Enjoy the feelings that everyone has come together on Iraq. It won't last. Maybe it will help to quite the war threads at best. Why overhelming force? 8 men are a target. [Black Hawk Down scenario] 200 21st century US soldiers with air and ground support is a guaranteed victory. What does it matter if 2000 soldiers were used? It worked! And it was clear that DNA from a JDAM bombing would not convince the detractors. They wanted bodies to believe. Now they have them. And now the US is a hippopottycrite for showing the bodies. Oh well, those who say that never liked America anyway.
Jayson
JoinedPosts by Jayson
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94
Saddam's Sons Confirmed Dead
by DevonMcBride in.
cnn is reporting that saddam's sons, oudai and qusay are confirmed to be dead.
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Photos released for: Psychological Warfare?
by sf infoxnews just stated that part of the release was "for psychological warfare".. if that is the case then the release will have the same, if not worse, psychological ramifications on u.s. children too?.
there is no way i want my child viewing this mindphuck bullkrap!!.
bush wants usa to see this...to make it clear....that if you go against him and his 'laws', you will too be 'deadmeat', as viewed in these photos.. this is sick.
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Jayson
The US gov should have found another way to prove to the naysayers that the sons were really dead.
The "naysayers" as you call them Teen will never be happy with what ever is done. The onesidedness can only me looked at as "The Tower is Always Right." Their carping's like
likethe freaking neighbors dog that will not shut up. I'd be shocked to learn that they actually belive the imortal Hussian's can die. Their hero's are of mythical proportions.These two crapolas are just "enemy combatants." And we should have tried to "talk them out" so we can "interogate" them. God we watch to much TV.
Right up there with "When someone is shooting at you then try to shoot them in the foot or something....Just to stop them....." W H A T E V E R
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27
Should the U.S. Release Photos of the Hussein Son's?
by Funchback inmy *personal* opinion is that they should because the people of iraq will probably require some proof.
i don't have any interest in seeing the photos but i believe that their photos will spread throughout the internet and the news media and curiosity will eventually cause me to peek at the photos.
don't know why i would have interest in seeing a couple of lifeless bodies though.
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Jayson
BTW, I do not think they should have shown the pics. However, as all the Wag the Dog detractors have pointed out, they would not believe it until they saw the bodies. Now they can see the bodies and they complain that they should not be shown.- Teenyuck
Well that's a wrap.
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117
Letter from a friend in Iraq
by Yerusalyim inok, i won't give his name, but he is a major with an engineer unit in iraq.
here's what he has to say on iraq, i've highlighted a few interesting points.
it has been a while since i have written to my friends about what's really going on here in iraq.
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Jayson
That's a question, isn't it. On the one hand he or someone else edited the letter, and it wasn't sent as a "forwarded" item. On the other hand, he didn't sign it, and it was sent to some number of email addresses. I don't know what his intention was. -Yeru
Yeru, I am pretty disgusted with people demanding that you condem your friend. You do what every you feel is appropriate. You know him and his character not me. He may have innocently passed on a letter. And, a positive letter about Iraq at that. (THE HORROR) These people that look for and continue to point out ever flaw with Iraq & Bush while willfully ignoring any postive what so ever of the actions thus far probably help the cause more than hurt it. They may not see their bias but others do. They still think their BBC & such is above reproach and that ain't so. (Well, maybe for them it is) Time will tell.
Has anyone read this book? I am considering buying it.THE CONTINUING STORM
Iraq, Poisonous Weapons, and Deterrence
Avigdor Haselkorn1999
400 pp. 13 illus., 6 1/8 x 9 1/4
Cloth ISBN 0-300-07582-0 $30.00“Haselkorn is the first to take a serious academic look at the role of weapons of mass destruction in the Gulf War. It is an important breakthrough, and it will be a major contribution to a complete reassessment of the war.”--Paul Bracken, author of The Command and Control of Nuclear Forces
In this thought-provoking book strategic analyst Avigdor Haselkorn provides an important reassessment of the 1991 Gulf War. Haselkorn’s step-by-step narrative--in which he reviews the events of the war with Iraq, examines intelligence and planning during the war, discusses why President Bush abruptly terminated it, and analyzes the strategic consequences--is absorbing and frightening. He reveals that the war was not the splendid high-tech victory that many Americans perceive, but a nearly catastrophic event. The threatened use of weapons of mass destruction during the Gulf War has redefined the meaning of deterrence, Haselkorn contends, and has set in motion trends that portend great danger to world peace.
