Posts by pronomono

178

Honest survey question on effectiveness of 'apostacy'

by Simon in

jw
friends

it seems like lots of people have big dreams of 'destroying the watchtower'.

it's usually linked to a story of how they were wronged and want some revenge.

do these 'in your face' attempts to convince people that the truth isn't the truth really have an effect?.

pronomono

Simon, you hit the nail on the head. JWs don't become apostate overnight. Since I've just mentally come out, the experience is fresh in my mind. I've had plenty of people, apostate or not, try to rationalize against my beliefs. I could rationalize certain things, but JW propaganda thoroughly discouraged me from viewing or reading any blatantly obvious apostate material.

The change for me was this forum and sites like JWFacts where I was in control. I was in control of how much information I read. I was in control of verifying facts and references. Unlike videos where someone leads you down a specific path, these websites allowed me to quickly focus on what was important to me due to excellent organization, search functions, and interaction.

Having the feeling that I was in control of what I learned is what led me to explore my doubts and is what led me here.

28

A Faders Guide to Field Service

by pronomono in

as a fader, i'm working on a mental guide to field service.

because most of this is a mental exercise realizing that your new knowledge, the mental side of things, is what makes it so hard to preach after learning ttatt.

what presentations have you used in field service as a fader to preach the good news without preaching jw propaganda?.

pronomono

Two to three hours per month (mostly informal witnessing, if you could call it that) has kept me under the radar so far. I'm not inactive per se, but I'm definitely not exemplary by their standards. The elders pushed back on me the first month, I thanked them for their concern, started doing less, and now they barely speak to me. The sad thing is my previous elders from my last congregation still reach out to me for privileges; apparently they don't know about my new situation. It will break their hearts to learn the truth when I start to turn them down and tell them why. And it will be hard because I actually care about those guys. It seems like they were the only sincere ones I've met, with the exception of one or two back home.

Anyways, the November tract work has made field service easy, but that's quickly coming to an end. There's no thought process needed and very little deception since you aren't saying anything. It's a here, read this type thing. The householder can make there own decision about it, but hopefully they'll wind up just throwing it away.

28

A Faders Guide to Field Service

by pronomono in

as a fader, i'm working on a mental guide to field service.

because most of this is a mental exercise realizing that your new knowledge, the mental side of things, is what makes it so hard to preach after learning ttatt.

what presentations have you used in field service as a fader to preach the good news without preaching jw propaganda?.

pronomono

LostGeneration, Agreed. The only reason I still go, once a month, is to keep my wife happy. I'm being patient with her to let her doubts develop. This takes time, just as it did with me. It's been 6 months now and a steady progression. It hasn't been nearly that long with her. She's already progressed to missing more meetings, saying that she'll go out in service but rarely does, and watching entertainment that the society condemns. Although she rarely goes in service, we still usually manage once every month or two. It's a start but not nearly the finish. As I help her to break the chains I have to be supportive, which means giving in to her spiritual inclinations as she has given in to my inclinations to do otherwise. With the progress that we've made, I'm sure that we will both be inactive soon.

Don't get me wrong. I'm all for manning up and dealing with the consequences. I've taken a large portion of my life back already. But out of love, I want to slowly help my wife out of the org instead of destroying her world overnight. Just as Jesus slowly opened the eyes of the blind man, I'm opting to slowly open the eyes of my wife.

So to help me through this, I need some field service presentations. Because there is nothing wrong with preaching the good news. The wrong is preaching the JW propaganda that comes with the good news.

Thanks Splash/CrazyGuy for the suggestions. Hoping they turn me away doesn't happen all that much in the Bible Belt until you try to put literature in someone's hands, though.

55

WT article on ''never have we said Jehovah has said"

by Aussie Oz in

been going nuts looking for this.. i am sure i have read, and probably saved, a quote by them about not being false prophets but i am buggered if i can find it anywhere in search, google or my own pc.. can you help?.

i think its 2009 but not sure, where they have the line 'never have we said ''jehovah has said'' when ...'.

a link or pdf or scan or cut n paste, etc would be great!.

pronomono

marked

28

A Faders Guide to Field Service

by pronomono in

as a fader, i'm working on a mental guide to field service.

because most of this is a mental exercise realizing that your new knowledge, the mental side of things, is what makes it so hard to preach after learning ttatt.

what presentations have you used in field service as a fader to preach the good news without preaching jw propaganda?.

pronomono

As a fader, I'm working on a mental guide to field service. Because most of this is a mental exercise realizing that your new knowledge, the mental side of things, is what makes it so hard to preach after learning TTATT. I'm familiar with some of the tactics of avoidance - knocking lightly, walking slowly, working with someone that likes to take all the doors, etc. - but what happens if you actually meet someone and your conscience doesn't let you preach JW propaganda? You have to preach. But about what? Well, we have the Bible of course. That's what many can agree on, if we can base our presentations entirely on the Bible.

