Tech49

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Posts by Tech49

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  14

  What does CLAM stand for?

  by QuestioningEverything in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i've seen this in a few posts and not sure what it means.

  :) please help..

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  Tech49

  The newly combined Ministry School and Service meeting held during the week is now called the Christian Life and Ministry meeting (CLaM).
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  45

  River flowing from the garden of Eden

  by joey jojo in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  hey there.. if this point has been covered before please forgive me.. i have had the principles of noahs flood used by jw's to encourage me to attend meetings recently and this has got me musing about the flood....again.. genesis states that a river flowed from eden and branched out into four rivers, two of which being the tigris and the euphrates.. heres the baffling part; if it had never rained before, how is it that rivers existed before the flood?!!?.

  a brief google search tells us that the euphrates begins its journey as snow melt and rain ( as most rivers do) in mountains in turkey.. ecc chapter 1 mentions the water cycle and describes the rivers flowing into the sea but the sea not becoming full.

  how did it work pre-flood?

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  Tech49

  Not to hijack this thread, but a related question?

  Are JW's the only people/religion that teaches the idea of no rain before the flood, and a "water canopy?

  Just wondering......
  
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  18

  School bus driver accused of telling boy he would go to hell because of moms.

  by ToesUp in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  school-bus-driver-accused-of-telling-boy-hed-go-to-hell-because-of-his-mom/.

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  Tech49

  Blondie, yes, it is a formal JW business card that is printed out by WT and available in bulk at the congregation level. Everyone is "encouraged" to use them as much as possible. They have all the pertinent JW.org info on them. They are like a super-mini tract..... there is a shot of it in that video.
  
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  18

  School bus driver accused of telling boy he would go to hell because of moms.

  by ToesUp in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  school-bus-driver-accused-of-telling-boy-hed-go-to-hell-because-of-his-mom/.

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  Tech49

  This is exactly the kind of thing that pisses me off, and is absolutely absurd. JW's make such asses of themselves, it goes beyond all normal comprehension!!

  This one lady's efforts to "preach" the "good news" to a 7 year old, have backfired so badly that now scores of people see JW's in a bad light, if they don't already.

  For cryin out loud, sometimes you just need to keep your mouth shut! You dont have to agree with someone else's behavior and lifestyle choices, but you DO need to have tact and common sense enough to know when there is a time and a place to talk about it.

  This was clearly NOT the time or the place. Sadly, so many JW's will see their "card" and "tract" on the news and do a little dance, and praise the "sister" for being so BOLD!

  How disgustingly embarrassing. I guess you just can't fix stupid.

  Would someone please give me a Super-face-palm meme........
  
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  182

  The Danger of Settlements

  by Tech49 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i was pondering the recent influx of lawsuits against wt, specifically in regards to the child abuse cases (ie.

  conti, fessler, lopez, etc).. in each of these, wt has settled for an "undisclosed" amount, assumed to be in the millions of dollars each.

  i know there are many many more cases, subject for a different thread i'm sure.. i was reading something completely unrelated a while back that mentioned the dangers of settlement agreements for a large corporation or business (not just wt).

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  Tech49

  To Sir82: yes, I suppose so, as in "too big to fail"? Sad part is, most of the flock no longer realize that the religion that prided itself on being loving and personal is no longer that. It is not even a book-selling religious business any more. Its a corporation.

  To Richard: let's not argue the minutia, I think you get the point of my opening comments. Cant we all just be friends?. Sheesh.

  To Fink: Yes, agree. Settlements (at least from WT in these cases) are a chicken-shit way of saying "ya, we're guilty, so what?" And they will continue to ignore the simple fact that children and families are getting run over with the big corporate wheels of religion.
  
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  182

  The Danger of Settlements

  by Tech49 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i was pondering the recent influx of lawsuits against wt, specifically in regards to the child abuse cases (ie.

  conti, fessler, lopez, etc).. in each of these, wt has settled for an "undisclosed" amount, assumed to be in the millions of dollars each.

  i know there are many many more cases, subject for a different thread i'm sure.. i was reading something completely unrelated a while back that mentioned the dangers of settlement agreements for a large corporation or business (not just wt).

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  Tech49

  I was pondering the recent influx of lawsuits against WT, specifically in regards to the child abuse cases (ie. Conti, Fessler, Lopez, etc).

  In each of these, WT has settled for an "undisclosed" amount, assumed to be in the millions of dollars each. I know there are many many more cases, subject for a different thread I'm sure.
  

  I was reading something completely unrelated a while back that mentioned the dangers of settlement agreements for a large corporation or business (not just WT). In effect, the quicker the settlement, and/or the larger the settlement (even if specifics are not known), creates in itself a dangerous paradox. It exposes their willingness (or weakness), financially, to ignore the right thing to do and just get rid of the problem, to buy it out, to cover it up.
  

