Seminary education

Justin

As has been demonstrated on this forum, the only two positions regarding religion which are logically consistent are fundamentalism and unbelief (whether of the atheist or agnostic variety). An in-between position, though some of us would like to hold it, is not logically persuasive. Yet, that is exactly the situation which is produced in mainline (or "liberal") seminaries today. After being exposed to the Biblical texts as being the results of various sources and historically conditioned, students are still expected to be ordained and pastor churches. My question is, What are they told which would still enable them to have any faith? Why does such seminary education not lead to total unbelief, rather than to a lifetime of service in a church?

under74

Why do you make it black and white? I'm not a believer but I think the people in the middle (liberal believers) are fine and much easier to talk to than fundies and even stonch atheists. I just think there's an in between....and I tend to think that although it may not be not logical for me it may be logical for others. Don't get me wrong....I said it's not logical for me but I just can't see all as being "either--or."

Billygoat

Justin,

That's a pretty sweeping judgement you're making, dontcha think? I'm a Christian as are other members of this board. We aren't fundies and we DO believe. There are greys in between the black and white.

Andi

Sad emo

Although not in a seminary, I am studying for a theology degree so I encounter most of what is being taught there.

I have found my beliefs seriously challenged at times, and in some cases had to re-evaluate, but I think that the important thing is that the majority (hopefullly) go into seminaries with a sincere desire to serve God ie they feel called, and they have a solid foundation of what they believe - so in seminary, it's only their interpretation of of those core beliefs which alters, NOT the beliefs themselves. (Hope that makes sense!)

That said, one of my friends went to train for the RC priesthood and quit seminary after 2 years, he had become an atheist, so it does happen sometimes!

googlemagoogle

i think you talk about the belief that the bible is god's word, not the "christian belief" (whatever that is... people stretch and bow that term...).

there are different beliefs about the bible, some of them listed here:

- every word in the bible was dictated by god
- the bible's spirit reflects god's spirit
- some parts of the bible are inspired
- none of the bible is inspired
- everything in the bible has to be taken literally
- some parts of the bible are using symbolic language
- ...

if someone doesn't take parts of the bible literally anymore, he's on subjective territory. because there's no indication in the bible as to what is literal and what's symbol.

however, many people won't object to that, because faith's subjective anyway.

and you don't need the bible to be a xian. or so i was told.

Justin

Notice, what I said was that fundamentalism and skepticism are the only logical alternatives. I myself am in the middle, an in-between Christian, but I cannot defend my position logically. That being said, seminary students are exposed to much of the same information that has led others to become atheists. There are some who, after being exposed to this "deconstruction" as they call it, seem to go out on the spiritual supermarket on their own to reinforce a floundering faith. There are ordained people with so-called New Age beliefs, students in the "Course in Miracles" (if you know what that is), people walking labyrinths to have mystical experiences.

I recently learned of Charles Templeton who died in 2001 at the age of 85, and was an early associate of Billy Graham who decided to attend Princeton Theological Seminary and then lost his faith. His last book was entitled Farewell to God.

So don't get me wrong. Either extreme - fundamentalism or atheism - are unthinkable for me personally. But the seminaries are supposed to be turning out a product - ordained ministers and priests. I wonder what they do to support faith rather than tear it down.

Billygoat

But the seminaries are supposed to be turning out a product - ordained ministers and priests.

Justin,

Just curious...what makes you think this? I have a few friends that have and are going to seminary for their spiritual education and edification - no plans to take it further in terms of a formal ministry.

Andi

Justin

That a few individuals might attend a seminary with no plans to be ordained does not change the main purpose of the seminary.

googlemagoogle

i'd actually agree with you (made my way from JW fundy to liberal christian to skeptic to agnostic to atheist) but i know ross would come up with some weird questions.

Narkissos

I attended a theological college after leaving the WT. Most students there were trained to be pastors.

It was an Evangelical college so the impact on their beliefs was minimal -- although painful sometimes (especially for "arminians"). Only a few drifted to "liberal" theology and became ministers in pluralistic churches.

My own path would appear to confirm Justin's view: I'm now an odd sort of "religious atheist". Only I would hold that not believing in "God" anymore doesn't exactly amount to having lost "faith". Actually I feel pretty close to some "liberal believers".

Another factor imo is the response of the church(es). How willing they are to confront the religious inheritance with the new paradigms of modern (or postmodern) epistemology and modify the expression of faith to make it believable or thinkable to the living. Do they expect a 21st-century preacher to preach exactly what was preached in the 19th century?

I found that once again there is a "window of communication" where you can challenge the tradition and help modify it. Before you reach that window you just repeat the creed, when you're past it you just oppose it and in both cases you are useless to the congregation. A liberal pastor has to stay between those limits, and not everybody can do that (I suspect I can't).

It reminds me that Bonhoeffer once pondered about the possibility of one being an atheist pastor. He said it was quite possible in principle but difficult: s/he would have to control his/her expression permanently.

Seminary education

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