This book focuses on the role played by biological and chemical weapons in the Gulf War and scrutinizes the dynamics of deterrence. It supplies the grim facts about anthrax, botulinum toxin, and poison gases and traces the terror of their use. Haselkorn shows that President Bush had little choice about ending the war when he did, given the failure of U. S. intelligence and severe flaws in strategic planning. Indeed, leaders on both sides of the conflict were either dangerously uninformed or did not fully understand the information they had. This book provides a key to understanding the continuing stalemate with Iraq, and it offers new insights into how the spread of weapons of mass destruction will affect world politics and future battlefields.
Avigdor Haselkorn is director of Geopolitical Forum, Lookout Point Online Database. He has advised many governments and businesses on foreign and strategic issues.
“Intellectually gussied up as ‘deterrence,” guessing how to out-terrify one’s enemy without actually resorting to anthrax, nerve gas, or nuclear bombs was a critical subtext in the Gulf War. Haselkorn describes this vital but arcane interaction of threat and belief in detail. . . . The author’s theory that Saddam Hussein’s posture of ‘terroristic deterrence’ indeed deterred Bush from marching on Bagdad challenges most views and should prolong the debate about the ragged conclusion to that war.”--Gilbert Taylor, Booklist
“It is hard to disagree with Haselkorn’s conclusion that in the future small extremist countries--North Korea, Libya, Iraq, and Iran--can use the threat of chemical/biological terrorism against the superpowers. A provocative and disturbing book.”--Library Journal
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3
Eat your B&J Ice Cream
by Jayson inthe couple were 85 years old, and had been married for sixty .
years.. though they were far from rich, they managed to get by because .
they watched their pennies.. .
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Jayson
The couple were 85 years old, and had been married for sixty
years.
Though they were far from rich, they managed to get by because
they watched their pennies.
Though not young, they were both in very good health, largely
due to the wife's insistence on healthy foods and exercise for the last
decade.
One day, their good health didn't help when they went on a rare
vacation and their plane crashed, sending them off to Heaven.
They reached the pearly gates, and St. Peter escorted them
inside. He took them to a beautiful mansion, furnished in gold and fine
silks, with a fully stocked kitchen and a waterfall in the master bath. A maid could be seen hanging their favorite clothes in the closet.
They gasped in astonishment when he said, "Welcome to Heaven.
This will be your home now."
The old man asked Peter how much all this was going to cost.
"Why, nothing," Peter replied, "remember, this is your reward
in Heaven." The old man looked out the window and right there he saw a
championship golf course, finer and more beautiful than any ever built on
Earth.
"What are the greens fees?", grumbled the old man.
"This is heaven," St. Peter replied. "You can play for free,
every day."
Next they went to the clubhouse and saw the lavish buffet
lunch, with every imaginable cuisine laid out before them, from seafood to
steaks to exotic deserts and free flowing beverages.
"Don't even ask," said St. Peter to the man. "This is Heaven,
it is all free for you to enjoy."
The old man looked around and glanced nervously at his wife.
"Well, where are the low fat and low cholesterol foods, and the
decaffeinated tea?" he asked.
"That's the best part," St. Peter replied. "You can eat and
drink as much as you like of whatever you like, and you will never get fat
or sick. This is Heaven!"
The old man pushed, "No gym to work out at?"
"Not unless you want to," was the answer.
"No testing my sugar or blood pressure or..."
"Never again. All you do here is enjoy yourself."
The old man glared at his wife and said, "You and your oatmeal.
We could have been here ten years ago." -
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Jayson
Ridiculousness crosses party lines!
That is worth framing!
Hey did anyone here that
Saddam's sons dead
By Kris Osborn
CNN Headline News
Wednesday, July 23, 2003 Posted: 9:47 AM EDT (1347 GMT)(CNN) -- Central Command officials tell CNN that an operation in the area of Mosul on Tuesday involving the 101st Airborne Division and special operations forces resulted in the deaths of Uday and Qusay Hussein.
Before that announcement, U.S. military officials were cautious about saying whether Uday and Qusay, Nos. 2 and 3 on Central Command's list of most-wanted Iraqi leaders, were in fact killed in the operation, according to a U.S. military spokesman.
"We've had disappointment before," the official said.
Additional efforts will be made to confirm the identity of the remains. CNN has learned that DNA samples will be brought to the United States for analysis.
According to U.S. military sources, "DNA is the way to go. We have DNA samples of the Hussein family, and you can bet nobody is stalling on this."
However, before Army Lt. Gen. Ricardo Sanchez's official announcement that the two sons had been killed, officials were clear that, regardless of the results of the operation, the hunt for former Iraqi regime leaders is far from over.
A U.S. military spokesman said, "Even if we got them, we are still out looking for more enemy forces and personalities. After all, Qusay and Uday have had 20 years to develop clones. Evil, like-minded clones will likely step in [in] an attempt to consolidate power through criminality."
As for the impact, military officials believe that killing Qusay and Uday will disrupt the chain of command with the remaining Baath party loyalists and paramilitary Saddam Fedayeen fighters. Uday, described by U.S. military officials as violent and ruthless, ran the paramilitary group.