  Once a company or organization goes down the settlement road, a horrible, irreversible precedent is set. I think there is even a specific legal term for it, but cant think of it right now.... That company's cards have been shown (figuratively). They have just shown onlookers that they have a fat wallet, and are willing to cut a check, because ultimately they really don't care about anyone but themselves.
  

  So now, anyone who has been on the fence about what to do about their particular situation is shown a better option or possible outcome to a lawsuit that they may initiate. Likely, a long trial process will never come to fruition.

  EXAMPLE: I run a small company. If there is EVER a problem with products or services with my name on it, I will do anything and everything in my power to resolve the situation personally. Even if a lawsuit is initiated, I will do my very best to be honest, explain all the circumstances, show documented evidence, and then take my knocks if they come. (Fortunately, this has never happened, and our customer service is second-to-none). I would NEVER just say "lets settle, here's a check". If I were to do that, then anyone could sue me for anything, as that precedent has been set. My company and reputation would be trashed in no time. Granted, this is a small-scale example, but I think you see the point.
  

  My thought was this: Has WT made an even LARGER mistake by going down this road, repeatedly? Would it not have been less painful in the long run to admit mistakes, make policy changes, and take things to trial, even accepting monetary FINES and punishments? It seems to me that everything WT does is extremely SHORT-sighted. Even if settlements are reached AFTER a trial has concluded, would not the long-term benefits outweigh the short term gratification of making the "problem" go away? After all, no problem, or discussion of child abuse and outright lies and deception never really goes away. The internet has a way of making this stuff come up so often, that even the most die-hard JW's will see it, and after they keep seeing it time and time again, sooner or later they will look it up and read about it. WT can only say "apostate news items" and "apostate websites" for so long, as more and more LOCAL cases will educate their flock about what really goes on.

  You could even begin to think that the "collateral damage" that comes from some of their members learning the real "truth" is an acceptable percentage of loss. A "calculated risk", if you will.

  After all, as long as their total membership and percentages of "growth" continues in the plus column, who cares about the "truth"!
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  6

  Need bethel email address I would like to send an email.

  by poopie in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  please .

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  Tech49

  There is no formal email address to contact Watchtower HQ. You can write or call, that's it.
  
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  53

  Skinned and Thrown About.....

  by Tech49 in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  this is a little long, but stick with me.. if you recall, when the building work was in full swing at the new lakefront villa (warwick), wt was having workers come and they would put them up for a year, or more, while they were providing "volunteer services".

  with that, and the impending need for hundreds and hundreds of new khs in the usa territory, the congregations were abuzz with the need for "continued construction volunteers".

  recently, as many of you know, wt headquarters has sent pretty much everyone home, and is no longer needing workers at the new warwick site, as the building is mostly complete, with the dedication coming up later this year.

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  Tech49

  Response to JookBeard's comment about "something doesn't seem right" (maybe you should not be so quick to respond in the negative, just sayin...):

  Just to clarify: The couple I mentioned sold their home and business. But they were so heavily mortgaged and in debt that they came out in the end with very little to play with. They had already filed bankruptcy about 10 years earlier.... see a pattern? They made more selling off their furniture, vehicles, tools, etc at fire-sale prices, in order to have money to play with. Yes, they were definitely banking on the short-term glory of being Bethelites, with no concern for the future. 2 years of spending cash with no income, and you can burn through quite a bit pretty fast. Thats what came around to bite them in the ass. That's exactly what the wife and I tried to warn them about before they left (thank you OUTLAW for pointing out that WE were the ones that spoke to them, their friends, realists, not WT), but they couldn't see the forest for the trees.

  In the end, I dont feel bad for them one bit. They had ZERO long-term plans, other than momma WT taking care of them, forever. Firmly latched to the teat, until the end of days. They knew what they were getting into, but flat out refused to accept the reality of the situation until it was too late.

  And yes, in response to someone elses comments, I hope that some lurker out there reads this, and stops to think about what it is that WT is really holding out to you.... NOTHING. They take take take. And when you are used up and broken, or they dont need you anymore, you will find yourself in a ditch along the highway of life, with nothing but the shirt on your back, and the wind in your face.... and its raining...... and cold....... and you're hungry........and you lost one shoe....
  
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  47

  What did you regrettably not do because you were a Jehovah's Witness ?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  jehovah's witnesses cannot do a lot of things.

  i remember pioneers having to quit their jobs because they could not work in a convenience store and sell cigarettes.

  i know of a young man who was offered a scholarship to any college or university if he wanted to go to because of his football abilities.

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  Tech49

  I too gave up a full-ride scholarship in architecture, right when CAD was coming on to the scene, late 80's. I loved architecture and engineering, was very good at it..... but turned it down, like a good little WT boy. I knew the next day that I had made a terrible mistake, but was too afraid to do anything about it. 30 years later, here I am.
  
