Posts by Ravyn

18

Need help with the Trinity

by dins in

i have been talking to a coworker of mine about religion and it's been rather interesting; it involves accepting christ into your heart as your saviour.

another thing is the trinity.. is there anything that any of you have found in the bible based on these beliefs.

i keep reading scriptures about god being one, and christ his son but then my coworker insists they are one in the same.. how, if anyway.

Ravyn

this is my personal belief. I do not claim anyone elses, nor do I intend to convert anyone to mine.

I believe the people who became the Jews recorded their ideas of God in what we have come to know as Genesis. The first chapter speaks of Elohim, which is plural. The second chapter speaks of YHWH, which is also plural--BUT-is one family unit of 'gods', separate from, but a part of, Elohim(read the first two chapters of Genesis in a good comparative Bible that gives the Hebrew and Aramaic references and you will see the two accounts of creation are very different and contradictory IF you understand them to be the SAME creation--however if you see them as two different examples of creation they do not conflict. Elohim created the Universe and other humans, YHWH created the Garden and Adam and Eve--and Lilith, but that is a different story.) Yod-He-Vau-He is Father/Mother/Son/Daughter(or Bride) and denotes ONE family unit 'GOD'. Nothing wrong with this---the Jews were very family/tribe oriented, as all humans. It was only with the rise of warrior/patriarchal society that the Matronit(or Mother/Daughter) got lost in the shuffle. But it is still not difficult to find the Jehovah/Shekinah pair right up thru Solomons Temple in secular historical documents. I see the Old Testament-shift to-New Testament as the natural prgression from Father/Mother to Son/Daughter(Bride). So---basically the YHWH of the Jews and into the the God of the Christians is not a Trinity but a Quaternity. Even if you believe in the Trinity, there is still the Bride of Christ to consider. Holy Spirit may be called 'male' but it has all the qualities of a Mother, and the words used for it in the OT are feminine.

Many other religions have trinities too. Usually they consist of two sets of trinities, one male and one female, or just a female trinity with one male god who services all and manages to get himself sacrificed(and usually chopped up into pieces).

The oldest concept of 'God' is that it is female who gives birth to a son without the help of another male. Then when the Son grows into maturity, he then becomes consort to the Mother who is now represented by a Daughter, or has changed her aspect to 'Maiden' again so the cycle can be perpetuated. The Son becomes the Father and then conveniently dies, while the Maiden/Mother/Crone goes on some dark inner journey(winter-time) to get him back as a newborn Son(Winter Solstice). Sometimes it is the Son/Father who goes on the quest. But it varies little among the ancient mythos.

Personally, YHWH is not my particular name for my 'god'. I am not Jewish. But I do not think YHWH is necessarily ONLY a Jewish god either. I think it represents the common idea of god. I also do not believe YHWH is the ULTIMATE DIVINITY. That would have been Elohim in the Jewish mythos. So I can be a 'trinitarian' and a 'unitarian' at the same time. And I can go to a Christian service and not feel out of place. I can profess the 'Apostle's Creed' and not feel like I am a traitor to it. I just believe BEYOND it. And I equally respect the beliefs of my own particular heritage. I don't see them as conflicting because I understand where they all come from.

Ravyn

35

Do demons flee from the name of God?

by ClassAvenger in

alright, i need a question answered, if possible with bible versicles.

do demons flee when someone pronounces god's name, jehovah?

i know this is a belief from the jws, but i don't know on what it is founded, or if it is.

Ravyn

without getting too metaphysical here...

I believe in the concept that there are higher spirit realms above humanity and lower realms(not sure about them being spirit per se) WITHIN humanity. I am not explaining this very well, I know because already I have confused myself...

ok, the Norse idea of 9 worlds, or the other pagan ideas of a tree of life sorta thing---I do believe there are spirits outside of the human creature, but I also believe there are 'levels' with in us as we are just a reflection of all of the Universe. So I do believe there can be 'demons'--BUT I do not believe they are naturally malevolent spirits outside of humanity intent on doing us harm. I also believe 99% of the so-called demons that JWs and other religions believe in, do not come from outside of humanity. I think it is the dualism inside of us and the deeper levels of ourselves. And I absolutely do not underestimate the power of our inner demons. Humans are very powerful creatures and we have no concept of it for the most part.

So....WHATEVER you BELIEVE chases away these demons, will chase them away since they are your own 'demons'. If it is a true spirit creature, I have never had the need to chase them away---if they scare me I ask them to go and they do. I have asked them what they wanted and when I found out why they were communicating with me---my fear has dissipated.