As a new fader, I unfortunately don't have any. I'm too indoctrinated into throwing magazines into the householders hands. So can you help me out? What presentations have you used in field service as a fader to preach the good news without preaching JW propaganda?

30

I give up

by KariOtt in

jw
friends

hubby is now giving 5 days a week to the cult.

they see more of him while he is awake than i do.

when he is home he is either sleeping or in his office on his computer.

pronomono

I know I will never get him out... I am now having bad dreams that he wants to know about. Why should I tell him. All he will do is dismiss them along with my feelings, telling me they arn't real.

How do you know unless you express yourself to him?

I second what Ingimar and Daniel say. Talk to your husband. If anything, it will make you feel better and have less regrets about what you decide to do next. If you leave now, you will always wonder what could have happened if you just spoke up and told him about your issues, 100% open honesty, if you really feel it is reaching the point of no return. Who knows? Maybe you will win him over. It's not guaranteed, but it if you still love him, it is worth the effort. If he does not respond and you decide to pursue a life without him, you will have less regrets.

Personally for me, when I started opening up to my wife about my JW issues, although it was painful and she said some hurtful things, it has opened the way for more candid communication. When I act certain ways at the KH, she has a better understanding of what I'm going through. She doesn't like it. Nor does she believe. In her mind, I think that if she waits this out I'll come back around. In my mind, I'm thinking she'll do the same. But now things are in the open, there is less tension in our marriage. We are more loving to each other. We cherish the time we have together.

4

Equilibrium

by DS211 in

so im watching equilibrium and john preston (christian bale) is an officer who has to identify and kill or get rid of "sense offenders"-humans who stop taking medication to control their emotions.

anyways at the beginning he goes and meets with the chancellor if the tetragrammaton....lol i was like "oh wow.

i wonder if a witness wrote it" .

pronomono

Excellent movie. You find references to religion in lots of stuff like this. I think writers put these types of references in, not based on what they believe, but to add a double or hidden meaning to their characters. Although I thoroughly enjoyed it, it is too violent for a witness. This reminds me of my favorite video game franchise, Final Fantasy. They use a lot of religious references, pagan and Christian, to add subtle meaning to characters and events. It's always fun to pick up on these cues, especially when they relate to some religious nutcase.

15

RBC

by Gypsy Sam in

jw
friends

it's hard to believe it was only a little over a year ago i received my first official rbc assignment.

i was so excited i posted about it on facebook, to many likes from my fellow jw friends.. fast forward to this year, learning ttatt and fading (last meeting was the memorial and special talk).. i've received my fourth email, in the past two months, asking for rbc help.. stifling urge to hit reply all, with a jwfacts and candace conti case web link.... isn't it amazing how much your life and worldview can change in 1 year?.

pronomono

Gypsy, same here. TTATT changed my life immensely. It's only 6 months now for me, but it seems like eternity. I already feel freer, but having to be patient for those I love inside the org to awaken seems even longer than eternity. Best of luck to you.

31

How many of these books have your read?

by Calebs Airplane in

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pronomono

Two. I've read both of Franz's books. They were a game-changer for me.

SFPW, they were hardly propaganda and vicious lies. ISOCF started of like Franz was a grumpy old man, but the rest of the book was just as well written as CoC. They were point of view books that gave clear evidence as to why Franz maintained that view. While most JW books are point of view books as well, they are presented as absolute truth, until new absolute truth replaces it, that is. Franz never lied about the purpose of his books, that certain facts could be wrong based on his limited experience, or that he should believed. Instead he encouraged you to make your own opinions based of evidence you learn from not only his book, but both JW and secular information.

18

A question about shunning-your input appreciated

by crazycate in

jw
friends

i have been inactive for 5 years now.

lately i am being treated more and more as if i were disfellowshipped, which i am not.

do any of you know of anything, in writing, that is encouraging members to curtail any and all association with former members who are no longer active?.

pronomono

I haven't heard anything lately, but I quickly got the cold shoulder as I've become inactive over the past 6 months. There was a brief elders meeting right before I went inactive to see how the elders could help me re-qualify as a servant again. I told them I just needed more time. With that time I learned TTATT and started doing less and less. On paper, I have a few hours of informal witnessing, but honestly I'm inactive. The time I count, although real, wouldn't be considered time by a JW because although it's spiritual conversation, it's not JW propaganda.