Posts by sunny23

45

"Whilst the bible is important, the Watchtower is God's main way of communicating with people today"

by stuckinarut2 in

yes, i'm not kidding!.

this gem was stated today in the talk!

(shortly before i walked out).

sunny23

Still at it I suppose. I will have to add this one to the list of other WTBS superiority claims I found http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/271792/dont-question-god-aka-governing-body

29

I just wanna know WHY ! ! ??

by brandnew in

jw
friends

i just wanna know why...after a thousand dang years, jehovah would even want to think about lettin go of the dude who started it all....satan.

why?..

like a thousand years is a long time, and people are supposed to be gettin perfect n stuff during this time, and the earth is supposed to be gettin all perfectionized.... so satan can f- - - it all up again?.

sunny23

If God wanted to say it was Satan or lucifer that tempted Eve then he would have done so to divert some blame right? Yet he makes humans have to interpret it as maybe satan making a serpent talk? Odd. Even still that would make satan guilty of what? Coercion of a "minor" if you think about eve's real world experience on top of listening to a talking snake instead of the one who created you who talks to you as well and because she "lacked wisdom." Satan wouldn't even get manslaughter for that one. Satan only directly killed Jobs family with God's permission! I believe that's ALL the killing he did in the bible. God killed an estimated 25 million (2.4 million are accounted for directly in scripture).

If God can read hearts and decipher a person's thoughts and intentions then why waste time and effort to allow satan to tempt again after 1k years? Just toss all potentially disobedient humans in abyss in the blink of an eye. Stupid divine games made up by man. Technically with God's knowledge and wisdom, by using his power to unleash Satan on unsuspecting humans ending in their eternal destruction would be 1st degree murder on God's part. Lets go to trial b%#$. Satan looks like God's Luca Brasi from Godfather.

33

New Apostate: Tempest in a Teacup

by Tempest in a Teacup in

jw
friends

first post on here.

i've been lurking for 3-4 years and i mean i've been a mega lurker, doing marathon reading sessions for months or weeks.. sometimes i proceed by researching specific topics, or posters; other times just reading current discussions.

i'm particularly fond of "old" post, i.e 10-12-15 years ago.. i have laughed, smiled, got mad, cried etc, just reading some threads here.. as you can see i suffer from some kind of "accute lurkitis".

sunny23

Acute Lurkitis...that made me laugh a little too loud in the library right now. Thanks for that. Welcome to the forums and look forward to your future comments.

30

How is Genesis scientifically incorrect?

by EndofMysteries in

i'll add many things in the bible i don't agree with, but the bible is a collection of books.

now to make sure i'm reading as closely to what is written in genesis, i look at this hebrew interlinear, because english translating and rearranging of words can change it.

http://www.scripture4all.org/onlineinterlinear/otpdf/gen1.pdf.

sunny23

RJH:The days of the creation were not literal 24 hour days. The earth was not as it is now. And besides, why would recogning of a 24 hour day be needed as no man was around and no time pieces (clocks or watches) existed. The days of creation were "epochs of time" (time periods) each day spanning many 1000s of years. The expression "day" should be understood in the context of "my grandfathers day" or "in the day of the horse and buggy." Not a literal 24 hour day.

I said earlier:

"The Hebrew word "yom" is translated as day in Genesis. Just as our word "day" can have different meanings based on its context, so can the word "yom". For example, in the Old Testament "yom" is translated to mean a 24 hour day 1109 times. It means a long, long period of time--such as an age--about nine times.

However, every time the word "yom" is used with the term evening or morning in the Bible, it means a regular 24 hour day.

Every time the word "yom" is used with a number, such as "40 yom" (40 days), it means a regular 24 hour day.

What we now see is that in Genesis chapter one God is going out of His way to emphasize that each day is a normal 24 hour day. For example in verse five He says:

"And there was evening and there was morning, one day."

Verse 8: "And there was evening and there was morning, a second day."

Verse 13: "There was evening and there was morning, a third day."

For each day of creation the pattern is the same: evening, morning, number, day. Just part of that pattern, for example using the words "evening" and "day" together, tell us it was a 24 hour day. But God tells us in three ways -- evening, morning, number -- that the word day means... an ordinary 24 hour day.

God is making it very clear: He created everything in six ordinary days."

RJH you have not given any sound reasoning to justify your claim that the creative days definitely would not have been 24hr days. Maybe you would have a better argument if the verses read: "there came to be many evenings and many mornings, a second "yom." However it doesn't.

Also note:

Genesis: (Third day)

"And God said, 'Let the earth put forth grass, herbs yielding seed and fruit trees bearing fruit.'"

Science:

This section of Genesis' third day is out of sequence. Plants, grass, and fruit bearing trees, did not appear until AFTER sea creatures! Although microscopic single cell algae (bacteria or archaea microbes) are a plant and appeared at this time, it is not the advanced forms of plant life described in Genesis. Again, the appearance of flora did not take place at this time according to contemporary science.

30

How is Genesis scientifically incorrect?

by EndofMysteries in

i'll add many things in the bible i don't agree with, but the bible is a collection of books.

now to make sure i'm reading as closely to what is written in genesis, i look at this hebrew interlinear, because english translating and rearranging of words can change it.

http://www.scripture4all.org/onlineinterlinear/otpdf/gen1.pdf.

sunny23

EoM you need to read the other threads on this very topic like these two:

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/287553/creationist-should-dismiss-genesis-quickly

the above link is a response to this next links OP but you should read the responses there as well:

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/287474/scientists-should-dismiss-genesis-quickly?size=10&page=11

Eom as far as light creation and day and night occurring in Genesis, you claim the light could have come from stars before the creation of our sun and moon. However don't forget that each verse mentions having "evening", "morning," and DAYS before the sun and moon were created. How would far away stars that surround earth on ALL sides give Earth evenings, mornings, and days before the sun and moon??

