When I was interested in things JW two decades or so ago, I never came across these mentions of hailstones. It crops up so often now that it's almost a meme! When did it become a thing in JW speak, and what does it refer to?
Hailstones?
by NotFormer 34 Replies latest jw friends
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FFGhost
It’s based on a (surprise!) weird interpretation on an out of context scripture from the book of Revelation.
Revelation 16:21 mentions “great hailstones” (weighing 45 pounds each) falling on people’s heads.
Official JW doctrine has it that these hailstones represent a “judgment message” that JWs will deliver in their door to door work just prior to Armageddon.
What’s that you say? The hailstones are mentioned as falling AFTER Armageddon, mentioned just 5 verses earlier?
Don’t bother me with details! The GB have thus decreed it! Who are YOU to question the spirit inspired ramblings of God’s only channel? Begone you sniveling worm!
Just as a side note, this “hailstone message” has a prominent part in this month’s JW Broadcast. It’s a little unusual, they seem to be implying that JWs will somehow start up this “hailstone message” very soon, even prior to the “great tribulation”. Which is kind of odd, since that would be a pretty significant change in doctrine.
Not sure if it’s just the usual “very soon now” fear mongering or if they are telegraphing a change in doctrine.
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WingCommander
Honestly, this is NOT a new concept, but rather a very old one brought around again to stir up the masses into a panic.
I'm 44. As a child in the early 80's, I often heard that at some point the message would change to a hailstone or "we told ya so!" type of message. So frankly, this is nothing new. The fact that it appears that they are now ready to play this card, really shows their desperation. Even the build-up to 1975 wasn't played as the "hailstone message." Once this card is played, if nothing happens they are utterly FUGGED! There's no going back from it or trying to smooth it over. You'd truly have to be a moron to stay in after that. But then again, people stayed in after '75 came and went, some even buying WT's lame-ass excuses of the rank-n-file "running ahead" and making it up. (when it was clearly WT HQ pushing it)
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Beth Sarim
Should the Borg move with this hailstone message and go with the judgement message,,,they're stuck with it. There's no going back.
After months,,then years then decades go by and no big 'A',,,they're stuck with the judgement message.
Thats why the constant ramped-up anticipation of the big "A",, to keep the victims on edge.
Theres NO going back after the judgement message.
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no-zombie
If the GB want to end door to door witnessing done by the Brotherhood, then just bring in the 'Hailstone' message. Because no-one will be going out witnessing when that's announced, that's for sure.
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Teddnzo
Yes we noticed it in the October broadcast. The young brother put his jacket over the cart to hide JW when police walked past. Then the older brother had some long winded words and all is well the young brother takes his jacket off uncovering the JW logo.
I didn’t hear the words hailstone message or even judgement message but then I wasn’t really listening. Did they actually say that or just imply it?
last few years they keep pushing this hailstone message that Will basically be going round telling everyone it’s too late there is nothing you can do you should have listened to us! Yeah that sounds like a sensible doctrine from reading Rev 16🤣
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EasyPrompt
A Stronger Judgment Message, October 2023 Annual Meeting...
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NotFormer
"The fact that it appears that they are now ready to play this card, really shows their desperation. Even the build-up to 1975 wasn't played as the "hailstone message." Once this card is played, if nothing happens they are utterly FUGGED! There's no going back from it or trying to smooth it over. You'd truly have to be a moron to stay in after that. But then again, people stayed in after '75 came and went, some even buying WT's lame-ass excuses of the rank-n-file "running ahead" and making it up. (when it was clearly WT HQ pushing it)"
Interesting that they are playing a card that smacks of desperation like that. Maybe the ageing GB want one last hoorah, a great feeling of expectation like they saw in the good old days. By the time they're dead, it'll be the next GB's problem to sort out the mess.
I can see them coming back from this; just look at the graph on this page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Jehovah%27s_Witnesses
Apart from a bit of a plateau around 1975, growth has been steadily upward. For all their flaws, and outright evil, the WT seems bullet proof.
