Posts by no-zombie

If the GB want to end door to door witnessing done by the Brotherhood, then just bring in the 'Hailstone' message. Because no-one will be going out witnessing when that's announced, that's for sure.

26

Can Elders Voluntarily Resign?

by NotFormer in

an elder with half a brain (and they must exist 🧐) is going to see the writing on the wall with the way the wt is manoeuvring them into taking the fall over csa cases.

can an elder in good standing step down with no consequences, official or social?.

I resigned similar to BluesBrother's comment, which I truly was ... but the exElders club, is a real funny one. You end up sort of a nobody. This is because for years the only people that were really your friends in the congregation, were the other Elders. And when you step down, they move on (to busy really to give you much attention) while the general publishers that you know, are quite distant socially.

Yeh ... being a exElder is a bit strange, but our numbers are growing.

58

Cult or High Control Group?

by MillennialDawn in

jw
friends

i see this phrase a lot: "the indication of a cult is what happens when you leave.

" i'm not sure where that originated, but it is a faulty categorization.

"cult" is almost always used in a derogatory way.

no-zombie

The more that I see these kinds of topics and the posts that follow, the more I'm beginning to wonder how many people really research things for themselves or is everyone now just content to echo the comments of others.

I seriously don't know.

I'm saying this because when anyone even superficially compares Jehovahs Witnesses to other mainstream religions of the world today, you must come to the conclusion that the Society is definitely not a cult and on its ranking against other high control groups in the world, it would be to be only half way up the ladder (at best), on the global scale.

I'll explain why.

Firstly, compare being an average Witness to a Muslim in Afghanistan under Taliban control. Are you more or less free? Compare being a average Witness to a Muslim in Iran under Khamenei. Are you more or less free? What about the worshipers of the Kim dynasty of North Korea .... better or worse. Yet, those three countries alone (and the Faiths that steer them) dominate every aspect of the lives of over 155 million people. And millions of those people over the years have literally been lost at the whims of their religious leaders, through needless wars of ideology, purges and direct assassinations ... all in the desire for the control of how their people think. Why in the past 10 months of this year alone ... 70,000 Muslim civilians have been killed by Muslim Taliban fighters because the latter believe those in Karbul have fallen away from the true faith.

And people say the we are in some kind of dangerous high control group? I'd say to these ones, go and take your family to live for a while in any Arabic country ruled by a theocratic government (which is most of them) and see how free and safe you really are. Yeh ... let your wife and daughter take their bikinis down to the beach, and see what kind of sh*t storm you'll create. Or go and talk to the family of Ms Amini who was beaten to death in a Tehtanian detention center by the moral police because some of her hair was visible under her headscarf. And then you might begin to understand the concept of living in a high control religion.

Secondly, as a older person who has spent his whole life in 'The Truth' and seen a lot, I can tell you, that no more than 20% of the brotherhood are hard-core Witnesses. The rest, the 80% of Jehovah's Witnesses, live quite relaxed lives. Many drink more than they should, go to parties when ever they want, travel the world, get involved in a sport and some even dare to go to university. I even known Sisters that have gone topless bathing during the summer holidays. Yes this 80% are just doing the minimum, been doing it all their lives and all still remain in 'good standing' congregationally.

And yet people say that we are in some kind of prison? I'd say to these ones, just open your eyes and take a honest look a the people in your congregation and see that the greatest majority do what they basically like, and don't know or really care about the latest 'new light' that comes down from above.

And finally and most importantly, no person, organization, religion, political party or gang has power over you ... unless you give it to them first. That's the bottom line. Somewhere in your life, YOU made a deal with the Organization. Maybe it didn't work out like you expected, but none the less you did the math and joined up. Yes, we all did that calculation .... and for better or worse, we married our religion and willingly committed ourselves to certain obligations.

It's does no good just continuing to bitch about the bad decisions that WE made. It's just not helpful nor healthful. And quite frankly, if we've had to suffer through a judicial committee, you should thank God that the Elders didn't extract information from you stretched out on the rack, on the wheel or in a iron maiden ... because if you want want to compare our religion to others from the past, you'll quickly understand that we are already living in paradise.

7

Your Opinion of Jehovah's Witnesses and Their Religion?

by Vanderhoven7 in

i thought this fellow, not sure if he is pimo or pomo, who goes by the name anonymous, gives a fair opinion summary.. "i was a jw for many years, but generally not a particularly stellar example of one.

your question has two components, and i will address them separately:.

opinion of jws as a people:.

no-zombie

While I mostly agree with the comments of Anonymous, I don't agree with the idea that the faith is the worst out there.

