a bit suspect of his inside knowledge. However he might be right. I certainly thought 3W was from the US.
Seraphim23
JoinedPosts by Seraphim23
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Totally corrupt website?
by Terry ina website defending two major stories connected with watchtower corruption is found here:.
http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/.
there is no way to identify, rebut or reach the creator of this website to offer counter-argument.. it exist solely as propaganda as far as i can determine.
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Totally corrupt website?
by Terry ina website defending two major stories connected with watchtower corruption is found here:.
http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/.
there is no way to identify, rebut or reach the creator of this website to offer counter-argument.. it exist solely as propaganda as far as i can determine.
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Seraphim23
When I had my dealings with third witness I always got the impression he worked for Bethel in an office or something like that. Call it an instinct but I think what he did was sanctioned from above unofficially.
That was it Bangalore, good memory you have. (o:
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Totally corrupt website?
by Terry ina website defending two major stories connected with watchtower corruption is found here:.
http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/.
there is no way to identify, rebut or reach the creator of this website to offer counter-argument.. it exist solely as propaganda as far as i can determine.
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Seraphim23
I may be wrong but I think this web site was set up in part by someone called third witness and a JW from the UK. Years ago when I was part of the Robert king / e-watchman board someone called Third witness came on the board and took on Robert king in order to defend the WTs classic view against what Robert king said. However a big subject on RKs board at the time was the UN incident and the child abuse claims with silent lambs ect. An English brother whose name escapes me also decided his real loyalites were to the WTs classic view. I say classic view because Robert King also thought that JWs were Gods chosen people but that he himself had a better interpretation of the bible. This is why Robert king was useful as a gateway out of the WT because some of his theological reasoning was very WT sounding. Of course Robert king is nuts also but that is beside the point. So on his board there were many on the way out and a few on the way back in again. This mysterious website I think was set up by the English (brother) who went back to the WT and some of the writings on it are by third Witness. Unfortunately both the original E Watchman board and the board set up by the UK bother to counter Robert King are gone now, so I cannot link back to relevant pages but I am sure this website is one of the results of countering Robert King and running back to the WT by the English brother.
This was all a long time ago and both groups were convinced that the WT is special and there are many from back then who still think it is with their own boards as well. I was kicked out of all these boards and I am quite happy about it.
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I really need some help to get out of this religion
by doughnutkitty inhi, i've been lurking on this site for quite a while after recently having doubts about the "truth".
i've read a lot of posts about problems with the doctrines, mind control, the beliefs, brainwashing that jehovah's witnesses and their literature, as well as their history.
now only being a sixteen year old born in who isn't baptized or unbaptized, i've come to find all this information incredibly overwhelming.
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Seraphim23
Hello doughnutkitty, your very wise to see the difference between the emotional world and the intellectual world. You can obviously see that your mind is telling you one thing but the feelings are doing what they do in a different direction. To be raised in a world view means that it is your first perspective on the world and to see that it has problems and contradictions that don’t stack up with the claims of truth properly means fear. That is natural because it is unfamiliar from where and what you are a product of, and you don’t yet have other world views to measure it against. That is because you’re just starting out. You will get more knowledge as you go on and more world views to add to the single one you currently have and when that happens you won’t have fear and the emotional inertia you might be feeling now. University sounds like a good plan to me and a way to increase knowledge.
The more knowledge you get as you learn and get more life experience, the more your emotional side will start harmonising with your intellectual side. To put it bluntly, where you invest yourself, you heart will follow to that place in time. It is good you’re not baptised into the JWs because that will allow for a better relationship with your parents even though you chose a different path, at least it increases that possibility. You seem like a remarkable young person who values truth over the label truth.
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The UNFORGIVABLE Sin: What Is It?
by Cold Steel injesus said: .
verily i say unto you, all sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme: but he that shall blaspheme against the holy ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation.
(mark 3:28-29).
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Seraphim23
Seems to me that what is being spoken about by Jesus with this unforgivable sin is the offence against personality. It would be like lying about a person’s intent that is doing charity work and accusing them of evil intent by listing all the charity work they have done as proof of their bad intent. It is not only nonsensical but harms people all round not least themselves.
It harms the ideal of doing good in the public mind in case they are accused of something bad other than wanting to do good, and it harms the idea of judging people by their actions. It also harms those who would need to be the recipients of kindness and charity by drawing a veil of fear over doing charity, leading to more deaths of the neediest, and for what reason? So that those in power can maintain their monopoly of public respect in order to keep their power and use that power to keep all the good apples for themselves even though they don’t even need every apple in the cart, so to speak. Even though those with the monopoly of power are starving and robing the thing that gives themselves power, the people as it were, to the degree that they start to die, even though it will diminish their own power, it is too late to change because they are so corrupt.
