Posts by Viviane

21

Constructive hobbies

by zeb in

hm have a hobby?

im not asking what.. hm have taken up a constructive hobby since leaving?.

hi people, may i firstly thank those who have responded to to my intro article, i am replying to you all as a new topic because the direct messaging is not working for me at the moment so i can clarify my perspective on bible study.

yes there are many arguments that are put forward to demonstrate for example that the bible has been composed of numerous preexisting creation story's ect, my focus is to give the bible the same opportunity to defend itself as anyone reasonably expects if charged with some crime they are not guilty of.. i find for example the account of jesus response when questioned about the divorce certificate 'but it was not so in the beginning' confirms that moses allowed changes to be made to the original, that said consider also the religious traditions moses people had been exposed to, the story of the god enki who seduced even his own grandchildren and the well known incest of the egyptian royalty, given the genetic cost, are such practices any more right now than they were then?

communities that practice close relative marriages today are well documented for there higher risk of numerous health problems so how would you find moses on that basis, guilty or not guilty as jesus did because he understood why moses took the creation story's of other cultures and gave his people there own creation story that taught them to avoid the general pagan practice of incest.before looking any deeper at moses creation story may i also ask the question why does jesus knowing that god promised he would never again destroy the world by a flood as he did in noah's day say 'as in the days of noah ..the flood came and took them all away' so what did jesus actually mean mt 24:.

Viviane

From their own writings you can precisely document that the same doctrine was faithfully transmitted to their descendants in the first few centuries.

Those disciples argued over what was and was not heresy and, much of what they originally believed would later come to be heresy. Pretending that the early Christians were unified under an umbrella of singular beliefs is fantasy of the highest order.

Even today, with original documents, message changing happens, every day all the time.

42

Please Focus on the Bible

by terrypike in

hi people, may i firstly thank those who have responded to to my intro article, i am replying to you all as a new topic because the direct messaging is not working for me at the moment so i can clarify my perspective on bible study.

yes there are many arguments that are put forward to demonstrate for example that the bible has been composed of numerous preexisting creation story's ect, my focus is to give the bible the same opportunity to defend itself as anyone reasonably expects if charged with some crime they are not guilty of.. i find for example the account of jesus response when questioned about the divorce certificate 'but it was not so in the beginning' confirms that moses allowed changes to be made to the original, that said consider also the religious traditions moses people had been exposed to, the story of the god enki who seduced even his own grandchildren and the well known incest of the egyptian royalty, given the genetic cost, are such practices any more right now than they were then?

communities that practice close relative marriages today are well documented for there higher risk of numerous health problems so how would you find moses on that basis, guilty or not guilty as jesus did because he understood why moses took the creation story's of other cultures and gave his people there own creation story that taught them to avoid the general pagan practice of incest.before looking any deeper at moses creation story may i also ask the question why does jesus knowing that god promised he would never again destroy the world by a flood as he did in noah's day say 'as in the days of noah ..the flood came and took them all away' so what did jesus actually mean mt 24:.

Viviane

Germany now has a powerful voice in Europe once again and has obtained the documented evidence that could argue a step change in Islamic understanding of the Koran at a time when Muslim leaders are not best pleased with the extremes of there religion.

There's about as a much of a chance of that as there is Christians admitting their holy book is full of contradictions and nonsense.

Both are factually true, but it doesn't matter because these people don't value facts and logic.

42

Please Focus on the Bible

by terrypike in

hi people, may i firstly thank those who have responded to to my intro article, i am replying to you all as a new topic because the direct messaging is not working for me at the moment so i can clarify my perspective on bible study.

yes there are many arguments that are put forward to demonstrate for example that the bible has been composed of numerous preexisting creation story's ect, my focus is to give the bible the same opportunity to defend itself as anyone reasonably expects if charged with some crime they are not guilty of.. i find for example the account of jesus response when questioned about the divorce certificate 'but it was not so in the beginning' confirms that moses allowed changes to be made to the original, that said consider also the religious traditions moses people had been exposed to, the story of the god enki who seduced even his own grandchildren and the well known incest of the egyptian royalty, given the genetic cost, are such practices any more right now than they were then?

communities that practice close relative marriages today are well documented for there higher risk of numerous health problems so how would you find moses on that basis, guilty or not guilty as jesus did because he understood why moses took the creation story's of other cultures and gave his people there own creation story that taught them to avoid the general pagan practice of incest.before looking any deeper at moses creation story may i also ask the question why does jesus knowing that god promised he would never again destroy the world by a flood as he did in noah's day say 'as in the days of noah ..the flood came and took them all away' so what did jesus actually mean mt 24:.

Viviane

It is not our culture that is at stake here but our souls: are there not good and not so good souls in every culture

What is a soul? What is it made of? Where is it located in the body?

88

First law of thermodynamics vs God vs Big Bang

by EndofMysteries in

first law of thermodynamics, that energy cannot be created or destroyed but changed from one form to another.

how does that fit in with god and the big bang to you?

does it make one make more sense then the other to you?