That doesn't mean that they will last forever. Money woes seem to be besetting them ATM. That's probably their Achilles heel 👠. But they'll still be around in one form or other. There are still Russellites around today. 🙄
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enoughisenough
an odd thought: maybe they will play the hail stone gammit because they know the organization is going down the tubes. So if after "the hail stone message", the organization folds-and no more come in-"aha! we were correct!"....something like that. It's come in now or never! At anyrate, I never did think the Hail Stone Message made sense.
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EasyPrompt
Why EXJWs Don't Need to be afraid of the WTBT$ supposed "Hail"...
The WTBT$ misinterprets the "hail" plague mentioned in Revelation. They take it out of context, like they do with so many other things. The message of Revelation is a composite dream, just like these other dreams in the Bible...
...Joseph dreamed two dreams that meant the same thing, the sheaves bowing down and the sun moon and stars bowing down. (Genesis 37:5-11) They both foretold that Joseph would be a ruler in Egypt.
...Pharoah dreamed two dreams about the seven fat/skinny cows and the seven full/thin ears of grain. (Genesis 41) They both foretold seven years of plenty followed by seven years of famine.
...Daniel has several chapters with visions of the progression of world powers told from slightly different angles, chapters 2, 7, 8, 11/12.
Revelation is the same way, dreams/visions to be understood by taking them together, not out of context.
The seven bowls of God's anger, the seven plagues, the seven trumpets, the seven seals...they all foretell God's judgment upon hypocritical religious institutions and then on the hypocritical governments. They are not separate events with individual plagues. They are representing that time of the great tribulation from slightly different angles.
The so-called "hailstone message" that the WTBT$ is talking about is non-existent. The "hail" in Revelation is part of the composite vision. The Bible explains itself regarding that "hail" that it is figurative and it is referring to the dissolution of religious institutions...
Isaiah 28:14-29
"So hear the word of Jehovah, you boasters,
You rulers of this people in Jerusalem,
For you men say: “We have made a covenant with Death,
And with the Grave we have made an agreement.
When the raging flash flood passes through,
It will not reach us,
For we have made a lie our refuge
And we have hidden ourselves in falsehood.”
Therefore this is what the Sovereign Lord Jehovah says:
“Here I am laying as a foundation in Zion a tested stone,
The precious cornerstone of a sure foundation.
No one exercising faith will panic.
And I will make justice the measuring line
And righteousness the leveling tool.
The hail will sweep away the refuge of lies,
And the waters will flood out the hiding place.
Your covenant with Death will be dissolved,
And your agreement with the Grave will not stand.
When the raging flash flood passes through,
You will be crushed by it.
As often as it passes through,
It will sweep you away;
For it will pass through morning after morning,
During the day and during the night.
Only terror will make them understand what was heard.”
For the bed is too short to stretch out on,
And the woven sheet is too narrow to wrap up in.
For Jehovah will rise up as at Mount Pe·raʹzim;
He will rouse himself as in the valley near Gibʹe·on,
That he may do his deed—his strange deed—
And that he may carry out his work—his unusual work."
The WTBT$ and other religious institutions think they will never be "touched" by demise ("I sit a queen, and I am not a widow, and I will never see mourning" Revelation 18:7) that they "have a covenant with Death" because of helping the UN with all their promotions but they are wrong. Their religious institutions will be dissolved by the governments of the world. It is by the word of Jehovah. The figurative hail will sweep away the refuge of lies. The plagues on ancient Egypt were to show up those gods as false. Pharaoh claimed to be a god, but the plagues showed he was not a god. The plagues of Revelation are figurative, they will also show up the "gods" of the religious institutions as false - "gods" like the "FDS" and the Pope and other clergy.
The "hail" is not a "preaching assignment". These plagues are judgments from heaven, from Jehovah Himself. Jehovah is showing up the hypocrisy of the religious institutions and the governments. The WTBT$ can't make "hail".
The "hail" is going to fall on the so-called "FDS" and the other religious hypocrites. You don't need to be part of the JWBorg to make Jehovah your refuge. Jehovah is sending the "plagues" so that we can be free of such tyranny.