Viviane

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Posts by Viviane

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  26

  Jesus as a Ransom for Humans or not

  by fulltimestudent in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  i have not got an answer (theoretical or not) to the above question.. but the main text book (introducing the new testament- its literature and theology - achtemeier, green and thompson) for my study unit (early christian literature and thought) in the assigned reading for today's lecture on the gospel of john, has a section on the ransom.

  it says (p. 237): one of the few passages that explicitly speaks of jesus dying for others is mark 10:45:.

  "for even the son of man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.. .

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  Viviane

  But we have 2 witnesses of the fact he is true.

  Who, specifically?
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  2596

  The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

  we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

  they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

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  Viviane

  Again, you may not agree or like that view BUT you can't say it isn't a valid one because it is

  It's not valid. I said it. Clearly I CAN say it. How does completely misunderstanding how something works or etymology bolster your point that God/love/suffering/death is ultimately a good thing? Just say what you mean, specifically, in as few points as possible.
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  29

  Jack The Ripper Unmasked?

  by metatron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2746321/jack-ripper-unmasked-how-amateur-sleuth-used-dna-breakthrough-identify-britains-notorious-criminal-126-years-string-terrible-murders.html.

  to be accepted as fact, these claims will have to be replicated.

  metatron.

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  Viviane

  they did mention how it was extracted and that mitochondrial dNA from descendants of both parties was used to compare.

  They did. mDNA alone could never point to a male ancestor, though. And they told us nothing about the quality of the samples. Giant holes in the story.

  It's a long time later-proving it is kind of a intellectual game in any case, but they actually did make a fairly good surface case for it.

  What, specifically, did you find compelling?
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  29

  Jack The Ripper Unmasked?

  by metatron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2746321/jack-ripper-unmasked-how-amateur-sleuth-used-dna-breakthrough-identify-britains-notorious-criminal-126-years-string-terrible-murders.html.

  to be accepted as fact, these claims will have to be replicated.

  metatron.

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  Viviane

  Don't you worry, if there's holes in their story, they will be shot down by their peers, people that are eminently qualified for the job. Oh yes, let's not be gullible, but let's not be paranoid either.

  Why in the world do you think I would be worried? What an odd and silly thing to say. I'm not even sure where the concept of paranoia would enter the conversation. It's as if you're just throwing anything against the wall to see if anything sticks that might either prop up your support of the story or undermine my evidence based position. The down side in that you need to use words and concepts relevant and appropriate to the conversation.

  Paranoia...at least you used a concept so ridiculous it made me laugh.
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  29

  Jack The Ripper Unmasked?

  by metatron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2746321/jack-ripper-unmasked-how-amateur-sleuth-used-dna-breakthrough-identify-britains-notorious-criminal-126-years-string-terrible-murders.html.

  to be accepted as fact, these claims will have to be replicated.

  metatron.

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  Viviane

  Why does skepticism and critical thinking make people so grumpy? When did gullibility become a virtue?
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  29

  Jack The Ripper Unmasked?

  by metatron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2746321/jack-ripper-unmasked-how-amateur-sleuth-used-dna-breakthrough-identify-britains-notorious-criminal-126-years-string-terrible-murders.html.

  to be accepted as fact, these claims will have to be replicated.

  metatron.

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  Viviane

  The work on the DNA proved the provenance of the shawl. Or do you think it is a coincidence that the blood of the last victim and DNA of Kosminski are found on the same garment?

  I think they claimed that. mDNA can't tell the whole story and that's all they mentioned. I question, because they didn't say, what the quality of the samples were. They have no way of knowing the history of the shawl. They don't mentioned how or when or who they collected "family" samples were. What do they mean by "identical match"? In the world of DNA, unless you have two perfect samples from the same person, there is no such thing as an "identical" match, so what exactly do they mean? Identical mDNA ONLY means that at some point in the past two people shared a common ancestor (see Mitchochondrial Eve, the common ancestor of every living human). Too many unanswered questions.