"The Hebrew word "yom" is translated as day in Genesis. Just as our word "day" can have different meanings based on its context, so can the word "yom". For example, in the Old Testament "yom" is translated to mean a 24 hour day 1109 times. It means a long, long period of time--such as an age--about nine times.

However, every time the word "yom" is used with the term evening or morning in the Bible, it means a regular 24 hour day.

Every time the word "yom" is used with a number, such as "40 yom" (40 days), it means a regular 24 hour day.

What we now see is that in Genesis chapter one God is going out of His way to emphasize that each day is a normal 24 hour day. For example in verse five He says:

"And there was evening and there was morning, one day."

Verse 8: "And there was evening and there was morning, a second day."

Verse 13: "There was evening and there was morning, a third day."

For each day of creation the pattern is the same: evening, morning, number, day. Just part of that pattern, for example using the words "evening" and "day" together, tell us it was a 24 hour day. But God tells us in three ways -- evening, morning, number -- that the word day means... an ordinary 24 hour day.

God is making it very clear: He created everything in six ordinary days."

18

I Let Go Of Faith Ten years Ago Today

by cofty in

after more than 30 years as a jw and 9 as a born-again christian i finally let go of faith 10 years ago today.... it was on boxing day 2004 that news of the asian tsunami put the final nail in the coffin of my relationship with god.

since that time i have listened attentively to every possible argument in defense of faith; there has never been a single moment that i have felt any discomfort with my decision.. life without god has been liberating.

no longer do i have to defend the indefensible.

sunny23

First, thank you cofty for all of your contributions here. It had most definitely changed my outlook on life!

Erbie, before you generalize, make assumptions, and judge Cofty for his reasons on dismissing the Christian God over the Boxing Day tsunami you should read at least 155 pages of the thread Cofty started tackling this topic solely:

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/269000/pastor-my-old-church-tried-re-convert-me-yesterday

114

What Assembly were you baptized at...

by vilot in

jw
friends

i was baptized at the 1976 "sacret secret" dc at inglewood ca there must have been 50,000 people there..

sunny23

An old repurposed church in Indianapolis 2004, i was 17 and had been attending for 8years and a publisher for 7years.

7

Does science enhance nature or dilute it for you?

by snare&racket in

jw
friends

make a nice mug of hot choc, or your favourite tea/coffee and snuggle up with an inspirational mind...... https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bgaw9qe7dee.

.

sunny23

“What we need to become happier and to make the world a better place is not more pious illusions but a clearer understanding of the way things are.” Sam Harris

2

"Preaching To The Choir" here? Try Facebook

by sunny23 in

sometimes certain topics here can get redundant given enough time naturally.

i have created topics only to get various links to older threads in answer as others have as well.

has anyone gone elsewhere to spread the knowledge they have gained from here as break from debating and arguing the same things over and over as i see here?

sunny23

Other posts have been made one concerning the immoral principle behind stoning non-virgin brides and adulturers, another in reponse to people claiming to have been physically healed of ailments by God. No mater what facts and logic is presented, people find a way to falsly try and justify it.

“There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn't true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true.”
― Søren Kierkegaard

2

"Preaching To The Choir" here? Try Facebook

by sunny23 in

sometimes certain topics here can get redundant given enough time naturally.

i have created topics only to get various links to older threads in answer as others have as well.

has anyone gone elsewhere to spread the knowledge they have gained from here as break from debating and arguing the same things over and over as i see here?

sunny23

Hi Cofty, thought you would notice ;)

This is the rest of the post thats not shown in the pic:

1] When an animal was killed for food its blood was sacred and must be poured out on the ground. The rationale for this is the symbolic value of the blood in representing the life that has been taken

2] If an animal was found “already dead” its unbled flesh could be eaten with impunity; this resulted only in temporary uncleanness.

In the case of blood transfusions the blood that has been donated was not collected at the cost of the donor’s life and therefore has no more religious significance than the blood of an animal already dead which could be consumed without penalty.

Also notice when Jesus was accused of breaking the Sabbath law by performing miracles, he showed that exemptions to the law apply when a persons physical life and well being are at stake
Matthew 12:1-13
Jesus said: "What man shall there be among you, that shall have one sheep, and if it fall into a pit on the Sabbath day, will he not lay hold on it, and lift it out? How much then is a man better than a sheep?Wherefore it is lawful to do well on the Sabbath days. Then said he to the man, Stretch forth your hand. And he stretched it forth; and it was restored whole, like as the other."
He also plucked grain and ate on the Sabbath. Breaking the Sabbath carried the penalty of death. Saving/healing human life did not count as breaking it. Jesus was a Jew who invoked Pikuach Nefesh(the principle in Jewish law that the preservation of human life overrides virtually any other religious consideration). Orthodox Jews today accept blood transfusions under this ancient principle.
Accepting a blood transfusion to save a life should not be considered as breaking a biblical law by a truly loving God/Jesus in consideration of the biblical logic presented here.

According to Ezekiel 18:23 and 2Peter 3:9, God does NOT want ANYONE to die, even the wicked. Lets recap:
1. The Bible refers to eating blood from animals killed for food, not blood transfusions that do not result in the death of the donor.

2. Paul showed that Acts 15 was only binding when it would result in stumbling (1 Cor 8)

3. The Rabbinic principle of Pikuach Nefesh (appealed to by Jesus at Mat 12:11) dictates that the Law be superseded if it would result in loss of life

There have been no counter responses. Only approval, however I don't think many active JW's post in this group, it seems to be mostly ex-jw christians and apologetics from what I have seen lately. I keep commenting on it that I'm open to honest opposition to the statements, noone responds.