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  53

  Skinned and Thrown About.....

  by Tech49 in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  this is a little long, but stick with me.. if you recall, when the building work was in full swing at the new lakefront villa (warwick), wt was having workers come and they would put them up for a year, or more, while they were providing "volunteer services".

  with that, and the impending need for hundreds and hundreds of new khs in the usa territory, the congregations were abuzz with the need for "continued construction volunteers".

  recently, as many of you know, wt headquarters has sent pretty much everyone home, and is no longer needing workers at the new warwick site, as the building is mostly complete, with the dedication coming up later this year.

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  Tech49

  This is a little long, but stick with me.

  If you recall, when the building work was in full swing at the new Lakefront Villa (Warwick), WT was having workers come and they would put them up for a year, or more, while they were providing "volunteer services". With that, and the impending need for hundreds and hundreds of new KHs in the USA territory, the congregations were abuzz with the need for "continued construction volunteers". Recently, as many of you know, WT headquarters has sent pretty much everyone home, and is no longer needing workers at the new Warwick site, as the building is mostly complete, with the dedication coming up later this year. And now with the KH building program being shelved, the need for workers is growing even smaller. That brings us to this:
  

  I have 2 brief experiences to relate... both 100% true, and both factual, as I know both parties personally. I have waited a while to tell these stories, but decided its time...
  

  Couple #1 : We are pretty close with this couple. Their kids are grown, so they saw an opportunity. They sold his business, all his construction tools, sold and moved out of their beautiful house, sold all their personal belongings and were ready to be sent wherever the need was GREAT! WORK FOR WT until the END!!! Of course WT accepted their application to help build at Warwick. (we talked with them right before they left, and told them basically to enjoy themselves, but to be careful, dont put all your eggs in one basket, and this may not last very long, blah blah blah). anyways........ Off they went in a blaze of glory and fanfare!!! All giggles, smiles, rainbows, and unicorns!!
  

  They stayed in one of the hotels purchased/leased by WT, for almost 2 years. Yes, you read that right; food, room, and transportation paid for in full for almost 2 years. Again, yes... almost 2 years of free living. They drove to New York from the West Coast, so had their own personal vehicle. During the week, they rode WT shuttles to the jobsite. On the weekends, they explored the countryside on their own (remember, they had sold all their worldly belongings, so had money to burn). They were loving life! Oh, to be needed and wanted! Jehovah was blessing them! They were the glorious shiny examples for all! So spiritual!!! They were treated like royalty !! The work at Warwick was winding down in his field, so they were sent down to California to be "trainers". OH MY GOD GEEhovah is GREAT!!!!
  

  THEN, almost overnight, everything came to a screeching halt. KH program was scrapped, all building work stopped. They were asked to return "home". They came home dejected. No place to live, no belongings, nothing. They stayed with friends. The poor couple was so downhearted and depressed, they related the experience like they had been "fired". Brother elder kept calling his contacts at Bethel..."please give me an assignment" he would ask, day after day after day. He told me later that the brothers in Bethel finally flat out told him... "Look, stop calling us. If we want you, we will call you. We have your number. You are making a fool of yourself. STOP CALLING." He was crushed. Now, he was again just a standard elder/publisher. No longer a glorious needed "bethel worker". No more fancy titles, no traveling on WT dime. Nothing. Now he would have to try and find a real job.

  He found a menial job working for another brother. He hates it. He barely makes wages. His boss goes on lots of vacations, has new rigs, the usual. He complains constantly that he got the short end of the stick. He had to buy an old beater truck to get to work. He hates it. He deserves better, he says. They had to live in a shitty loaner travel trailer until they could find a little shitty rental house. They both hate it. He says he hates living in the real world. His wife is so sick and tired of him whining she is about done. Sad situation all around, his spark is gone.

  Couple #2 Basically the same situation, although they did NOT sell everything to work at Warwick. They too spent almost 2 years there, were sent home when she was diagnosed with a recurrence of cancer (of course they just could not understand why WT wouldnt help them with any type of treatments). They too are bitter and angry, although they would never admit it openly. Only in confidential talk do they admit to being angry, yelling at one another constantly behind closed doors..etc. They are not happy at all, and everything you see on their faces is a facade. They too absolutely HATE being in the real world. They want and expect to be coddled and be provided for (he has been an elder and a pioneer for decades). They figure they are almost "owed" something for their efforts.

  In the end, both couples got tossed aside when WT was done with them. Both couples are "pillars" in the congregation, and are deeply hurt (I dont know if thats the right word for it) by how they are being treated.... or are NOT being treated. Its as if WT put them on this big shiny pedestal, and now they realize the pedestal was made of fairy dust. They both had great big titles, had parts at the assemblies about what shining examples they are, gave talk after talk, experience after experience of their marvelous travels.... and now they are just lowly plebians, laity class, rank-and-file. They were both so brainwashed into thinking that their labors would be until the END, that they would be taken such good care of for all eternity...... that now real life is just a crushing reality.
  

  Oh WOE IS ME, WOE is ME!

  Mrs Harper and I just shake our heads and smile. "I told you so" might be a little mean, but so appropriate. Fools, grown-assed men and women, fools.
  

  Jack Harper, TECH49