If you want to believe that saying a name or 'magick word' chases away the bad boogers of life--or a rabbit's foot or a prayer--then it will work until you doubt it.

I do not believe it is inferior or childish or superstitious to believe this way, so I am not putting anyone down. I think the human animal is always evolving and at this point in our development symbol and ritual are still necessary.

As a JW kid I had many many scary 'demon' experiences. As an XJW adult I have many many 'supernatural' experiences. However, the demon experiences I had as a kid were resolved in a dream about a year after I left the JWs.

I had 'the demon dream'--that recurring nightmare that I have had ever since I was 5 or 6 years old where the doors slam and the lights go out and the demons scream and you can't get your voice to say 'Jehovah' and you wake up in a total panic and pray the rest of the night out loud.... one difference this time. This time I did not try to say 'Jehovah' or to wake myself up. This time I ran into the evil black cloud that was screaming at me and I embarced it. I said 'nuh-uh'(as in the negative to uh-huh) and I grabbed that demon and I hugged the $h!t out of it! Guess what? it got all warm and it turned into a giant brown cloud of chocolate! I actually woke up tasting chocolate! What a trip! I have never had that dream again! In fact I have not been scared by any demons since. I have had visits by other spirits, but they were not scary. The worst demons were inside me, and I literally embraced them and they turned into chocolate. Dang even I could figure that one out without a visit to a Jungian psychoanalyst!

So while there will be many who think that a belief in any spirits or communication with them is just hogwash, I am not one of them. I respect spirits and 'demons'. But I do not fear them. The only ones who can control me are the ones that are 'in' me, and now I know I can change that.

I guess that makes us all possessed to some degree huh?

Ravyn

11

Just So's Ya Know...

by Inkie in

jw
friends

"truly i say to you that all things will be forgiven the sons of men, no matter what sins and blasphemies they blasphemously commit.

" .

--mark 3:28.

Ravyn

well then I guess even Jehovah's Witnesses still have a chance...right?

Ravyn

50

What do the British think of Camilla Parker Bowles?

by unbeliever in

jw
friends

i saw on the news this morning that the queen has invited camilla to a westminster abbey service to commemorate the 50th anniversary of the queen's coronation.

from what i heard this is a major deal.

i know 2 people that are from england.

Ravyn

Charles, Diana, Camilla, her husband(?), Harry and William...all have been hurt by laws and rules and an archaic institution that has always seen this kind of corruption, greed, and dishonesty...hmmmmmm....sounds familliar somehow....?????????

People are people. And of course my opinion has nothing to do with the fact that my middle name and my mother's name is Camilla(actually Comylla--but pronounced the same way).

Ravyn

13

Do you(all) realize how beautiful you are?

by Ravyn in

jw
friends

i don't mean just in the personality sense---which of course you all are---but in the physical sense!

tall, short, thin, heavy, dark, light, --this is a good-looking bunch!

yes some of us have things we wish were different about our looks---but i have not seen anyone here from pics who is not somewhere in the top percentile of human beauty.

Ravyn

I don't mean just in the personality sense---which of course you all are---but in the physical sense! Tall, short, thin, heavy, dark, light, --this is a good-looking bunch! Yes some of us have things we wish were different about our looks---but I have not seen anyone here from pics who is not somewhere in the top percentile of human beauty.

And all of us are above average intelligence--which is why we left the Borg--and above average empathy/loving--which is why we got involved or stayed in the Borg as long as we did.

When I was a little kid I used to ask my father what would happen if the Borg(I did not say Borg of course! LOL) ever failed Jehovah and his stock answer was that Jehovah was quite capable of either fixing the Borg, or getting the good people out of it. So, while I do not necessarily call my god by that name anymore, I do believe in an Ultimate Divine and maybe my Dad was right...maybe the good ones have been 'taken out'? Certainly this forum is a sort of archetypal 'ark' -- a sort of internet cruise ship for alot of 'good ones'. Just my opinion.

I love you guys.

Ravyn

30

How Do You Feel About Jehovah's Witnesses???

by minimus in

jw
friends

nearly everyone that posts here says mostly negative things about the witnesses.

a few will speak of certain jw's that were helpful to them while they were going through difficulties.

in the situation that you find yourself in now, do you feel that you hate jw's?

Ravyn

hmmmmm...considering that I am on the cusp of Gemini and was raised by a schizophrenic, I have to say I have a rather bi-polar colored judgment of them now---and yes I DID say that naughty "j" word.