Viviane

I think that "all the evidence points to" that I have finally made my point to you on that.
That is all that I mean by that.

I've no idea what your point is, so, no... not really...

18

How to get my kids out

by SaneAgain in

i've been disfellowshipped for about 5 years and extremely happy to be out.

my ex wife is still a regular meeting attender and takes our two young kids with her (8 and 6 years old).

i recently saw some of the caleb and sophia videos on the jw.org website and was completely appalled, i remember what i was taught as a kid growing up in the organization but this seems so much worse and now that i'm out i can plainly see the mind control.

Viviane

I want to emphasize what everyone said about critical thinking skills and being a good parent. I have been DFed for about 5 years, my children are teenager and almost teenager. I focused at first on being a good parent. When they were worried that I was going to die at Armageddon I simply said "I'm not going anywhere for now, let's deal with that when Armageddon comes."

I took them to movies, made sure that at least on either Saturday or Sunday morning, instead of service and meetings, we went out for a pancake breakfast or to the park or on a hike, something fun but always wasn't "bad" in the JW eyes.

I also let them watch a few things they couldn't in their father's JW house, letting them know I had no problem with it and when they are at my house, I have my rules and their father has his BUT that doesn't mean they run wild and do whatever they want.

I also taught them critical thinking, a love of science and learning and how to play the "what is more likely" game. We used critical thinking figure out why other religions are crackpots and slowly applied that to Bible in general. Once we were at that point, the bottom fell out for any hope their father had of them being JWs.

They've seen LoTR, The Hobbit, Nightmare Before Christmas, The Walking Dead, have had and been to birthday parties, etc.

Remove the fear JWs instill and replace it with love and knowledge.

25

Leave truth - catch AIDS???

by JEMIMAH in

jw
friends

we had a laugh last weekend at our s.a.dthe visiting speaker was from the london bethel (bcm)during the last talk he was trying to encourage the bros not to read non society lit.

the example he uses was of a m/s bro who used to really study his wtwell for a sunday, however he occasionally used secular sources to back up his research.. our bethel speaker in order to prove how wrong this was explained very quickly that because of this secular research, "this brother fell away and caught aids".

the brothers and sisters in the audience where very shocked at the folly of our ex-brother.

Viviane

I heard the AIDS story in the 80s from a CO, heard the angel story, Sister Payne, etc..

Also heard one about a pioneer couple who had no food but, instead of deciding to work for money that day, decided to go out in service. On their way home they saw a grocery sack that had fallen out of a truck or car with meat, vegetable, bread, etc! Praise Jah!

15

Sketches of Revelation, this and that

by TerryWalstrom in

i've been rummaging around on bart ehrman's blog and such and managed to distill six cogent views about.

the book of revelation, i thought i share for whatever it is worth.

1. parts of the book of revelation could scarcely be explained if it were written by jesus own disciple, john.

Viviane

I particularly like the idea that the text cannot mean to us what it could not have meant to them. I often, when they insist on trying to tell me I am going to hell, challenge them to tell me which Bible prophecy specifically came true. I have done that on the forum and, when they constantly mention the UN, Obama, WWII, etc., I point out that is THEM saying it means that, the "prophecy" doesn't say anything of the sort. When they mention Jerusalem being destroyed, I mention that the Bible doesn't say when or by whom, they are adding that, all the "prophecy" is doing is saying that something that happened before would happen again DURING a time a rebellion was going on (assuming it was written prior to the events described, which there is no proof for).

Bart Earhman is fantastic.

18

Greatest Proof for evolution!

by abiather in

2014 was the worst year ever for terrorism: u.s. intel chief (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/wrost-year-global-terrorism-2014-article-1.2130490).

terror attacks reached their highest number in 2014 since 45 years of its history.

in the first nine months of 2014, there were 13,000 terror acts that killed some 31,000 people!

Viviane

Google doesn't say 160 years x 31 is not 4960 years [When common sense can answer this, why turn into google?]
I would always prefer to live in a time-period when water and air are not polluted.

Abiather, stay focused. What are Delta waves, how do they facilitate communicating with god, how does turning off your mind help with this? How does turning off your senses help? What is the method of communication?

Difficult questions you must answer if you expect to be taken seriously.

88

First law of thermodynamics vs God vs Big Bang

by EndofMysteries in

first law of thermodynamics, that energy cannot be created or destroyed but changed from one form to another.

how does that fit in with god and the big bang to you?

does it make one make more sense then the other to you?

Viviane

I think that I have shown, that only an author actually knows what he means.

No one is arguing that. It is simply that it's up to the author to convey that using words with commonly accepted definitions and, where no, clearly state what you mean, otherwise you are causing and inviting confusion. If you choose not to clearly state what you mean and decide to attempt to re-define words with no good reason, you will, of course, be challenged on it.