  Right now it's unclear what they mean, what's coincidence, what's good work, etc..

  And do you really think that Drs. David Miller and Jari Louhelainen will put their professional reputations at risk so that Mr. Edwards can sell his book? Really!

  People do it all the time. Google scholar shows no public works, no major citations, nothing notable in his career at all. His work isn't peer reviwed and he hasn't disclosed any details regarding his samples, his methodology or anything. Other than this, he really has no reputation.

  But, as trusting as you are, I have some oceanfront property in Iowa to sell you. It's got water and sand, totes legit. You interested?
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  29

  Jack The Ripper Unmasked?

  by metatron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2746321/jack-ripper-unmasked-how-amateur-sleuth-used-dna-breakthrough-identify-britains-notorious-criminal-126-years-string-terrible-murders.html.

  to be accepted as fact, these claims will have to be replicated.

  metatron.

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  Viviane

  This thread has absolutely nothing to do with my beliefs.

  It did until you got questions you didn't like.

  Then he goes on to describe how they were successful in utilizing mitochondrial DNA in their identification. Quite impressive, if you ask me.

  Yes, it is impressive, the amount of leaps of logic, perfect coincidences and ability to see what no one else could, all in a shawl that has absolutely nothing except a myth to back up it's history.

  Also, mDNA alone could NEVER point to the man they claim.

  This is why it goes right and directly to your beliefs. This is so lacking in evidence as to be equivalient to someone claiming to sell you the brooklyn bridge and thinking "Huh... seems legit."
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  29

  Jack The Ripper Unmasked?

  by metatron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2746321/jack-ripper-unmasked-how-amateur-sleuth-used-dna-breakthrough-identify-britains-notorious-criminal-126-years-string-terrible-murders.html.

  to be accepted as fact, these claims will have to be replicated.

  metatron.

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  Viviane

  Unless they were lying intentionally, the DNA work done was what seemed to me to be the best evidence for a culprit so far.

  There are a host of possibilities besides outright lying as to why this should be suspect.

  They were all circumstantial, this is too, but it has the added weight of DNA that no one else yet has.

  It *may* have the added weight of DNA.
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  29

  Jack The Ripper Unmasked?

  by metatron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2746321/jack-ripper-unmasked-how-amateur-sleuth-used-dna-breakthrough-identify-britains-notorious-criminal-126-years-string-terrible-murders.html.

  to be accepted as fact, these claims will have to be replicated.

  metatron.

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  Viviane

  Why are you attempting to divert attention from your lack of ability to answer questions about your beliefs?
• 
  29

  Jack The Ripper Unmasked?

  by metatron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2746321/jack-ripper-unmasked-how-amateur-sleuth-used-dna-breakthrough-identify-britains-notorious-criminal-126-years-string-terrible-murders.html.

  to be accepted as fact, these claims will have to be replicated.

  metatron.

  1. 
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  Viviane

  If someone predicted the date of the end of the world, wait until the date given, and then decide whether it is conclusively legitimate. If nothing materializes (or dematerializes) it is inconclusively illegitimate. Not a difficult concept to grasp.

  You've managed to completely miss the point. Apparently it was more difficult than you thought.

  But I think we are digressing from the thread, but you seem to like that.

  We're discussing why you would consider something with such sketchy details legitimate. You've not been able to answer that, so I'm attempting to use analagous examples to help move the conversation along and gain a better understanding of how you evaluate evidence.

  Of all the books I've read, and documentaries I've watched, dealing with the subject, this is the best explanation yet.

  Why, with such looming questions about the legitimacy, the evidence and the methods?

  I also believe it was quite brilliantly done.

  Again, why, with such looming questions about the legitimacy, the evidence and the methods?

  This remains my personal view, whether you like it or not.

  I don't like it or not like it. I'm far more interested in why someone would form that opinion given the complete lack of reason to do so from an evidence standpoint.