Yes it true that a lot is asked from the Brotherhood, but if you compare the Organization with the Bahai, Christadelphians and the Amish, all insist in rejecting military service, regardless to the cost. The Amish and its related faiths, have strong disfellowshiping rules and regulations and separateness from the 'English'. And if you want to include non-christian religions, there are still many Islamic sects (I use the work 'sects' because Muslims don't see their own divisions other religions) that encourage honor killing, female genital mutilation, child marriage and the murder of non-believers.

And I'm also sure that JWs don't have the most weirdo beliefs out there either ... as Scientology and the Universe People (with all other UFO religions) would have to be higher up than us.

15

Annual meeting 2023....

by mikeflood in

any news?

it should be pretty soon....

no-zombie

Hi Ron ... basically Russell founded the WBTS originally as a 'for-profit' business. However was Russell was the 'Faithful and Discrete Slave', which made it a religious organization also. It got bigger and bought more and more properties and expanded internationally. In the course of time, various governments (for various reasons) and market fluctuations began to make some in the WBTS to think that the whole Society could be at risk of collapse if there were financial problems (which some eventuated). By now there were many corporate entities globally and in a move to mitigate problems the GB assigned a new president to split the business side of things, while the GB controlled church doctrine. This was done, so in the worse case scenario, the GB could let parts of the WBTS go bankrupt without its contagion cascading completely.

In reality of course the GB still controls both.

15

Annual meeting 2023....

by mikeflood in

any news?

it should be pretty soon....

no-zombie

Big Dog is right but since the GB split the legal entities from the religious organization (done in the 90s I think), being a share holder means very little today. Its now become a kind of royal Gala event, for the connected to feel important. I'd rather just go out and get some pizza.

26

Is the USA gradually moving to a majority of citizens being non-religious

by Reasonfirst in

jw
friends

this is a topic discussed in a current article in the hongkong based asia times*.

find it at: https://asiatimes.com/2023/09/nones-still-no-match-for-us-christian-nationalism/.

the claim is made in the article, that near 30% of americans are non-believers, and that this number is increasing.

no-zombie

However I'd be much happier if those churches were Catholic or Protestant than Korowain.

26

Is the USA gradually moving to a majority of citizens being non-religious

by Reasonfirst in

jw
friends

this is a topic discussed in a current article in the hongkong based asia times*.

find it at: https://asiatimes.com/2023/09/nones-still-no-match-for-us-christian-nationalism/.

the claim is made in the article, that near 30% of americans are non-believers, and that this number is increasing.

no-zombie

I think that traditional religions in a practical way (in compared to having a nameless faith), provide communities of people who basically agree to uphold similar moral values. And I would go as far as to say that they may actually be critical for the long term continuation of human civilization.

While it maybe a controversial thing to say in a growing secular world, for those who might think having churches is not that important, they may be missing two important things.

Firstly, not everyone has the same capacity to live life without the emotional and social support a church can bring. Now I would imagine that while most of us here on this board, have likely been harden by our experiences with the Organization and are now quite resilient and strong independent thinkers, many that we previously called 'worldly' are not, particularly when they have aged or experience personal tragedies, as demonstrated many times over by increased church attendances during wars and other disasters.

And secondly, while it might seem easier being a 'lone wolf' as an individual, no one is going to survive in life without friends of some kind. Which is going to be harder if the people around you, wonder if you are having sexual designs on their mate, plan to forcefully steal from them or commit some other kind of antisocial alpha chimpanzee action. Even packs of dogs have rules, and to live with others (at any level) there needs to some control or moderation over impulsive behavior. YouTube is full the results when 'Karens' and 'Kens' reject community norms, even now ... and we all know how it works out for them.

Thus I believe that without a sustained standard of community morals (which religions are very good at providing), global society will eventually de-evolve into a Mad Max world were everyone is his own god ... which would be far worse than having a few gothic buildings in our suburbs.

26

Is the USA gradually moving to a majority of citizens being non-religious

by Reasonfirst in

jw
friends

this is a topic discussed in a current article in the hongkong based asia times*.

find it at: https://asiatimes.com/2023/09/nones-still-no-match-for-us-christian-nationalism/.

the claim is made in the article, that near 30% of americans are non-believers, and that this number is increasing.

no-zombie

Personally, I'm coming around to the opinion that churches and church attendance does play a useful roll in society. It gives many people continuity and a connection to others, and it has been proven to promote mental health and longevity. Any religion is ok, Catholic or Protestant ... nothing too radical.