Given that people judge themselves ultimately without the ability to self-deceive, I would imagine that judging oneself as self-deceptive because that is what they were when calling the good of others bad, would set up an impossible internal cycle one cannot escape from.
Just a few thoughts.
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Bloody livid with school teacher teaching soul leaving body to 6 yr olds
by not bitter injust put my 6 yr old to bed and we always have a chat about the day.
she tells me that she knows about another thing that happens to our bodies when we die in addition to buriel and cremation.. .
she tells me that they can do something really nasty to the body but its ok because they're dead so don't know about it.
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Seraphim23
The teacher may have been trying to be kind to a six year old. I remember being afraid about the concept of death at about that age.
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Food For Logical Thought...
by braincleaned insometimes we waste hours and hours debating a subject like the flood, and the impossible scientific and evolutionary consequences that it entails.
we go into great debates about how all of is is possible, what a "kind" means (species, obviously not)... etc.... but believers will not stop believing... so here is something even a child would think of more logically:if god is all powerful and love why would he have not just made the wicked drop dead, painlessly?
simply, humanly.
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Seraphim23
Braincleaned I stopped believing in creationism and accepted evolution, as well as rejecting the literal flood idea and seeing the account as more of a parable, yet the idea of God still makes sense to me. What made me change was my desire for truth and that any truth I may have be based on evidence as far as this is possible. So that said, being in a cult is one thing, and believing things that evidence consistently contradicts is another thing, but a belief in a God is possible while not rejecting good scientific evidence.
Pain and suffering and a God are not inconsistent with each other although I agree with you that many Christians view of how to explain it are terrible and logically floored.
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Can this logic be refuted?
by notsurewheretogo ini was an elder until march 2012 until i resigned.
i then stopped going to meetings in october 2012 and have enjoyed 9 months of freedom that i have found to be jouful!
i loved learning ttatt and sites like this and jwfacts.com have been excellent.. i told the elders that i needed a break and that they should not contact me unless it was a social visit and true to their word they have done that.
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Seraphim23
Notsure, the JWs truth as it gets called is a way of sidestepping truth which is why they call it the truth. Logic and reason will not work because finding truth is anything but the aim and goal, and why should it be they think they have it signed and sealed. If you present your case to the elders you will be got rid of. When they move issues to the domain of conscience, it is simply a way to say it is still wrong while maintaining plausible deniability.
That said even a broken clock is right twice a day. As regards personality being transplanted with heart transplants it has to be said, that the heart contains neurons, in fact quite a lot of them. This is not a JW question as such, even though they have raised this issue for their own reasons. If I needed a transplant and knew I would have a change of personality as a result, I would prefer that than death. Scientists tend to dismiss this idea but there are some anecdotal reports of something interesting possibly going on. I’ll leave that subject here. I hope whatever you decide to do works out for good for you and your family.
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What evidence is there for the miracles of the Bible OUTSIDE of the Bible?
by punkofnice inok. this is something i've wondered about.. people of certain religions tend to use their own holy book as evidence for things in itself.
this seems very circular to me.
using the book to prove the book in my view is pointless.. i am not aware of any of the 'miracles' of the bible or the quran as having any substantial evidence outside of themselves to give credibility to the books themselves.. has anyone come across such evidence?.
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Seraphim23
Well why don’t you look more closely at the twin phenomena and the strange but interesting links they often have? Some of those cannot be explained by science or because of genetic similarity.
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What evidence is there for the miracles of the Bible OUTSIDE of the Bible?
by punkofnice inok. this is something i've wondered about.. people of certain religions tend to use their own holy book as evidence for things in itself.
this seems very circular to me.
using the book to prove the book in my view is pointless.. i am not aware of any of the 'miracles' of the bible or the quran as having any substantial evidence outside of themselves to give credibility to the books themselves.. has anyone come across such evidence?.
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Seraphim23
Yet again a thread that seems to become a war of words between atheist and theists. The distinguishing views being that science is the only acceptable form of evidence as opposed to other forms of evidence being deemed as having value! As a theist I wonder if there is any point to continuing such a merry go round. There is no common ground with believers due to personal experience and those that reject such personal experience of others. A more objective piece of evidence such a Turin shroud is also dismissed out of hand by those who cannot make the mental leap that science only deals with a part of reality and not all of it.
I must point out that some atheists are not out for trap laying believers but many are despite our apparent common goal of helping people in the cult of JWs to get out of it, this being what we have in common weather atheist or theist. A sad state of affairs to me when one considers that more JWs could and would be helped if were not for all the fighting but then again people love a good scrap unfortunately.