Why doesn't the watchtower just open their own university? Every reputable religions has already done so. This way they still have a chance at keeping those youngsters that wanna go, AND they can make tons of money in the process.
little_Socrates
JoinedPosts by little_Socrates
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JW going to prestigious university
by ivanatahan ini've been debating this, and my mother (the spiritual head of my family, she even controls my father spiritually, who is an elder) doesn't seem to be starkly against me going to a prestigious university.
in fact, i've been going over my chances, and i'd say i have a pretty decent chance of going to my dream university, oxford university, to study philosophy, politics, and economics.
naturally i wouldn't tell my mother about me wanting to take the three most hated subjects of jws at a university that would bring me into bad relations with "spiritually sound jws".. do you guys know any ex-jw or knowledgeable jw who knows ttatt that went to a randall group or ivy league school?
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102
A couple questions for atheists on Suffering
by little_Socrates inwho told you that the world should be free from suffering?.
do you find any value in suffering?.
do you think it is possible to experience all the beauty and goodness and pleasure the world offers without also experiencing the bad?
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little_Socrates
A child being Kidnapped raped and murdered....
In and of itself that is a pretty horrible event. However when taken as a whole with the whole human condition it doesn't make the world an evil place.
Cofty I am not here to prove God. As absurd as the question is I want to know, for an atheist, what makes suffering evil?
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A couple questions for atheists on Suffering
by little_Socrates inwho told you that the world should be free from suffering?.
do you find any value in suffering?.
do you think it is possible to experience all the beauty and goodness and pleasure the world offers without also experiencing the bad?
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little_Socrates
alert - Retreat into deism imminent!
LOL I admit it is very difficult not to use Christian based arguments but I am trying as hard as I can.
So address the hard question.
My comment about "except for Tsunami" was only in reference to the comment "know you are alive"
You didn't answer my question on this though.... What makes those 250k deaths any more evil than any other death?
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A couple questions for atheists on Suffering
by little_Socrates inwho told you that the world should be free from suffering?.
do you find any value in suffering?.
do you think it is possible to experience all the beauty and goodness and pleasure the world offers without also experiencing the bad?
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little_Socrates
Just how suffering in the gym makes us physically healthier.... Suffering in the world helps us grow roots and be stronger of soul. It gives us depth to our human experience. It keeps us connected to all other living creatures and lets us know we are alive (except for your Tsunami example).
The Atheists argument is... the world does not appear as though it has been created by a loving God so therefore no God.
I want to know what would the world would look like if there was a loving God in charge? What qualities should we look for?
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A couple questions for atheists on Suffering
by little_Socrates inwho told you that the world should be free from suffering?.
do you find any value in suffering?.
do you think it is possible to experience all the beauty and goodness and pleasure the world offers without also experiencing the bad?
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little_Socrates
Morpheus I never said that and I never meant to infer that.
My point was while the entire human experience is beautiful I feel that atheists are a bit to focused on the suffering aspect of it. The suffering does not negate all the good. And I would say in light of how good the world can be... if we also have to experience some suffering it is not evil.
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102
A couple questions for atheists on Suffering
by little_Socrates inwho told you that the world should be free from suffering?.
do you find any value in suffering?.
do you think it is possible to experience all the beauty and goodness and pleasure the world offers without also experiencing the bad?
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little_Socrates
Morpheus... when atheists say "Why does God allow suffering" how do they define it? That is the definition I want to work towards. -
102
A couple questions for atheists on Suffering
by little_Socrates inwho told you that the world should be free from suffering?.
do you find any value in suffering?.
do you think it is possible to experience all the beauty and goodness and pleasure the world offers without also experiencing the bad?
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little_Socrates
The entire human experience is beautiful. Yes I know many things can be unpleasant but they just fall on that continuum will all the great things we can experience.
My point about the victims you mentioned... even though they died tragically, it doesn't negate all the great things they experienced in life. The goodness of living is so much greater than the badness of some suffering we may face.
What makes their deaths any more evil than any other one?
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102
A couple questions for atheists on Suffering
by little_Socrates inwho told you that the world should be free from suffering?.
do you find any value in suffering?.
do you think it is possible to experience all the beauty and goodness and pleasure the world offers without also experiencing the bad?
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little_Socrates
I see you ignored the content of my reply.
Not really... but let me put it a different way. You are coming with a preconceived notion that suffering is evil. I don't accept that. I want you to prove it.
So If you could have given the victims of the tsunami a chance as the wave was hitting to have never been born so that they wouldn't have had to experience that horrible death... do think they would have chosen to have not existed? Didn't at least the vast majority of the victims over the course of their life's experience much greater joy/love/fulfillment/pleasure than they did evil on that day? We all have to die what makes it evil how they died?
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102
A couple questions for atheists on Suffering
by little_Socrates inwho told you that the world should be free from suffering?.
do you find any value in suffering?.
do you think it is possible to experience all the beauty and goodness and pleasure the world offers without also experiencing the bad?
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little_Socrates
I am just trying to understand the atheist argument on suffering. It seems they like to hammer on certain preconceived ideas that theists bring to the table. I am just trying to turn it around and see if I can get atheists to defend and explain their positions. Usually theists are the ones that always have to defend themselves :)
Cofty as an atheist do you find any value in suffering? If you could arrange your life to avoid all suffering would you? Now I understand suffering that we may willing let into our life's isn't to the severity you guys are probably talking about, but it is more a question of severity than type.
If some suffering is useful and valuable, where do you draw the line to what is just pure evil?
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102
A couple questions for atheists on Suffering
by little_Socrates inwho told you that the world should be free from suffering?.
do you find any value in suffering?.
do you think it is possible to experience all the beauty and goodness and pleasure the world offers without also experiencing the bad?
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little_Socrates
Who told you that the world should be free from suffering?
Do you find any value in suffering?
Do you think it is possible to experience all the beauty and goodness and pleasure the world offers without also experiencing the bad? Isn't good only good because we know what bad is? If there was only good would it really be "good"?
If you where God and could eliminate suffering what would the world look like? Or conversely if there was a loving God what should we expect the world to look like?