Viviane

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Posts by Viviane

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  2596

  The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

  we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

  they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

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  Viviane

  Gladiator, GIS for Teutonic plates:

  
• 
  2596

  The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

  we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

  they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Viviane

  It IS the antonym for omnipotent, flamegrilled. Sorry, I was messing with you a bit, I thought you realized that and were messing back with me. Ooops.

  From www.thesaurus.com:

  Antonyms for omnipotent
  
  impotent
  weak
  
  Roget's 21st Century Thesaurus, Third Edition Copyright © 2013 by the Philip Lief Group.

  And I already showed you where tyou wrote that God is possibly impotent, you just don't want to call a spade a space.
• 
  2596

  The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

  we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

  they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
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  Viviane

  You did say it, just like you are making the "it's a mystery" argument. Both times you are describing something perfectly and then refusing to admit what you are describing.

  As far as saying Cofty doesn't understand logic, that's funny coming from a person that thought people were using impotent as an antonym for omnipotent.
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  2596

  The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

  we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

  they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Viviane

  Since when is the definition of impotent "a being who is not omnipotent"?

  It's not. I used it to mean what it means, not the opposite of omnipotent.

  Viviane - please point to where I described either God's ignorance, or His impotence.

  Yes. You are assuming that all other variables that we observe are exactly what God (if he exists) intended. If God lacks te power to make happen what he wants to, then he is impotent.

  An assertion which you have no possible way to support.

  There are millions of years of geologic evidence to support Cofty's position, predating the "fall of man", so even the "cursed is the ground" thing doesn't work here.

  Ooops, I just learned something from Adamah's link.
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  2596

  The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

  we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

  they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Viviane

  In that case, flamegrilled, you are describing an ignorant and impotent God, not the one described in the Bible and worshipped by Christians. Who is this god you're describing?
• 
  2596

  The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

  we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

  they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Viviane

  If you weren't saying some people here couldn't understand logic and concept, then I apologize. That's how I read the sentence.

  I agree that Cofty's example of a dog being being doesn't jive with your analogy. God is, at best, guilty of criminal negligence. However, for people who are beleivers in the God of the Bible, who is omniscient and all-powerful, how is it NOT a problem?

  And impotent was the right word in the way he used it. The reason it's even being discussed is that would NOT be the God of the Bible, the one Christians worship, if he is NOT all powerful, if he is impotent. That's changing God into something other than what he is desribed as, into a different God.
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  9

  Something I Never Understood: Inactive or Disfellowshipped People Shunning Others That Were Disfellowshipped!

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i don't know if you experienced this before, but i was always wondering why inactive or df'd jws look down upon others, even not acknowledging their fellow sinners.. any thoughts??

  ?.

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  Viviane

  The elders tell them not to associate with other DFed people.
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  2596

  The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

  we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

  they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Viviane

  Sorry for the cut-n-paste, but, from wikipedia on criminal negligence...:

  To constitute a crime, there must be an actus reus (Latin for "guilty act") accompanied by the mens rea (see concurrence). Negligence shows the least level of culpability, intention being the most serious and recklessness of intermediate seriousness, overlapping with gross negligence. The distinction between recklessness and criminal negligence lies in the presence or absence of foresight as to the prohibited consequences. Recklessness is usually described as a 'malfeasance' where the defendant knowingly exposes another to the risk of injury. The fault lies in being willing to run the risk. But criminal negligence is a 'misfeasance or 'nonfeasance' (see omission), where the fault lies in the failure to foresee and so allow otherwise avoidable dangers to manifest. In some cases this failure can rise to the level of willful blindness where the individual intentionally avoids adverting to the reality of a situation. (In the United States, there may sometimes be a slightly different interpretation for willful blindness.) The degree of culpability is determined by applying a reasonable person standard. Criminal negligence becomes "gross" when the failure to foresee involves a "wanton disregard for human life" (see the discussion in corporate manslaughter).

  The test of any mens rea element is always based on an assessment of whether the accused had foresight of the prohibited consequences and desired to cause those consequences to occur. The three types of test are:

  1. subjective where the court attempts to establish what the accused was actually thinking at the time the actus reus was caused;
  2. objective where the court imputes mens rea elements on the basis that a reasonable person with the same general knowledge and abilities as the accused would have had those elements; or
  3. hybrid, i.e., the test is both subjective and objective.

  The most culpable mens rea elements will have both foresight and desire on a subjective basis. Negligence arises when, on a subjective test, an accused has not actually foreseen the potentially adverse consequences to the planned actions, and has gone ahead, exposing a particular individual or unknown victim to the risk of suffering injury or loss. The accused is a social danger because he or she has endangered the safety of others in circumstances where the reasonable person would have foreseen the injury and taken preventive measures. Hence, the test is hybrid.
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  2596

  The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

  we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

  they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Viviane

  Flamegrilled, it's not just that you say facts we don't know about why God let it happen might exist, it's that you also said they were ungraspable by humans. Even if they did exist, they would be incomprehensible and useless and couldn't possibly factor into any decision. They could also be facts that show why God could be a worse monster than he already seems to be. That's just as likely if those incomprehensible facts exist.

  The short version, it's a mystery.
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  2596

  The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

  by cofty in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

  we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

  they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Viviane

  Flamegrilled, if you're going to call other people stupid, you should make sure your sentence doing that isn't written incorrectly.