(I have no problem 'judging' as long as I feel I have all the facts and am able to be subjective--meaning that it is MY judgment alone and not something I should try to preach and convert others to.)

Depends on the day. If the Borg does not impact me, I am ambivalent. But if they intrude on my personal freedom or that of someone I care about, I cannot come up with adjectives strong enough to convey my sense of total disgust and hatred. They are fundys. I feel this way about all fundys, no matter what religion they hide behind. I hate arrogance and ignorance more than anything in the world. Anyone, religious or not, who thinks they are better than anyone else makes me sick. It is one of the rare things that can actually push me into sheer rage and violence. (I know my limits, which is why I do not have any guns in the house at this time.) I would never never start anything, it is not in me to be an offensive player. However I will defend to the death. And I have to admit I have had fantasies of violence against the Borg in retaliation(and other fundys). BUT that is not every day, not even every week or every month. For the most part I lead a peaceful and calm existence and am happy with my life. They better not start with me is all, because I will finish it, and I will enjoy finishing it.

Amen Francois! (I enjoy your posts---I hope you are keeping a journal...it will make a very effective tool in your own personal journey and perhaps help others too.)

I hold my JW family MORE responsible than the Borg. The Borg is a corporate entity that is only being what all corporate entities are--survivalistic. However my JW family CHOSE to abandon me and stay with the Borg. If I can see the corruption and sickness of it all, so can they. I do not comfort myself with the delusion that they are just well-meaning brainwashed dupes. Every human has one moment in their lives when they cross over from being led by the nose ignorantly, innocently, to making the decision to be led by the nose. They had/have the same choice I did, and they chose the Borg over me. It hurts. But it is also the point where freedom from the Borg becomes reality. Once you achieve the maturity in your own ability to judge good and bad, you are free. What a rush.

Ravyn

9

JW's - Zeal Without Knowledge?

by Trotafox in

hm-m-m-m-m-m. found this article.

the following is for those of us on the board who are ex-jw and still christian (i just know you ex-jw ex-christians are chompin' at the bit...i can feel it through my computer...okay, okay; you can comment).

anyway, i found this to be quite interesting.

Ravyn

the word 'zeal' grates on me now. who else but JWs and XJWs use this word on a regualr basis? I prefer to use the word 'passion' to describe things I feel strongly about. 'Zeal' to me now, has an slightly insane edge to it now--off-balanced, fanatical.

Passion and knowledge can each stand alone. They can support each other or not. I don't see the importance of both together like JWs put on them. (Alot of things JWs base their whole lives around I find to be trivial at best now...)

Ravyn

42

So, Do You Think You're Smarter Than Most?

by minimus in

jw
friends

for all the people here on board that post, i wonder whether you think you're pretty smart.

for the record, i think i'm no dummy.

Ravyn

yep.

my husband says I am a 'bug-light'.

Ravyn

22

LETTER FROM MY DAUGHTER.... NEED YOUR OPINIONS

by calamityjane in

jw
friends

okay guys, i need your opinion.

my 13 year old daughter was pretty close to my jw parents when we left.

i cut off ties last year because of my mom's intrusive behaviour with my daughter.

Ravyn

I was 12 when I was baptized, how old were you? do NOT ever underestimate the danger involved in the JW cult and those who are loyal to it over their own flesh and blood. First of all, let your daughter know that it is not you who is keeping them away---it is their choice to continue with a corrupt religion rather than be a united family. I did not have any grandparents growing up and I turned out just fine. The only people who have any 'rights' to your children are you and your spouse(aka: parents)- don't let this mini-van obsessed society brainwash you into thinking any differently! You do what is BEST for your children, sometimes that means they go without something they might want--but is not for their best.

Sit down and talk with your daughter---put the blame where it belongs---you have no reason to feel guilty about denying the JW grandparents access to your children--it is the grandparents' fault for choosing the religion over family.

Ravyn

66

How tall are you?

by JH in

jw
friends

often we see pictures of each other on this forum, but often we only see the face and not the rest.

i stand 5' 8" tall barefeet, at 138 lbs naked .

so, how tall are you?.

Ravyn

I am 5 feet even and when I am not taking steroids for the Lupus I weigh 125, with pretty good muscle definition, size 6 jeans. However, last year was one of my 'on' years and the steroids put on about 65 pounds that it takes me a while to get off again. I am working on it.

Ravyn