At the same time, coalition officials say they are certain that Saddam loyalists and Baath party members remain a large and threatening force in Iraq.
One U.S. official said, "The heads of the Baath party have billions of billions of dollars, jewels, trailers filled with money and secret bank accounts. The coalition has probably just scraped the tip of the iceberg. The Hussein family is the Arab mafia of the country. There are about 25,000 people in the Tikriti clan, all of them with their hand in the pie. Nepotism is how they controlled the family, and most of the clan is blood relatives."
edit> http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/07/23/hln.terror.saddam.sons/index.html
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I Just Don't "Fit" Anywhere!
by pettygrudger ini'm sitting at work today, listening to all the different "cliques" around me, typing here on these boards a bit (don't tell), and it occurred to me again that i just don't fit.. .
it seems like i don't "fit" anywhere.
i'm always on the outskirts of alot of "groups", always on the fringe, but never inside.
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Jayson
pg that makes you smart, normal, and nobody's fool. It makes you the best kind of "friend" to have. imo
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117
Letter from a friend in Iraq
by Yerusalyim inok, i won't give his name, but he is a major with an engineer unit in iraq.
here's what he has to say on iraq, i've highlighted a few interesting points.
it has been a while since i have written to my friends about what's really going on here in iraq.
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Jayson
would you characterize the UN as generally proactive, or reactive?- onacruse
As to what? The humanitarian issues, war, disarmarment, peacekeeping, the dream of become a, if not the world power; all are differnet in the M.O. [imo.]
The UN to me; it is self serving and has little interest in true harmony. It is a soap box for thugs to air their hate of all things american. And a place for the U.S. to pretend to give other countries a say in things. It has no real ability to act to anything without the USA supporting it, a big reason for the jealousy. And that is unfair no matter your position on it. There was the USSR & the USA. The USSR is a part of history. To try to get a new balance of power is not going to happen. The world does not want to become one big Americanism playground. Simon said "US" as in "we" need to stop meddling in other countries affairs. I agree with him. Stop the spread of raw capitalism and democracy to the 3rd world. It does not work. To a certian level the big boys need to isolate themselves and have rules of ethical treatment of people for a country to join the club[UNism}. That would not be the UN as it is now. It also would mean that both the U.S. and the West would have to give up manipulating power.
Have you ever thought about how much oil costs. Not just the OPEC cost per barrel but the UN, the wars and arming and disarming, the UN, and the debt and all of it? How much does it cost? Like I keep saying "End Open Enrollment In The UN" or, end the UN and create something new.
All of this towards Iraq.... It's a place that is going to be a mess for years. Period. In a Big Mac give it to me now society it's going to be a mess forever. For those who have some patience you understand it is going to take awhile. At least now there is some hope.
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Propagandists caught in major deception??
by Gamaliel inthis subject has come up in another thread, but the other thread has of course turned into a left/right controversy which is not the point of my post.
i wanted to share a curious find with respect to a letter which is making the rounds all over the internet.
one version, which is not making the rounds, is one that a church evidently is claiming is the original they received from a member who is an army major on duty in iraq.
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Jayson
The first one sounds believable and genuine. The second is just blatant propaganda that pro-war supports have foolishly seized on and 'fallen for' IMHO.-Simon
Well this letter issue in combination with the double cross that Blair did with the British intel used to create that sentence in the State of the Union speech proves that you are right. There were never any wmd in Iraq. This whole thing was a UK conspiracy from the start. You guys are to smart for us simpton americans. I know that all those anti war dudes are really UK spys. I will talk to Bush in the morning and see if we can't just get those troops out of Iraq and back home to defend against the invasion.( This is all part of the UK masterplan to take back the British colonies.) I only hope that I can warn people before the British invade again.
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Letter from a friend in Iraq
by Yerusalyim inok, i won't give his name, but he is a major with an engineer unit in iraq.
here's what he has to say on iraq, i've highlighted a few interesting points.
it has been a while since i have written to my friends about what's really going on here in iraq.
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Jayson
Simon I'll go half way on this. The UN has a record of successful nation building in eastern europe & all over the world. They are sucessful at disarming Nations willing to disarm. They are great at humanitarian efforts. But when it comes to intervention they are helpless. The UN pulls the USA and the UK to a lesser exent into every conflict in the world. It has to stop. The UN should not be allowed to go on as it is for many reasons. Some of which are USA problems, some of which are western europe problems, and some of which are rouge countries and dictator countries which do not deserve the protection of international law. As long as there is "open enrollment" in the UN I will be in favor of the US pulling out of it 100%. imo you should be too for your country. We all should. It would go along way in ending the "meddling" that you talk of. (And which I agree with)
